You may recall an article in OhMyNews in spring of last year bemoaning a group of ill-mannered barbarians who were sitting on the subway floor, drinking and playing cards.
In it, writer Han Jeong-hyeon asks, would the passengers have just stood there if the louts had been Korean?
Well, I guess this is the answer:
The Kookmin Ilbo reports that a blogger posted to his blog photos of a bunch of hikers sitting in the middle of the subway as he was coming back to Seoul on the Seoul—Chuncheon line yesterday.
They were even blocking the entrances to the subway car.
The blogger wrote he was shamed to be a Korean like them, and expressed concern about what foreign tourists, of which there are many on the Seoul—Chuncheon line, might think if they saw it.
The photos spread quickly at a famous online community. Most netizens expressed exasperation with the poor diplay of public manners, although some—a minority, to be sure—called for understanding, noting that unlike most trains, the Seoul—Chuncheon line has a certain something that does make the heart go aflutter.
OK, laugh if you like, but I actually get that, even though I thought it was much more romantic when it was a conventional train. Such is progress, I guess.
KORAIL said incidents like this appear to happen relatively frequently on the Seoul—Chuncheon line as it tends to have a lot of travellers and old folk. He said if you report in-car drinking and noise, a station employee will deal with it, but a spirit of observing public manners on the subway was urgently needed.
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I’ve gotten hammered with adjosshis on trains and buses, why not subway cars…you can start your swaying early and be full of the Frog by the time you get to your destination, thereby obviating the need to do something really stupid. I mean, they’re already out to drink me under the table, so why not let ‘em?
Still, I gotta say, Korea’s changed, and I’m glad to see a positive foreign influence amongst the minjok.
“expressed concern about what foreign tourists, of which there are many on the Seoul—Chuncheon line, might think if they saw it.”
Good for them.
PS, speaking of foreign tourists, I was taking my parents through a station in Busan at about 8PM on a Friday when we got behind a staggering drunk in a business suit wearing one dress shoe and one slipper. My parents were wondering how that happened so I explained that leaving the restaurant after the company dinner he must have put on one of the restaurant slippers instead of his other shoe. “I wonder when he’ll realise what he did?” my mother asked. “Probably Sunday morning when it’s time to go to church” I replied.
…when he gets up to pulpit to start preaching?
This is yet another “cool thing about Korea” being bashed as a “terrible thing about Korea”. When it’s illegal to drink outside, smoke inside, or buy alcohol after a certain time at night, you’ll all fondly remember things like this and miss them.
Relevant blast from the past:
Here’s a fun game. Guess who XXXXXX is?
Hint: He refers to himself in the third person often.
A google search gives me…theKorean!
I will say this, though: I think older locals should be afforded a little more leniency in these sort of situations than young foreigners. I don’t have a problem with the old folk in the above picture, but the young waeguks probably would have annoyed me a little.
A better comparison would be a photo of a bunch of young Koreans doing this on a western subway, which I don’t think would ever happen.
I do understand the argument about the line. The chuncheon line is a completely different beast than the middle of Seoul.
I took the old train out to Chuncheon a couple years ago.
didn’t see anything like that on the real train.
but if they’re old and there are no seats, let them sit down. If they want to have a drink, fine
if they’re blocking the doors though, kick them out.
hoju_saram,
Your link shows thekorean guessing they were “American idiots who are stupid stupid stupid stupid and stupid some more.” As I remember thekorean would’ve lost his bet by stating those in the picture were probably “idiot Americans.” Does thekorean have roots in Jeollanamdo? Don’t suppose the Korean hikers could possibly be stupid idiots aye?
I agree they deserve a little more leeway than foreigners. But if I remember correctly (and a quick scan of the original thread seems to confirm it), a large part of the outrage from waegs and Koreans alike in the original case was just how socially unacceptable and how far outside the norm their behavior was. Clearly not the case if the KORAIL people and reality are to be believed.
In fact I’m not suggesting that this behavior from Koreans is a big deal and deserves coverage. It’s not. It’s just a minor annoyance. Just like the foreigner card game on the floor was also a minor annoyance that didn’t deserve any media coverage whatsoever. The only relevance of this “story” is proving how ludicrous and off-base the outrage was in the prior one.
Somebody must have some kind of an X-file where he stashed nuggets of things that were authoritatively set straight by The Korean (expert—expert in parentheses ’cause it’s superfluous, duh.)
Gotta admit though, seeing somebody challenging the authority always gives this rebellious one a thrill.
Minor annoyance indeed, apparently with a big but called the “outsiders’ handicap” going down with:
For some reason, a bunch of ajossis and ajummas doing this doesn’t bother me in nearly as much as when the foreigners did it. They seemed obnoxious. Maybe it’s ageism on my part, or just the feeling that you’re supposed to behave more politely if it’s someone else’s country.
Anyway, hope the relaxed attitude to public drinking continues in this country.
“The Korean” is a Korean chauvinist, a leftard, and a notoriously obtuse simpleton.
That being said, however, he’s hardly worse than most of the regular commenters at this blog.
@12
I’m guessing it’s probably ageism on your part. I’m also guessing that you probably look at a group of young foreigners and grumble, thinking them to be disrespectful and spoiled rotten punks, and that you look at a group of ajussis and ajummas as honest, hardworking, respectful, good people.
But those are just guesses.
There was a sunbae (a nice enough person) at my university who would refer to himself as in the third person to me (and I’m sure to the girls) as “oppa”.
i.e. 오빠가 할께. 오빠가 사 줄께 etc.
And there is a Korean expression for the taste of too much butter.
느끼하다.
That sounds toe-curlingly nauseous , to “these ear-waxen laden ears”.
These ajumma ajossis should just grow up.
I don’t mind people having a good time in public, young or old, Korean or not, but when they inconvenience other people, by blocking ways or drunken noisy antics then no.
Here is an idea. If people want to drink, they can rent one of those big buses with flashing lights and music to take them to and from the mountain … or, go to a god damn bar! Problem solved.
It doesn’t matter if it is foreigners or Koreans the subway is public transportation not a public watering hole. I love Korean culture as much as anyone….but there is a time a place for everything. The subway floor is not the place for this.
Someone needs to stitch half of one of these photos together with the one of the foreign barbarians. This could actually be a real “bonding” moment for Koreans and barbarians
I am glad to see this …. just because it balances things out. Actually, I agree with Silver Surfer in that seeing a bunch of elderly Koreans drinking on the subway doesn’t offend me as much as it did when it was a group of Westerners. But, I don’t think anyone should be allowed to drink on the subway – especially in a large group that is shown above.
As for the nostalgic memories of the Chuncheon Line – I do remember on more than a few occasions sharing a drink or two while sitting on the floor. It wasn’t like it is now – tickets (with seats) weren’t that easy to come by and it was very very common to have crowds of people standing in the aisles – especially on the pigeon trains. My friends (Koreans) and I would go to the very rear of the train and sit on the platform and drink – can’t do that any more.
Yes, I think a lot of things have changed and people have become too socially correct….it is shame.
I catch the Chuncheon train to work everyday, and it’s usually me with a bottle of soju hidden in my bag taking sips.
Korea is a great place where people are free to drink anywhere at any time, without being harassed by the authorities.
Shame on you, IHBB, for pointing out any historical commentary by that man that may be viewed in a disparaging context.You are usually a smart man, but these petty actions demonstrate that you’re either retarded or butthurt. Surely you are capable of more.
And, in case it’s not obvious, the blog editor ate my [/sarcasm] mark above.
Robert, besides the fact that OhMyNews isn’t what I would call the best example of journalist and student Han seems to be a stuffed shirt, I also think your attempt to link this story with the OMN story is weak. When I’m in a foreign country, I act MUCH differently than when I’m in Korea. You can put your feet up on the coffee table at home but would you do that in someone else’s living room? Those “non-Koreans” in the OMN story should have known better. The Koreans in the Kookmin Ilbo story, while behaving badly, at least aren’t acting this way in Canada. If they were, you’d have a good point.
#11 Jieun K,
Will a Robert quote from last May suffice? It appears Robert thought this rarely happened with Koreans “Perhaps. But then again, you often see groups of Koreans sitting around singing, drinking soju and playing cards on the floor of a Seoul subway?”
Given what KORAIL says the answer to your question is Yes. On the other hand I don’t think foreigners do it “often.”
# 20,
Ridiculous!
Did anyone call Emergency 911 on the Korean hikers like Han Jeong-hyeon did on the foreigners last May?
theKorean,
Is the Korean hikers picture worth 1000 words?
For those excusing the Koreans hikers(as opposed to the foreigners), is this the example you want “elderly” Koreans showing the Korean youth? Those that think so live in a discriminatory world. It’s time for you to “slap yourselves upside the head.” Next up, we designate cars for Koreans on the subway to separate the foreigners making it easier for authorities to watch and stop those foreigners from doing the same thing Koreans do.
#24 – it’s not another foreigners vs Koreans thing again. Look, what bothers the foreign community about Korea, also bothers Koreans. This kind of stuff looks terribly out of place, whether they’re done by foreigners or by Koreans. If you read Korean, read all the viral irate comments about them who are on national papers.
jkitchstk:
Trying to “challenge the authority”? Nah, best to be nice to Robert in his house.
Other than that, have a good one.
“#24 – it’s not another foreigners vs Koreans thing again. Look, what bothers the foreign community about Korea, also bothers Koreans. This kind of stuff looks terribly out of place, whether they’re done by foreigners or by Koreans. If you read Korean, read all the viral irate comments about them who are on national papers.”
If it looks so terribly out of place why does Korea Rail dismiss it as something that occurs regularly (and no one complains about). Seems to me like it is really only out of place when the media puts a spotlight on it. Otherwise it is business as usual.
Ah, my adoring fans…
Where’s the dismissal of this? The Korail offical says:
“He said if you report in-car drinking and noise, a station employee will deal with it, but a spirit of observing public manners on the subway was urgently needed.”
I remember when CMM and I cracked a few beers on a Subway. Koreans immediately asked us if we were English teachers.
Oh, the memories. :p
I remember, 9 years ago, riding this line back to Seoul from Chuncheon on a Sunday night after two days of hiking with group of foreign and Korean hikers. We were drinking and walking around a bit but never crossed the line into obnoxiousness. At one point an 아저씨 completely lost his shit and started screaming and complaining about the English language. His wife was super embarrassed and calmed him down.
Part of me likes the Korea that lets you drink everywhere and part of me wants Korea to enforce some social restraint.
“The blogger wrote [that] he was [a]shamed to be a Korean like them, and expressed concern about what foreign tourists, of which there are many on the Seoul-Chuncheon line, might think if they saw it.”
He should be ashamed. The drinkers should all be ashamed, too, for not inviting any foreigners to drink with them! What’s happening to the Korea I used to know . . .
Jeffery Hodges
* * *
Unless one is some sort of New Age, one-world, “citizen of the universe” hippie, there is a HUGE difference between what Koreans do in their own country, and what boorish, itinerant expats do in the countries they’ve temporarily infected. Chalk me up as thinking this story falls into the “none of your f*cking foreign ass business” category.
Let Koreans be Korean, and leave the missionary zeal to reform the natives back in the old country. IF this is a problem, then it’s a problem for Koreans get upset about…and to deal with.
In the meantime, I agree with JH…pass me a cold one!
DLB
I just envy the dude who had forethought enough to bring a stool. What a champ.
babotaengi,
yeah but he forgot to bring a portable gas stove and some samgyupsal. now that could’ve taken this party to a whole new level!
There actually appears to be three people sitting on stools.
The guy in the green jacket, the guy to his right in the yellow jacket and the grandmother to his left in the pink jacket.
I think the stools, paper cups and mokoli were planned well beforehand, making me also think that this was not the first time they have done this.
Double-deck high speed Chuncheon trains now – http://dok.do/5PV1nO
still without the safety glass wall to stop the drunken hikers from falling on to the tracks.
“He should be ashamed. The drinkers should all be ashamed, too, for not inviting any foreigners to drink with them! What’s happening to the Korea I used to know .”
If there were a foreign hiker standing nearby without anything to eat or drink I’m almost sure they would have invited him over and shared. Korean hikers are a very generous lot who always bring enough to share.
“KORAIL said incidents like this appear to happen relatively frequently on the Seoul—Chuncheon line as it tends to have a lot of travellers and old folk.”
In other words, effing kids who think that the garbage that is K-pop is where Korean culture begins and ends. Drinking is a very important part of socializing in Korean culture and as little as ten years ago there used to be very few restrictions on where it could take place. It used to be that you could buy beer at every movie theatres and having a beer outside (or in) a convenience store was great way to relax on a hot summer afternoon (and where young people would end up for a last round and a snack after bars closed at midnight). Effing kids from Seoul and their lack of cultural awareness.
#5,
Yes, I wholly agree. I miss the days when democracy was new in Korea, as the government hadn’t started passing laws which restrict personal freedom yet.
#18,
The time and the place is wherever you are when you are coming back from hiking. That’s the point you’re missing.
To add to #39…In those days, they were busy removing those laws from the books, not coming up with new ones.
Gaijin Gulag in a subway train of a civilized nation. What the…
“Still, I gotta say, Korea’s changed, and I’m glad to see a positive foreign influence amongst the minjok.” Agreed
At midnight the vomit stained aggressive ajosshi bothers me. During the middle of the day a group of slightly raucous but generally behaving hikers does not. Unfortunately bith of the come from the same tolerance of public drinking. Personally I don’t think where you drink makes so much of a difference but if you are behaving like a drunk infront of kids you should be kicked off the train.
Still it is things like this about Korea that make it so different from the over regulated culture here in Australia that I appreciate. (except fo traffic law and seat belt enforcement which I believe to be sheer common sense).
That said I have seen worse thatn the above here on the Wynnum line, with teenage kids chroming away what few brain cells they have and booking themselves a bed in a high care nursing home at the age of thirty.
I miss the times when the mountains in Korea were not an outdoor alternative to a Church service for massive ajussi ajumma socials and hook-ups.
On the higher social ladder level, these are 동문회, 친목도모회 (alumni society company/hobby group outings) type of groups and on a lower social ladder level, these are just hookups of old people with nothing better to do wanting to get drunk out in public and misbehave. It’s when they start doing it on trips to countries outside Korea that is also a big problem.
take your seat, be quiet and use a flask
The hikers must not have offered a drink to the cameraman.
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