Apple buying itself a seat at the Korean all-you-can-eat buffet

Back in January,  Steve Jobs said they were going to use some money from their insanely fat profit margins to make “strategic purchases“.  A lot of industry people assumed that Apple would go on an M&A buying spree.  However, what it really appears to mean is that Apple is going to pre-buy components (or offer fat deposits) to secure supply of NAND memory, processors, next generation LCD screens, etc.  Apple wants it.  It wants it bad, like a nasty coke habit.

According to the Korean Economic Daily (via the WSJ) Apple will spend $7.8 billion to secure components from Samsung alone.

So, it would appear that Apple is pretty much doubling down on its dependence on Korean parts suppliers.  However, dependence goes both ways.  Apple will likely be Samsung’s largest single customer.  ZDNet calls it an odd symbiotic relationship.  Samsung makes products that compete with Apple, but they are pretty much Apple’s single largest supplier.  I guess one can say that they are not enemies, but frenemies.

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  • Craash

    so its time to purchase shares in Samsung’s electronics/chip units?

  • Brendon Carr

    It’s already been priced in. This pre-payment practice of Apple’s surely ain’t new.

  • seouldout

    Appears Apples intends to take the fight to lower-priced rival smartphones. Will a mass-market mobile diminish the Apple cachet?

  • WangKon936


    That’s got to be worrisome for Nokia… and maybe LG… although I think LG has figured it out… at least more so than Nokia.

  • cm

    Speaking of Nokia, Chosun Ilbo had an editorial on Nokia on how they’ve fallen so low, being the victim of their own successes in their own innovation. While others quickly jumped on the Android platform to fight off Apple, Nokia stubbornly stuck to their own O/S, the Sambian. The editorial surmised Nokia must have known that the world was being divided into two camps, yet could not easily abandon decades of investment on their own O/S. The editorial ends with an interesting thought to ponder. It’s not always bad to become second best and keep following, rather then always complaining that you can’t lead through innovation. Innovation’s rewards are rich if you are successful, but you can also become trapped by it and fall in a much bigger way.

  • wjk, 검은 머리 외국인

    i don’t think it will sell. I think a lot of apps won’t work. itouch4 already has some compatibility issues with some iphone apps, even though it has a camera. Apps are everything for iphone/itouch. Otherwise no point in having one. Biting the battery bait is already giving in a lot. If they scale down the camera to crappy pixels, that will kill it. That’s what I think. Seems an awful lot like Blackberry’s Pearl approach. And what the hell is it with apple and constantly making the usb ports, clip exterior batteries, shell batteries, and battery chargers in the after market incompatible with the new products? This is dcking the consumer. That is all that is.

  • seouldout

    Wow, how was this shocker missed?

    The good news is that 84% of the customers are satisfied enough to not return them.

    Lemme help w/ shaking the pom-pons: “Go Team Sammy! Fighting the Victory! Our uninspired Me-Too products. Fast follower. For You. And You. And You! Da-bong!”

    BTW, weren’t these sort of phantom sales pretty common prior to the ’97 econ collapse? Lots o’ stuff being shipped to overseas closets.

  • cm

    Is it time to buy Samsung shares? You bet. Look at this breakdown of iPhone 4 components, about half the value of iPhone 4’s, $180 cost of components are from Samsung.

    Now add the new IPL technology display that Samsung will provide Apple, replacing LG’s IPS displays that LG used to provide Apple with… things are looking very good for Samsung. Not too shabby for a company that can’t innovate.

  • seouldout

    Ah… them good ol OEM days. Glad to see they’re still around.

    Pretty crafty how Sammy makes all the parts… and lets Apple steal the headlines. Samsung, where the parts are greater than the sum.

  • cm

    I wouldn’t underestimate the OEM. After all it’s not like the 1970’s when Korean sweat shops were providing textile to Western brand names. If you consider that the $500 iPhone’s $188 component cost probably leaves Apple with little margin for profit, after subtracting costs for research, development, assembly, marketing, distribution, after sales, warranty, infrastructure, etc.. Leading in innovation in software may not be what it cracks up to be. But then again, I’m not an expert.

    Now let’s compare the Galaxy’s component breakdown which has mostly Samsung made parts.$205-Bill-of-Materials-iSuppli-Teardown-Reveals.aspx

    Now granted, Samsung is selling far less of these then the iPhones. But at least they’re making their own hardware. Sell fewer of these, but get to keep a bigger portion of the profit.

    Once again, I’m not an expert, so someone correct me if I’m wrong.

  • Acropolis7

    Egyptian based Tellecomunications company selling itself to the highest bidder from Pyongyang will be the hottest buy in the world once the turtle shell is cracked.
    –The fact that Egypt has cracked first allows more expidient entry into Pyongyang through inormation to the general populace.–

    If the North Korean Regime is going to blame America for anything truthfull, let the Regime blame us for bathing them in blood, and not their people. Let them blame us for killing Juche, let them blame us for killing of the Kim Il Sung lineage so that north Koreans can be fed, live and prosper more than the Kims did.

    The offspring of Kim Il Sung and all those close of kin of him should now seek American Asylum and protection. I have a feeling that in the very near future, Google Earth may just slip into the hands of North Koreans, showing them that the restricted areas are nothing but gates to Kim Jong Il’s palaces. Palaces to his Bastard family.

  • gbnhj

    Also, my rug was stolen.

  • DLBarch

    The funny thing about Apple is that for all its (very) cool products and iconic place in the Pantheon of Silicon Valley success stories, the company is almost as disreputable as Samsux, if not more so. It’s practically a match made in heaven. (Full disclosure: I’m a long-time user and big fan of a wide range of Apple products, but am not a “Mac addict.”)

    That said, how else to regard a company with a history of aggressive corporate secrecy, vexatious litigiousness, monopolistic and anticompetitive antitrust activity, environmental degredation, sweatshop labor practices, price-switching, reclusive senior management, employee suicides, subpar quality control, worthless warranties, and backdating of stock options?

    And those are just the ones off the top of my head. The irony is that Apple is just ADORED by techie libertarian types, of which Silicon Valley has no shortage whatsoever.

    And yet…the iPhone has now come to Verizon, and I’m actually thinking of trading in my Motorola Droid and taking the plunge. Ditto on the iPad.

    So go figure.

  • WangKon936


    Apple makes a shitload of money. Let’s take a cursory look at their financials (Calendar YE 2010):

    Income Statement
    – Sales: $ 76.3B
    – Gross Profit: $ 25.7B
    – EBITDA: $ 22.6B
    – Net Income: $ 16.6B

    Balance Sheet
    – Total Cash: $ 22.6B
    – Total Debt: Absolute goose egg (that’s a very good thing)

    R&D expense is in the SG&A (the line item BEFORE EBITDA or Net Income) and it amounted to $ 1.8B in 2010. Per GAAP, R&D can’t be capitalized or amortized like equipment purchases or M&A.

    Apple is a cash cow. It mints money. It’s a shareholder’s wet dream.

    So… Apple vs. Samsung Electronics in terms of net income? $16.6B vs. $10.0B. Apple, is the more profitable company. And how much sales (sweat labor) does Apple need to exert to get $16.6B? $76.3 B. How much sales does Samsung need to generate to get $10B in profit? $144B. So…. Samsung needs to generate almost double the sales to make 60% of Apple’s profit! Talk about efficiency!

    Does anyone know how much debt and cash is in Samsung’s most recent quarterly numbers? I’m too busy to look for it.

  • seouldout

    If you consider that the $500 iPhone’s $188 component cost probably leaves Apple with little margin for profit…

    Really? That’s the gambit you’re going with? Keep up the awesome tomfoolery.

  • wjk, 검은 머리 외국인

    well, I believe Apple is a cashcow.

    unlike Samsung or others, they never sell at a bargain.
    they always sell at a premium.

    peripherals at a premium, especially from apple.

    give them a 20 inch usb cord. Make them buy a longer one.

    tie them up with contracts.

    make them buy a new product, force them, every 2 years. Built in obsolescence is hastened with a battery that you have to perform surgery on to get out and replace. I thought the Japanese killed this business model, but it came back alive in the 2000s.

    unless they are doing stupid projects, as long as they manage well, they will continue to be cash cows.

    change the pin set on that new iphone. Can’t make the old cables compatible with the new ones. Make them buy new cables.

  • wjk, 검은 머리 외국인

    1/ I own a itouch4.
    2/ I personally helped a friend replace his touch screen that had tiny glass bits coming out every day with a hideous spider web crack pattern.

    i like the product and appreciate the people who made them, but there is no way to like the business model. It is not the Toyota way, it is the old GM way.

  • WangKon936

    $500 iPhone’s $188 component cost

    The iPhone 4 COGS (Cost of Goods Sold) information is from iSupply and it’s here:

    About $188 is what it appears to be. However, manufacturing labor costs (from Foxconn) are a measly $6.54.

    So… let’s factor in shipping, handling and packaging and you are probably looking at $220 total all in. Carriers, such as AT&T pay $530 for the iPhone ($630 for the 32 gig version). That’s a margin of 61%!!!

    So… add R&D (a paltry $1.8B in 2010), marketing, etc. and you are still probably generating 40-30% pure profit margin from each phone. Remember, the carriers do a lot of [free] marketing for you! Samsung (as well as Motorola, HTC, LG, etc.) would be lucky to pull out 20-15%.

    Premium pricing… the Holy Grail of the business world!

  • WangKon936

    Apple’s R&D expense is pretty minor give its size. Here’s likely why. Say you are LG or Samsung (or Toshiba or Unimicron Technology or whoever). Apple comes to you and says, “if you develop an IPS LCD screen with unreal resolution, I’ll buy a bazillion of them!” LG or Samsung says, shit… I want Apple to buy a bazillion of my screens, LET ME INVEST billions in R&D and plant capacity! Apple, given their proven reputation in buying a bazillion of your components, gets you to work on improving your products without having to up their own R&D expense themselves.

    So, there ya have it.

  • YangachiBastardo

    Wangkon: tanentially related, i personally think, despite the rise in M&A activity and the buyback&dividend increases we’re entering an era of significantly less leveraged corporate world. They were already the most prudent player in the economy at the outbreak of the crisis, they seem to be keen to deleverage while consumers basically refuse stubbornly to do so (not to mention Governments).

    Oh any take on the piece of shit Microkia deal ? Why the Finns can’t do what Samsung did and accept the droid ? They have a beef with Google ? They think Microsoft ‘s so desperate to get seriously into the tab and smartphone arena they will concede fatter margins ? Nokia think they still have enough engineering/distribution/brand power to turn a duopoly into a triopoly ? Their CEO has no fuckin clue about what to do so he went back to his old buddies at Microsoft in order to keep his job for a bit longer waiting to cash some mega severance ?

    Finally what ya think of the new LG shit they unveiled in Barcelona ? Ajoshi put them back in the game ?

  • WangKon936

    Oh any take on the Microkia deal?

    Microsoft and Nokia are evidently holding hands as they enter mobile device oblivion [and irrelevance]. Microsoft will survive. Nokia won’t.

    Want a better analogy? Microsoft couldn’t find a date to the prom (i.e. Samsung, LG, Motorola or HTC) so it’s going with its cousin.

    LG Shit. 3D on a smartphone? Why?

    Ajoshi says, “Shit. We are late to the smartphone game. This totally sucks. Samsung’s got its Super AMOLED display, Apple’s got its brand cache, HTC has reputation, even Motorola has an 18 month head start. What do we have? I know! We’ll give ’em 3D. No one else can say they have that! Besides, isn’t 3D what all the kids like these days? Okay, we’ll let all the slaves in the rowing deck figure it out. Time to go for a round of 18 holes and then management bonding at the room salon!”

  • wjk, 검은 머리 외국인

    when I replaced the screen of the iphone 3GS, I used plastic tools, a screw driver, and a hair dryer.

    itouch 4 seems purposefully manufactured to void the previous attempt. And I did not use an X-acto knife. Dammm! You can cut off your finger with that thing !!! Heat gun? Really? Notice no dammmm screws.

    this is done on purpose. no doubt about it. I’m glad I haven’t cracked my itouch4 screen yet.

    I wonder how much otterbox made in the past 4 years.

  • Brendon Carr

    Samsung’s got its Super AMOLED display, Apple’s got its brand cache (sic), HTC has reputation, even Motorola has an 18 month head start.

    The key to Apple’s success is not “brand cachet”. The key to Apple’s success is its SDK — software development kit — which makes development of applications for Mac OS X and iOS easier than for other platforms. People continuing to focus on irrelevancies like the Super AMOLED display is why Apple eats their lunch.

  • Acropolis7

    Apple will always eat it’s lunch Brendon, supper, late snack and breakfast the next day. I agree. When I was a small kid in the 1980’s. all my generation had besides Atari, Sega, and Nintendo was Apple Macs’ when it came to gaming . Oregon Trail was the PC game every kid wanted to master. Then Microsoft Windows OS started to replace Apples, one by one in the early 90’s. For almost 15 years (1992- 2007) everyone thought Apple was down for the count, even after the successfull 1999 PC launch. To think that in the year 2011, not only is Apple far from expiring, it has set the tone for others trying to copy it. Now that is a modern day Sleeping Beauty success story.

  • seouldout

    LG Shit. 3D on a smartphone? Why?

    Cuz you get to wear those way cool 3D glasses all the time and be the envy of all the boys and girls.

    People continuing to focus on irrelevancies like the Super AMOLED display is why Apple eats their lunch.

    Exactly! Content is king! “Oh wow! Look at this phone!” soon gives way to “ho-hum” otherwise.

    Samsung’s got its Super AMOLED display, Apple’s got its brand cache (sic), HTC has reputation, even Motorola has an 18 month head start.

    Are you kidding me?! He used “cache” again?! Even after I set him up for success w/ my #3. I’ve seen him do this several times. You think when he typed “cache” he pronounced it “cachet” in his mind? I think so.

    Unless “brand cache” is like a big kimchi jar buried in the garden where brand is stored away for safe keeping.

  • Brendon Carr

    You think when he typed “cache” he pronounced it “cachet” in his mind? I think so.

    A lot of Americans apparently think cache is pronounced as “cachet”. I hear it all the time from military spokesmen — it’s like nails scraping across a chalkboard. And I’m sic of it.

  • seouldout

    Fillet, claret and forte… oh my.

  • YangachiBastardo

    Cuz you get to wear those way cool 3D glasses all the time and be the envy of all the boys and girls.

    huh ? NO glasses on the LG 3d smartphone, on the new DS either

  • WangKon936

    It appears that… the news of the 15% return rate for the Galaxy Tab was a rumor started by Apple fans:

    I suppose these things get legs and take off because people hear what they wanna hear.

  • wjk, 검은 머리 외국인

    evil apple fans.

    apple fans have single handedly made apple rich.
    don’t get me wrong. I also use an apple product, but I am far from an ‘apple fan’. I will jump ship at the next alternative.

  • WangKon936

    I love what Informa telco analyst David McQueen said about the Microsoft and Nokia partnership:

    “…two losers don’t make a winner, particularly given their scale and cultural differences.”

    It’s like a football team substituting a running back and a receiver with two linebackers!

  • Brendon Carr

    It appears that… the news of the 15% return rate for the Galaxy Tab was a rumor started by Apple fans[.]

    A third-hand report authored by an undergraduate in the Philippines, repeating another blogger’s unsourced, three-paragraph “story”, is your standard of proof? I pity your banking clients.

  • WangKon936

    The source is from Samsung:

    I was lazy with the link (probably because I need to devote time to my day job), but it’s been repeated in other more well known techie related sites and blogs:

    I don’t know why you give greater weight to the “reports” that state that the return rate is 15-16%. Perhaps you have access to information that I don’t? If you do, please share.

  • Acropolis7

    WangKon, Brendon does not need to insert proof. Fact clearly shows that Apple would crush Samsung if the South Korean Chaebol brand ever threatened Apple. No matter how adavanced a Samsung Tablet is, Samsung will eventually have to pay up to Apple for unlicened infringement and duplicaion.

  • Sperwer

    Samsung will eventually have to pay up to Apple for unlicened infringement and duplicaion.

    You are assuming that a Korean court would find Samsux liable or enforce a foreign judgment to that effect. Don’t hold your breath.

  • YangachiBastardo

    Innovation’s rewards are rich if you are successful, but you can also become trapped by it and fall in a much bigger way

    You have a point

  • Darth Babaganoosh

    The source is from Samsung:

    Clearly an unbiased source.

  • Acropolis7

    Sperwer, I never assume a foreign country weilding American technology, not even our “Nuclear Umbrella territories”. I said eventually.

  • Acropolis7

    I never assume a country protected by the American Republic would be soo foolish to never pay back. After all, they are infused with American Capital ofr a reason.

  • Acropolis7


  • Brendon Carr

    I really don’t like the “Samsux” slur — Samsung makes excellent products, across the board. For at least 20 years, actually. And in many of its product lines (for example, LCDs and memory), Samsung is arguably the “world best”, to use a Koreanism. Some other products Samsung makes are just middling, but I can’t think of any electronic product I would turn my nose up at if I found out it was a Samsung product.

    As to whether they’re mean to American employees in Silicon Valley as David Barch continually hints, I can’t say. Wouldn’t surprise me, though — the Samsung salaryman in Korea does not lack for self-esteem, and I bet that arrogance carries forward in their dealings with the various “less-qualified” people they inevitably have to hire in the United States.

    But come on, guys. Using language like “Samsux”, “Micro$oft”, or “CrApple”, which we see from time to time, is simply juvenile.

    I do share Sperwer’s suspicion that anyone suing Samsung in Korean court probably faces a tilted playing field. Samsung practically owns the Republic of Korea, and the poor judge assigned a high-value case where he’d have to choose between Samsung and some foreign plaintiff will be acutely aware that after the case, he’ll still have to live here in the land controlled by Samsung. That’s what commercial arbitration in Hong Kong, Singapore, London or New York is for.

    But I can tell you that for ordinary commercial claims, the Korean court can and does rule against Samsung all the time.

  • hoju_saram

    but I can’t think of any electronic product I would turn my nose up at if I found out it was a Samsung product.

    Cameras – I’ll never buy a Samsung camera again. They’re still way behind Canon, Nikon and even Sony. Everything else, I agree.

  • Brendon Carr

    Really? The cameras aren’t any good? Because Samsung is actually a major OEM manufacturer of well-known and respected cameras. They’re also the real manufacturers of a number of well-regarded printers too.

  • seouldout

    The Galaxy Tab return rate stories cite ITG Investment Research Inc.. And just who is this?

    I looked through ITG’s site and don’t see anything that suggest they are the Apple fanboys who have hatched a cunning plan.

    Other news reports cite ITG. And here.

    In October 2010 ITG spent $56 million to buy another research firm and renamed itself ITG Investment Research.

    I find it unlikely that some Apple fanboys would go through such a clever ruse to create the aire of legitimacy. But, hey… I’m gullible. Ought not believe ITG’s “reports”.

    I was lazy with the link (probably because I need to devote time to my day job),

    Said the compulsive commenter. Man, that’s a gem. It’s so rich my arteries have seized. Yep, no blood is pulsing through them. doesn’t strike me as a site that appears on page 1 or 2 of typical search results… unless one was searching for social+barrel. The search galaxy+tab+return+rate doesn’t return socialbarrel on the first 4 pages – I gave up after that. Seems one would have to dig pretty deep to find Was your search something like filipina+unvisited+website+likes+galaxy+tab?

  • seouldout

    Bloody hell… moderation?!

  • hoju_saram

    Well, I’m going on a compact camera I bought my wife about 4 years ago. And I’m comparing it to my experience with sony compacts and canon compacts. They may have picked up their game since then. Their only DSLRs – the NX10, NX11 and a few others – are not bad, but suffer from a lack of lenses. Still, it’s a whole new ball game, and if they start making good lenses, who knows where they’ll end up. But even if things go according to plan, it’ll be 10-20 years before they offer serious competition to Canon and Nikon, IMHO. Lens development seems to be a really specialized field.

  • WangKon936


    Are you a Canon man or a Nikon man? I’m guessing you’re a Canon guy. I’m a Nikon guy. I have an old D200, but I’m waiting for the D800. My Nikkor len collection (and my investment in an SB-900) keeps me locked into Nikon. Canon’s got some pretty cool cameras, but I’ve been a Nikon guy for the past 15 years and I’m not about to change.

    I use to take wedding, bar mitzvah, anniversary, corporate event, etc. pictures while an undergrad in college. I am still a hobby photographer, but I’d consider myself a high-end one. If you want to see a sample of my work, email me.

    My final postscript on the Samsung Tab return “statistics” is this. It is entirely possible that both statistics are true. It could be that the returns to the carrier are 15%, but then those get restocked and resold eventually and so the ultimate returns to Samsung are only 2%. The problem here is that we don’t (or at least I don’t) have context to see if this is unusual for the industry. Clearly there are products returned to carriers and then ultimately returned to vendors. What’s above average? 15% sound high, but maybe iPad’s numbers are 10% returned (for 3G, not wi-fi versions) or more? I don’t know and neither does anyone else… apparently Apple doesn’t release return numbers.

  • wjk, 검은 머리 외국인

    a while ago, there was a movement by all cellphone makers to unify the power socket. I think they were trending toward microusb.

    Apple will never play along with that. It will reduce the chance to sell more peripherals that change with every model. It’s clearly customer abuse. Because if you buy a mophie juice pack, it’s magically converted to a standard compatible with other chargers. Seriously, apple?

    you know what Apple does to prevent things like a mophie juice pack?
    –They put the speaker/mic and the ear phone jack where the usb jack is, thus negating the utility of such 3rd party aftermarket help for the consumer. Seriously, apple?

    how can you every be a fanboy of this company? In a recession, people were spending discretionary income on this company to vault it past all others. Thus, I am a firm believer that when people say, ” I don’t have money”, you should never believe them. They have money. It just depends what they are willing to use it on. Ditto for the crack or meth addict on the street. They have money.

  • belair716_

    Yay! More toys!

    “Top 10 iPad Alternatives”

  • hoju_saram


    I used to be a Nikon man, and I still have a soft sport for Nikon. They’re a great company. But I ended up switching to Canon because I needed to shoot video as well as stills, and the 7d / 5d combo was much better than what Nikon was offering at the time (d300s) in the motion picture department…I’ve still got some nikon gear (d300 + lenses + flash etc), which I really should sell, but I just can’t bring myself to. And I’m very happy with Canon, both in the stills and movie department.

    I’d love to see some of your stuff. Actually, you should throw them up on flickr.

    Flickr Pro is something I’d recommend to anyone who takes photos, as a hobby or seriously. I’ve got thousands of photos on their system, the vast majority hidden from public view. I move around a fair bit, so for me it’s like a portable hard-drive. It doesn’t matter where I go, I can access my photos. And there’s no danger of hardware failure leading you to lose your images. $25 a year is far less than I’d spend on hardware and backups. Of course, it helps having an unlimited broadband service – I uploaded my collection when I was in Korea, and I wasn’t paying for excess bandwidth. It took several weeks.

  • hoju_saram

    Back to the subject of Samsung camera tech, it’s going to tough for them to break into the market for a few reasons.

    1. They’ve got some seriously stiff competition, and with cameras, a lot of users are very loyal, since they’ve often invested in lenses. It’s hard to get people to switch.

    2. Lens tech is a very expensive and time-consuming R&D process. And every time a company brings out a new lens they patent it. Samsung wouldn’t be able to benchmark other lenses – they’d have to develop their own. Sony was smart in that they bought out minolta and all their lenses, so they immediately had an “in” with the old minolta folk. But they still aren’t taken seriously by diehard Nikon and Canon people, because –

    3. Camera users – especially pros – place a lot of value in pedigree. One reason Sony hasn’t really made much ground in the high-end market is that people don’t regard them as being camera specialists. They’ve got their finger in other pies, and it turns the camera snobs off.

    Maybe Samsung should take a completely different approach and come at the problem from the other direction – instead of working up from the bottom fo the heap, buy out the best – Hasselblad. Keep the structure of the company intact, but bleed down into the pro and semi pro market with some more affordable products.

    I’m sure some people would consider the idea of a TV and gadget company buying out such an historical outfit, and Hassselblad’s brand value might take a hit, but it might actually be a good business move from Samsung’s point of view. I’ve got no doubt they could afford it.


  • hoju_saram

    *I’m sure some people would consider the idea of a TV and gadget company buying out such an historical outfit heresy*

  • WangKon936

    I’ve still got some nikon gear (d300 + lenses + flash etc)

    Why don’t you ask the Marmot? I’m sure he might be a buyer… 😉

    I also have a Nikon Coolscan 4000 ED that scans at 4,000 dpi. It can scan ISO 25 film at individual grain level (the files end up being 56 megabytes each though). All my old film stuff has been backed-up to DVD. I use to love film. My favorites were Fuji Reala, Kodak Ektar 25 and the Ilford B/W films.

    Email me at I’ll show you how to take a look at my pictures.

  • hoju_saram

    Ok, will do.

    Regarding your backups, be careful – DVDs have a limited shelf life. I’m sure you’re onto it, but I give my clients gold archive discs for that reason. Supposedly can last 100 years +

  • seouldout


    Just one. Sammy bought Rollei in ’95 and in less than 5 years got rid of it.

    Oh, and another. Has Panasonic benefited from it partnership w/ Leica in a manner beyond what it could have done on its own? Is someone buying a Lumix rather than a Casio because of it?

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