From Weikuboy:
I hope to see/start a discussion in this week’s upcoming open thread about unrest in the Arab/Islamic world, and what it might mean for East Asia.
Go to town.
Open Thread #186
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{ 140 comments… read them below or add one }
If Islamists come to power, expect radical changes in those countries’ policies, both foreign and domestic.
Such changes would surely have an effect on Korean investment in the Middle East and North Africa, certainly on Korean construction firms engaged in any work there as well.
Korea’s alliance with the US might be a source of tension, too, given Islamists’ dislike of the US.
We’ll have to see how events play out. I’m not clear on what’s currently going on in Egypt, for example.
Jeffery Hodges
* * *
“Egypt protests: America’s secret backing for rebel leaders behind uprising” http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/africaandindianocean/egypt/8289686/Egypt-protests-Americas-secret-backing-for-rebel-leaders-behind-uprising.html
“The American government secretly backed leading figures behind the Egyptian uprising who have been planning “regime change” for the past three years, The Daily Telegraph has learned.”
From the link provided by Jashin Densetsu, the evidence provided looks rather weak. I’d need to see stronger evidence to believe that the US government is secretly working to undermine a government that it’s been supporting with billions of dollars over the years. More likely, this report is evidence of the Egyptian government’s attempt to sow confusion among the protesters, who would all almost certainly be anti-American.
Jeffery Hodges
* * *
Does anyone know where I can get a picture put on a coffee mug?
we’ve done it before bro http://original.antiwar.com/buchanan/2009/11/02/the-american-way-of-abandonment/
are you saying the egyptian government forged US diplomatic dispatches and memos and left them around for wikileaks to swoop up and leak in the event of mass protests in order to sow confusion among the protesters? are you some kind of conspiracy theorist bro?
Here’s a more direct link to the document The Telegraph has.
It doesn’t look like much to me.
Jeffery Hodges
* * *
It’s all Bush’s fault.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vo5Fn1-2E8o&feature=player_embedded
VIVA Egyptian People VIVA!!!
I’ll save any predictions I may have until after I have a bit more information, but as someone who reads Haaretz first thing every morning, I gotta say, Al Jazeera has been indispensable these last four days in covering and (trying) to understand this story and the sudden eruption of events.
Just absolutely amazing coverage.
DLB
“It’s all Bush’s fault.”
Yeah, well, that dipshit Fareed Zakaria last week was in fact trying to credit (not blame) Bush Jr. for stirring things up in the Middle East. Even though we’ve already seen in Palestine and Lebanon that democracy simply paves for way for anti-Western radicalism. The consensus here at The Hole thus far seems to be that, despite our instinctive support for democratic movements, no good can come of this, for Israel and the West, and for East Asia.
Did Chinese TV pass off Top Gun footage as a military drill?:
http://blog.foreignpolicy.com/posts/2011/01/27/did_chinese_tv_pass_off_top_gun_footage_as_a_military_drill
Sexy G.Na
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DnJZjgWKrwk
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8AXWbaPLCm4
50′s in Korea
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IIAGtPlQYX0&feature=related
Possibly, but at the same time, I’m not sure if the status quo is sustainable, either. At any rate, while I’m inclined to agree that democracy at this stage in the Middle East’s socio-economic development might not be such a good thing, I don’t think it’s a completely bad thing, either — at the very least, it can make positions clearer, as it has in the case of Gaza. And about the Egyptian case in particular, I’d say a) it’s still too early to tell whether Mubarak will fall the same way the Tunisian government did, and b) even if it did, whether the government that replaces it will necessarily be anti-American and/or anti-Israeli. I’m still keen to see how the situation in Tunisia shakes out first.
John Derbyshire put it pretty well this morning, I think:
http://www.johnderbyshire.com/Opinions/RadioDerb/2011-01-28.html
@’That Dipshit’ (?) Weikuboy.
“Anti-Western radicalism?” Reeaaally?
More like anti-American radicalism, methinks.
Ahmerika, you (and others like you) might be interested to know, is not actually considered by those originally Western people (Europeans, i.e. those who live in Europe) to be representative of “The West”. Reeeaaallly NOT.
In “The West” (Europe), Ahmerika is just… well, Ahmerika: Lots of fat people, and horrible junk food, basically. And something about democracy, freedom and opportunity, don’t remember what.
Curiously, in my (rather extensive) experience, Ahmerikans are not particularly welcome OR at home in “The West” (Europe).
A long rime ago, I used to wonder why. I don’t anymore.
“America has long been a country of limitless possibility. But the dream has now become a nightmare for many. The US is now realizing just how fragile its success has become — and how bitter its reality. Should the superpower not find a way out of crisis, it could spell trouble ahead for the global economy. By SPIEGEL Staff
http://www.spiegel.de/international/world/0,1518,726447,00.html
rime = time
SonDamBi before she became famous.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xw95AZBHMTc&feature=related
I respect the 4 Minutes.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QmzLAzGKqTQ&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_X-N7OpSU4U&feature=related
And the Mighty SNSD
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sY9rFwf27_Q&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XCwPj04npfc&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=esvUZ6VaMuM&feature=fvwk
Korean Indians?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3LQfmdMsnuU&feature=related
Real young girls.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VnuQVTqsReo&feature=relateddMsnuU&feature=related
America is the best place in the world.
You have tons of variety to choose from.
When is G. Na going to goondae?
They have to fix the law so that these American Idol reject or never has beens gyopos stop flooding back into the Republic of Korea, adulterating the language.
Their parents ostensibly went to USA for ‘higher education’. Then these gyopos are miserable failures.
They came back to the land their parents fled to be than-tha-rahs.
@ 15 – I long ago fell out with the contemporary trends of radical chic. Your spelling of “Ahmerika” is an odd one. I’m used to seeing “Amerika” and even “Amerikkka”, which evoke fascism and the good ol’ ‘Mercan KKK, but what’s up with the “h” in your “Ahmerika”?
Good thing you included the parenthetical aside.
Why not? I’m dying to know more. What caused you to reverse course? The revulsion you felt seeing deep fried Mars bars?
All in all, yours is a rather discombobulated comment. My take away: fat doner-kebab eating Germans and fat fish-and-chip eating Brits don’t like fat cheezburger eating Americans.
@Alice in Wonderland: what the hell are you going on about?
@Robert: Well would ya look at what we have here. The liberal moonbat who’s never seen a Ground Zero Mosque he didn’t love is deeply skeptical of Arab/Islamic democracy, while the conservative (that would be you) is tentatively excited by the idea of throwing Our Friends the Dictators under the bus.
My my my.
@17 – It’s a crying shame when a girls group wears pants. A low-cut high-thigh squaw costume would’ve been fantastic.
BTW, what’s up w/ Koreans and Indian-themed songs that have nothing to do with Injuns? I trace it back to Nami, but it could go back even earlier.
rand paul for president http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2011/01/28/politics/main7294405.shtml
I’m not sure if that’s the feeling I was trying to convey. Certainly, it’s hard not to sympathize with mass uprisings against dictators who have been in power for 30 years, and I can certainly wish that things end well (and there are factors in Tunisia and Egypt that give me some hope). I have no confidence that they will, though, because like you, I’m deeply sceptical about the prospect of democracy in the Arab world, and my inclination, when given a choice between dictatorships, is to favor the one that’s somewhat economically proficient and socially forward-thinking (Tunisia) or willing to play nice with Israel (Egypt). The problem, though, is that from a foreign policy perspective, a dictator is useful only as long as he’s got enough popular support to stay in power and maintain stability. Latch yourself to a sinking ship, and you both drown. I don’t want to throw Mubarak “under the bus,” as you put it, but is the United States capable of keeping him in power, even if it wanted to? Or even it could, should it? I assume you wouldn’t support Hillary Clinton offering Mubarak US assistance in putting down the protests, as the French foreign minister apparently did for Tunisia days before its president fled. I think the best thing the US can do for Mubarak is, as a friend, convince him to a) not double-down and thug-up, and b) talk with the opposition so they can make the kinds of political reforms needed to give Egyptians some degree of hope for the future without a potentially destabilizing revolution.
AliceInWonderland:
Yeah, right. Tell that to the French right now.
I’ve gotta admit, I haven’t read widely on the subject, by having traveled throughout Egypt, I can say one thing about the Egyptians – they’re quite a moderate people. Even if this uprising ends in an Islamic state (never a good result from a democratic point of view), I don’t think it’s going to be as disastrous – for the locals or for western interests – as an Islamic state in say, Pakistan, or Afganistan, or Iran.
Religion isn’t the only vehicle of radicalism – ethnicity and culture play a big part too. And the Egyptians have a more measured and sedate approach to life – more like the Turks – than Persian Arabs.
Sounds more of an indictment on Europeans than Americans to me. But I don’t buy it; Europeans, in my experience, while slightly less fat and friendly than the rest of us, are nevertheless mostly very genial people.
@ 20
i fear you are misunderstanding.
no radical chic movement, merely my own saturday afternoon or whatever invention.
the “aH’ in ‘ahmerikan’ makes it sound more like ‘ah-men’ (amen) and ‘ah-frika’ and so on, don’t you think?
and also: since when were the British Isles part of Europe?
i fear that you are really misunderstanding.
@21
yes.
i now realize i should have written a long introduction to my original comment.
so here goes:
one gets so (very fucking) tired of hearing about ‘Westernization’ and ‘anti-Western radicalism’ when really what is meant is ‘Americanization’ and ‘anti-American radicalism’.
very few people aound here actually bother to make the disticntion between ‘the West’ and ‘Ahmerika”, but it is an important distinction, i think.
maybe it’s because there are not really that many people from European countries living in the Far East, compared to Americans. maybe that’s why the ‘Westernization =Americanization” idea has established itself so firmly around here.
maybe that’s why all these disgusting pizza restaurants, donut shops and hamburger joints pass for ‘westernization’. there is no one here to point out to these people that this is actually NOT western culture, this is AHMERIKAN culture (if such there be).
i would be interested to know what the average middle-aged Dane or Dutchman would make of the ‘westernization’ of, for example, korea.
would they find anything even remotely ‘western’ here?
oh, what am i talking about, i already know the answer.
it is no.
around here, there are many ahmerikan things.
not really much in the way of western things.
in my opinion, it doesn’t really matter.
but just please, please please…. when referring to “the West” when you actually mean Ahmerika – just say so.
OK?
AliceInWonderland must have eaten the pills that make you stick your head up Kim Jong Il’s arse…
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WANNqr-vcx0
A new rhetorical and intellectual floor has been found, down Alice in Wonderland’s rabbit’s hole. I dare even Koldjik to underachieve Alice.
Or an economic point of view. You’d think 30 years of extreme repression and economic stagnation in Iran plus the 15 years of Taliban horrors next door would scare the world’s Muslims away from any notions about “Islam is the solution.”
South Korea was doing the protests as early as the 1960s, if not earlier. It’s truly remarkable that no such protests have been seen in North Korea’s LAST NAME KIM state.
In the ROK, sometimes henchmen, aka police and soldiers who were pulverizing civilians really felt disgusted at themselves and started siding with the people instead of the dictator who ordered them. I think we saw some of that in Egypt, Tunisia.
why is the North Korean henchman so unquestionably loyal to King Kim and Prince Kim? They beat out classic henchmen of murderous dictators of the past, add Kim to the ranks of Stalin, Hitler, and Mao.
seouldout,
American Injuns share the same root as Koreans. They are “Mongols” who walked across the continent through Alaska.
I once saw PBS special that explained the origin of the Injuns. The program said that it was less than a couple of hundreds who moved from China to North America. The same group walked down to SouthAmerica.
People don’t rise from the earth, you know. They have Roots.
@32 There’s also a theory that Native Americans in South America came by boats from South East Asia. Here’s a wikipedia article about it:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Settlement_of_the_Americas#Watercraft_migration_theories
As for Egypt turning into an Islamic State, I’ve read a few articles stating that this movement has less to do with Islam and more to do with Nationalism. There was one specific Yahoo news article that had an example, but I can’t seem to find it. However, I’d like to hear what DLBarch has to say about this, as he’s been watching Al Jazeera.
Japan just scored…tragic.
So many wasted opportunities – still, Japan hung tough for most of the game, and made the most of what was a gift of a chance. Well played.
Beauty goal by Tadanari Lee – so Korea can feel happy too.
And two key saves by Kawashima.
Mister Donut is from Boston. Boston is a city in England. England is part of Europe! Case closed! Psyche!
No doubt we’ll soon see millions of Japanese and Koreans out on the streets throwing rocks, overturning cars and torching buildings demanding justice.
Actually, I’m more interested in how this plays out in the American political sphere. It WILL become an issue in the 2012 election. What will be the spin? What will be the political narrative? Will it be a triumph of democracy and freedom? A failure of American foreign policy? What does Sarah Palin think?
Achtung! McNuggets™ are now available in a convenient 50-piece box for only $9.99! Hurray!!
Tadanari Lee makes me think a novel thought.
Jaeil gyopos pretty much stay in Japan if they want to be pop musicians. Seldom few go to Korea.
Jaemi or Jaekae? gyopos ALL go to the Republic of Korea if they want to be pop musicians.
Women need to serve in mandatory military if they are going to make a living in ROK as well.
All those gyopos in all honesty are rejects from the entertainment industry capital of the world. USA. Even the Europeans watch Hollywood movies for the most part and listen to American music for the most part. Just look at UK or German top music charts.
I hate G.Na, because before I even knew she was, she was making Korean headline news about how her tits were so big, she couldn’t fit into Korean bras. Laughable. You can readily guess what kind of idiots of parents she had in her background.
@32 – and that has what to do with these Koreans-playin’-Indian songs?
@ Egypt – Remember that the theocrats didn’t take power immediately after the Shah’s departure from Iran. Two key leaders, Shapour Bakhtiar, who allowed Khomeini to re-enter Iran, and Abulhassan Bani Sadr, were both cosmopolitan moderates and seen by the deluded west as acceptable alternatives to both the Shah and Khomeini. Yet neither could stabilise Iran largely due to the mullahs and radical theocrats working behind the scenes. I’m seeing a lot of press on Mohamed El Baradei and won’t be surprised to see supporters of Boutros Ghali toss his hat into the ring. If either one of these fellas replaces Mubarak they’ll play the useful stooge role and predictably stop the state security’s harassment of the Muslim Brotherhood, allowing them to organise and in 2 – 3 years they’ll control the country. To survive Mubarak needs to squash this quickly or elements in the military will turn against him – it was the groups within military that assassinated Sadat.
“And the Egyptians have a more measured and sedate approach to life – more like the Turks…”
Unfortunately, Turkey appears to be on a long, slow process of Islamisation. Yemen has already gone that route, and Pakistan is getting worse. I’m not optimistic for Egypt. It seems to me that Muslim political activists, one in power, see no separation of mosque and state, and it’s extremely difficult for countries to get out of the Islamist political system once they’re in.
If the protests bring down the Egyptian government, the Islamists will almost certainly take control. See FPRI’s Barry Rubin on EGYPT: What the U.S. Should Do.
Jeffery Hodges
* * *
Hey seouldout, seriously, where did you go to high school?
“So many wasted opportunities – still, Japan hung tough for most of the game, and made the most of what was a gift of a chance. Well played.”
So much for Australia’s physical size advantage over Japan that you touted about.
In football, size does not matter. Anyone can play this game well. That’s the beauty of the game. Look at Maradona, or Messi. They’re only 5’4 and 5’6 respectively. That didn’t stop them from being international legends.
You obviously didn’t watch the game. Australia took full use of its size – particularly in defence – but failed to make the most of the opportunities they generated. It was finishing that let them down. I agree that size is not paramount in football, but it can help – and it did help against Japan.
I didn’t like Bill Maher before. I had always thought the guy was a huge d-bag. But then I started watching his HBO talk show.
Here are links to this week’s episode (hope it’s OK with Robert):
http://www.fileserve.com/file/rt9pcns/real.time.with.bill.maher.2011.01.28.hdtv.xvid-fqm.avi
And last week’s:
http://www.fileserve.com/file/99J36Wt
Each .avi file is about 550 mb.
I never understood why some people consider 50 chicken nuggets for 10 dollars at McDonalds to be a good deal. Forgoing the fact that it is most unwise to eat 50 processed chicken nuggets in one sitting, Wendy’s offers the same price every day. Also considering the quality of the personnel working at your standard McDonalds, I doubt they have either the inclination or even capacity to insure that the customer actually receive their 50 nuggets.
50 nuggets seems like a lot. But then again I’m pretty sure the people buying them are sharing them with friends, co-workers, or family.
What about Little Caesar pepperoni pizzas for 5 dollars? I usually eat the entire thing in a sitting. But 2 large pizzas for 10? I’d puke before I’d be able to eat that much and there’d be no room for beverage.
“You obviously didn’t watch the game. Australia took full use of its size – particularly in defence – but failed to make the most of the opportunities they generated. It was finishing that let them down. I agree that size is not paramount in football, but it can help – and it did help against Japan.”
—-
Japan is the smallest team in the tournament. But yet they won it all. If the size did matter that much, they should not have won it all.
Australia is still new to soccer – when I went to school in Australia – the only sports that used to be commonly played were cricket, rugby and swimming.
Maybe things have changed since I was there ? and I always thought that Australians didn’t like “change”.
Congratulations to Japan for their record fourth AFC Asian Cup title on Saturday.
all this talk about fat doner-eating Germans, fat fish’n'chips eating British and fat cheeseburger eating Americans – I don’t understand.
Korean people love BBQ chicken and Japanese devour a lot of “greasy” ramen – they just eat it in moderation I guess.
nothing wrong with doner kebabs, fish’n'chips or cheeseburgers – but they should be eaten in moderation.
a question? there have been a few links lately about these Korean men who married a Philippine wife they met on the internet…
what internet site are they using? and what language are they speaking on the internet site?
The stereotypical cheeseburger-eating American doesn’t apply everywhere. For example, in Chicago, b/c of the sizeable Greek and Lebanese population, Gyros and Shawarmas are all over the place. In fact, I rarely ate burgers when I lived in Chicago. (On the other hand, b/c of a serious dearth of minorities of any kind in the Deep South, burgers, KFC and pizza hut are just about the only food you can get.)
let’s keep something in mind; for most people in this world, America IS the West!
do African Americans count as minorities in the Deep South? They make up at least half of admissions in public hospitals.
There’s interesting cuisine in the deep south that isn’t fast food.
All the Louisiana food is technically deep south food.
you seem to have been a tiny scrawny short d-ick Asian or something in the US military weren’t you? And an old guy at that.
They’re nice people, southerners, white or black.
re# 53 [pawi]
That because most people in the world have seen a world map.
On a world map – America/Canada are the countries to the west and Asia is to the east. ( W← Africa/Europe →E )
@AliceInWonderland: Why all the Ahmerikan penis envy? You shouldn’t continue to walk around with that chip on your shoulder…it’s gonna mess up your posture.
So it begins:
– prominent Islamic cleric returning to Tunisia from 20-year exile.
– armed gangs free Muslim militants from jail or prison in Egypt.
Kobe Bryant is a great basketball player. He isn’t particularly tall. Therefore height isn’t important in basketball.
Right?
Comedy Gold… http://theblogprof.blogspot.com/2011/01/comedy-gold-chris-matthews-who-derides.html
height matters in world style football. Skill is lacking in the Asian Cup. Europeans make use of height routinely to set up headers connecting from corner kicks and crosses the like. It’s actually easier to do than Tadanari Lee’s goal. Especially corner kicks.
After a certain level, height matters, quite a bit. There’s a lot of head-ball in foot-ball.
> After a certain level, height matters, quite a bit.
I don’t know if Messi and the rest of Barcelona FC would agree with that.
FC Barcelona, I mean.
As for Egypt, I am much more optimistic of them being able to set up a somewhat moderate, somewhat secular democracy, if they are able to topple Mubarak. And regardless, democracy is not a reward that certain peoples get for believing the right thing. Governments derive their just powers from the consent of the governed.
12 of 23 in FC Barcelona named are 5 feet 10 or taller.
I can about 9 or so in Japanese national football team over 5 feet 10 or taller.
who has the edge?
in anything edge counts.
i note all the Japanese goal keepers are relatively taller and so are those expected to respond to those crosses and corners.
Argentina did lose to Germany in 2010.
Want more nit picking?
Height is important in a few key positions – goal keeper, defender and, to a lesser degree, striker.
Messi isn’t any of these. He’s a midfielder, a position in which height isn’t important. Messi would be a poor defender – he wouldn’t be strong enough to force players off the ball, have enough reach to make crucial tackles, or enough height to defend the goal box from crosses.
wjk is right – height gives teams an advantage in key positions.
@27 Wonderland
Are you one of those, “America has no culture” kinda willful ignoramouses? Who’d have guessed. Gawd, please stop posting here.
let’s keep something in mind; for most people in this world, America IS the West!
- I think you mean “for most Koreans.”
My goodness!
The 5 somali pirates – now in Busan are being treated very well.
They even get to eat from the Officers cafeteria!
http://www.koreaherald.com/national/Detail.jsp?newsMLId=20110130000232
@67 The pirates are getting better treatment then they deserve!
For a long time, I have been laughed at for writing about this possibility. Chinese military has been doing precisely the exercise. http://www.yonhapnews.co.kr/politics/2011/01/31/0521000000AKR20110131096600083.HTML?template=2089
Face it baby. The China-Japan war will be the World War in this century.
The US should not, must not and would not get involved.
Let the Chinks kill off the Japs. And, vice versa.
These kiddies need to learn the war is bad. And, after the war, these losers will finally understand and love each other. They will become humble. Just like WWII taught the Europeans that they were fools.
Meanwhile, the US can once again profit from the war.
@ #69 what would China gain by going to war with Japan?
China will use NK as the pawn. NK will shoot missiles toward Japan. This will happen within 5 to 10 years.
Japan will make mince meat out of NK and do amphibious landing to NK. As the Japanese taking PyengYang, the Chinese troops will enter the war. To save NK government.
The US should stay out. SK should, too. But SK is never that smart. Fools die.
Soccer again? Really?
Not only do I dislike British sports, I detest the way the Brits talk about sports. The Soccer Channel CNN HongKong headlines: “Smith through to next round” and “Real Madrid lose in shock upset.” No mention of Smith’s opponent; no mention of the heroic Slough underdogs who upset mighty Real Madrid. No thrill of victory, agony of defeat for the Brits. It’s just all about the big names, the front-runners, and the results. I can only conclude that Brit-World folk find soccer (and tennis, golf, and good lord cricket) as boring as everyone else; that with the help of copious amounts of alcohol they endure, rather than enjoy, their athletic competitions; and that the only thing that matters is not a match well played but rather the result.
U.S. headline: “Steelers beat Jets 24-17 in thriller.”
Brit-World CNN HongKong headline: “Steelers through to next round.”**
** On the rare occasions CNN condescends to mention American football.
And what the hell is up with referrring to a city or club in the plural? It’s Man U defeats Slough, not Man U defeat Slough. Man U is one club, as in singular, not plural. Sheesh. Now get the hell off of my lawn.
CNN news coverage plan: devote all 24 hours in each day to the single biggest story of the moment; repeat the few facts that are known over and over again; and fill in the remaining 98% of the time with so-called experts speculating about the the unknown, the unknowable and what might happen. If there weren’t Egypt, it’d be the next missing white woman in the U.S. Double-sheesh.
P.S. No wonder Egypt banned al-Jazeera but not CNN. CNN is about as dangerous a media operation as iCarly. Maybe less so.
many think the business of American style football results in many unnecessary spinal cord injuries and head traumas, every season.
ask a neurologist.
stupidest sport in the world.
WeikuBoy, why don’t you just complain about CNN in every open thread.
I know, I know. I’ll try to make this the last time.
Yes baduk definitely i can see Toshi, Tomoko, Yoko and the rest of the boys&girls from the Prada store down the road going to war to restore the glory of the Rising Sun
Weikuboy,
You want to know why I have zero sympathy for Americans abroad complaining about media coverage? No? Let me tell you anyway.
I lived in America for two years, and whole months would go by when I read and heard no world news. None. Zip. Zilch.
For my own amusement, and out of a perverse sense of curiosity, I used to buy the papers every day and sift through them for non-American news. Once, I found a story on an embassy getting bombed in Kenya. Ok, it was an American embassy, but technically it was still international news. I would have shouted for joy, had it not been for the sobering content of the article.
It fascinated me that the papers had no world sections. Admittedly, I was mostly exposed to the LA Times and the Orange County Register. But it was almost impossible to find any national papers in the area and the TV news was just as myopic.
As the months and years passed on, I began to question whether the outside world existed at all. I clung to the ubiquitous image of Steve Irwin in those days like a drowning man to flotsam.
Thank god for the internet. I eventually found a library with the nets. I logged on every few weeks to check that Australia hadn’t sunk or been invaded, and to get my fix of global sport.
That’s why I’m not sympathetic about an American expat whining about the style of headline attributed to his own sport in an international bulletin. You should be thankful the Brit-world has allowed you to watch your minority sport at all.
I see what you did there.
You appear to be alleging the total absence of int’l news in “America”; but of course you know, and I know, that’s not really the case. What you’re really bitching about is the lack of news about Australia. Well, I’m sorry, I guess, that your country, like Korea, isn’t more important in the world; and I’m sorry you were so scarred by the experience of finding that out. You can however take comfort in the knowledge that I and other Yank expats in Asia are suffering thanks to the cultural chauvinism of you and people like you, who seem to delight in snubbing big-market North American sports. Nice job! Well done! I hadn’t realized it was a matter of revenge; and I’m sure it’s only a matter of time before the Koreans see the future and begin demanding to learn Australian rather than American English, etc.
By the way, the name of my country is the U.S., not “America.” Dumbass.
Now let me break down this concept for you: American football is not broadcast around the world cos it’s BORING AS SHIT: 4 hours of commercial breaks interrupted briefly by a few minutes showing a bunch of roided fatsos humping each other ? Geese sounds really like fun.
There’s no conspiracy against any American sport, proved by the popularity across countries and cultures of franchises like the NBA and the UFC, it is just football that stinks.
@79 wow.
@80
yes, both kinds.
Maybe I was a little harsh.
1. I get tired of hearing how dumb Americans are and how [fill in the name of any Small Country] knows so much more about us than we do about you. Well of course that’s the case. There are like 180 smaller countries in the world, and only one U.S. I would never be caught dead chanting “U.S.A.! U.S.A.!” but at the same time don’t ask me to pretend that absent a major event what happens in Australia or Korea is as important as what happens in the U.S. or China. The U.S. has, what, 10 or 12 times the population of Australia? China has 18 times the population of Korea? Sorry, I guess.
2. Be that as it may, allow me to rephrase #79 above, as follows: “I’m glad hoju saram agrees with me that CNN sucks (and that it sucks because it focuses only on what it thinks, wrongly, its audience wants — missing white women in the U.S., soccer in Asia — instead of truly informing us about the world).”
This is VERY tangential to Korea, but–
John Barry, composer of the James Bond film scores, has died at 77.
I hope Kim Yuna has the class to give a shout-out to the guy who wrote
the brilliant music that she won the gold medal with (well, him and Gershwin).
I loved those dark twangy guitars and huge brassy flourishes so much as a kid that I would hold a tape recorder up to the TV when ABC would show Bond films on Sunday nights.
RIP.
Relax, I was just stirring you up and trying to be funny.
Hey, I don’t think Americans are dumb at all. I grew up in small town Australia. Trust me, I know dumb very well! Now, on the matter of knowledge of foreign stuff, on the other hand…Put it this way, I bet world maps sell much better in Europe, China, Russia etc than they do in America. Just saying.
As far as CNN sucking ass, I’m fairly non-committal on that front. Although I must say, your recent reports on frequent Brit-world sports coverage and less than comprehensive reporting on crucial American – sorry, U.S. – news has almost sold me on a subscription.
Out of revenge!!
As funny as the description is, I actually don’t mind the NFL. I was lucky enough to watch the Titans and Rams in 99 with a bunch of lads from Tennessee, and, from my very hazy recollections, a good time was had by all.
I haven’t seen a game since, but if Slough isn’t playing someone in the EPL and CNN international happens to show it I’ll be sure to tune in…;)
You both have a point, i think lots of sports or other type of “cultural” phenomena can be perceived as extremely boring or sublime, mostly according to the circumstances and the memories we build upon them.
That’s why the same retsina wine that tasted delicious in August porking on grilled fish in a Rhodes tavern seems like a different thing back in stinky-ass Milan on a foggy November sunday in front of a frozen pizza.
Ditto with pok tan chu: it is a different thing when you enjoy it with your beloved ones, embarassingly drunk in a noraebang yelling on top of your lungs old Koyote hits
Chinky fucks up:
http://news.yahoo.com/s/yblog_thecutline/20110131/ts_yblog_thecutline/chinese-air-force-drill-looks-awfully-similar-to-top-gun
deduct 5 billion from US debt owed to china for stolen movie scene. J-10 looks to much like the f-16 batch sold to pakistan. don’t sell no more. go buy and copy migs.
A tidbit of science news: “Babies Think Large Means Dominant.”
I think new dads at the MH would do well to heed it.
Cheerleading results in far more such injuries. And because it is not recognized as a “sport”, it is not regulated.
Anyone else (esp. those in Korea) doing “business as usual” this week? Join me in keeping the MH vibrant.
@weikuboy
I have never felt compelled to subscribe to cable tv. If I want the news, I’ll dig it up on the net. I think PBS does an excellent job providing the news. If you watch enough of it, you get a good sense of what goes on in the world. My two most important sources of tv news is the News Hour and Charlie Rose. Their hour-long programs can be watched for free on the net from their websites. But they may be too staid for you. The typical viewer of these programs are about 30-40 years older than I am. :p
I don’t know anything about American sports coverage for international viewers. Do you like football? Two of my three favorite football teams are going to the Super Bowl and I’m anticipating a high quality match.
@baduk
I promise you, baduk, if China goes to war with Japan within the next 5 decades and the war turns out to be a long and difficult struggle, then that would mean that China’s army isn’t really worth worring about…
@hoju-saram
I keep hearing Ralph Fiennes’s voice when I read your comments.
Incidentally, while you were having trouble finding a source of Australian, I mean international, news
in 1998, southern California, I and a few other Americans were discovering Daljit Dhaliwal anchoring ITV World News. I was still a kid then. I think she’s the one who got me interested in the news. 
http://www.vancouversun.com/Three+arrested+after+machete+attack+Korean+student/4204663/story.html
@feld_dog
The history of the authorship of the one particular James Bond theme is a bit messy. When I think of the quintessential Barry, I think of the four chord motifs or the strong downbeat of the accompaniment where the melody pauses before flowering over the rest of the bar as in his most beautiful themes, such as in “Chaplin,” and “Midnight Cowboy.” He had a unique style, and you could often identify a score as Barry’s because of this. My favorite score is “Dances with Wolves.” And “Two Socks” is my favorite theme. The melody, held by the flute before handing off to the oboe, answered by the harp, and accompanied by strings is simply haunting. But because he writes film scores, there is not much development for these beautiful themes. I hope one day that some clever composer can piece together some of Barry’s gorgeous themes and turn it into something grander.
@Jeffery Hodges
When the Iranians protested their fradulent elections, many Arab youths cheered them and hoped for success. What did you make of that?
I was actually going for more of a Sir Les Patterson sound, but Fiennes will do I suppose.
And whilst we’re on the subject of Barry Humphries, Dame Edna is always worth a watch on youtube.
lollabrats (# 97):
“When the Iranians protested their fradulent elections, many Arab youths cheered them and hoped for success. What did you make of that?”
Probably the same reason they cheered the Tunisian uprising — support for rebellion against authoritarian rulers.
I just hope that the Islamists don’t take over as they did with the original Iranian Revolution of 1979, or everybody will be even worse off.
Jeffery Hodges
* * *
“feld_dog” and “lollabrats”: anytime a composer makes that strong an impression, they have done something right.
I remember (little kid time) — like “feld_dog” — using my Radio Shack tape recorder to record radio broadcasts of Bernstein conducting Ives’s Three New England Places and to this day, I have never heard a better interpretation of that work. I just wish Bernstein would have recorded that one.
@lollabrats
As far as I know, I won’t be able to see the Super Bowl for the third year in a row. I’m not a fan of either of the two teams; but yes, it should be a good game. I got PBS Newshour last winter, and liked it — along with Faux News, which was sort of strange cable combination. Now just
The Soccer ChannelCNN Brit-World, hence my frequent complaints.Seems like every corner of America is getting hit by some sort of blizzard or severe weather this week.
It’s global warming, dudes.
A lot of hillbilly type of Americans take the occurrence of these blizzards to be a contradiction to global warming. They don’t understand that warmer earth = warmer oceans –> more evaporation –> more water in the atmosphere –> heavier preciptation and greater incidence of severe weather. Ought to be simple enough for even the most slackjawed of Bubbas to understand. I’ve heard on the radio some time ago that the incidence of heavy rainfall has increased exponentially over the past decade. So if rainfall of 2 inches in a day had X incidence, it’s increased by 15% or so of X over the past decade; for 3 inches it’s increased 20%, for 4 inches it’s increased 25%, and so on. I’ll need to find the exact numbers and data later, but that’s the idea.
And I’mma let you finish but 2010 was the hottest year of all (recorded) time!
Yes, it’s that time of year for Koreans. Meanwhile, more than three million livestock—that’s 22% of the total population—have so far been culled to contain the spread of FMD. According to Science Daily, “if there’s a high probability of infection, computer models show that culling strategies are better” [than preemptive vaccination].
Wanted to be my weekly nuisance and drop a little local color flashback into the mix:
http://thethreewisemonkeys.com/2010/06/09/update-on-obama-in-haebangchong-foreigner-scumbunch-strikes-at-nothing-again/
Here is a sample one-sentence:
I find it daunting that as the world wide economy continues to shake, rattle and roll away from a recovery and as North Korea gets more extreme and plays with the stability of the peninsula, East Asia and the whole world that it’s possible the foreigners coming here to teach in South Korea are getting more feckless to the point of becoming self-fulfilling caricatures…
Wow. That’s some really overworked shit. I’m gonna pass.
Mizaru
Please, please, please find a literate editor.
Well that’s what the FECKLESS do tcyb they pass and pdq (Pretty Dam Quick) too.
Are you applying for (a) the job of Editor. Send your edited version of
“Update on Obama in Haebangchong: Foreigner scumbunch strikes at nothing again.”
to 3wmseoul@gmail.com
No-rush but sooner is better…
mizaru, merely because someone is indifferent to what you wrote above does not necessarily mean that a person is indifferent in general. For example, they could just hate crappy writing.
But, wasn’t that a sample, mizaru? You know, something you try in a small amount in order to form an opinion? It was certainly labelled as such. Or, were we required to like it?
There’s not a lot an editor really can do with most of the writing on the Mizaru site, which fails to pass muster as anything other than sophomoric, Korea newbie blog material with a jarringly high incidence of cliched phrasing (“shake, rattle and roll” here, for instance) . And then there’s the IDEAS themselves. I, for one, am put off by the ESL expat ghetto navel-gazing that seems to dominate the site — exactly what doomed Shelton Bumgartner’s writing here a few years back.
More power to anybody who has the energy and discipline to keep up a blog. But there are some fine wordsmiths on the Marmot’s blogroll who offer the additional benefit of having been in Korea long enough to have a sophisticated take on things and offer a worthy read. None of them feels the need to aggressively push their material like Mizaru does.
@hoju_saram
I thought Barry Humphries was British! XD We loved him here…er I mean Dame Edna! It must be intimidating to sit there and be the straight man interviewing such a quick comedic mind, knowing he’s going to needle you a bit and might do more. ^^;
@WeikuBoy
Well, I’m just saying that if you go here…
http://www.pbs.org/newshour/
…click on the “Recent Programs” tab, you can watch the entirety of their hour-long program from your computer at any time. For your convenience, the hour is separated into the different news features covered on the day. You can also download a particular news feature in an mp3 format from the same page.
Likewise, Charlie Rose’s programs can be viewed here:
http://www.charlierose.com/
But it would suck if I couldn’t have any NBA and NFL for years at a time. ^^;
I find it hard to believe that there wouldn’t be a sports bar in Manila (is that where you are?) — at the very least in an an international hotel — that shows the Super Bowl live. Even in China 10 years ago it wasn’t too hard to find the game.
“I remember (little kid time) — like “feld_dog” — using my Radio Shack tape recorder to record radio broadcasts of Bernstein conducting Ives’s Three New England Places and to this day, I have never heard a better interpretation of that work. I just wish Bernstein would have recorded that one.”
–R. Elgin
Haha. It’s remarkable how encountering the right performance of a piece makes a listening experience seem eerily pleasurable. When I go to a philharmonic concert, there is sometimes some previous recording I love and I can’t help judging the night’s performance by it even though I shouldn’t.
When I was in high school, a bunch of older folks kept telling me that one day I would love Ives. I told them it’s never going to happen. I thought it was boring But yeah, it happened. But then again, they also said I would love Mahler. I listened to his symphonies conducted by Bernstein. But it never happened. :p
Score (at least) one for the predictive powers of Economic Game Theory!
http://goldsea.com/Text/index.php?id=10097
In context to:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freakonomics#Overview
@WangKon936
I think that including that image of Hakuo losing to Kisenosato in relation to this article is in poor taste. I think it was a great humiliating and frustrating moment for Hakuo when he lost to Kisenosato last year, breaking his lossless streak. To lose to this same man in his first rematch opportunity must have been incredibly painful. :/
hakuho
Still, the freakonomics stat you allude to did seem particularly shady. :p
Whew… looks like Chinese stealth isn’t as bad as it looks!
http://online.wsj.com/video/what-the-j20-signals-about-chinas-military-might/47FA2A2F-F274-4A4C-86DC-7F0AA42F00B7.html?mod=WSJ_article_related
lollabrats,
Game theory is a tool to help you come up with meaningful conclusions based on the premise that human beings aren’t naturally honest, but naturally out to maximize their own situation. It was correct in sniffing up the fact there is a lot of cheating in Sumo, although their data may not be 100%.
Chinese use honey traps to spy on French companies:
http://story.chinanationalnews.com/index.php/ct/9/cid/9366300fc9319e9b/id/739285/cs/1/ht/Chinese-use-honey-traps-to-spy-on-French-companies/
As predicted… Senator Max Baucus is being an ass…
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2011/02/02/AR2011020204751.html?hpid=topnews
“Game theory is a tool to help you come up with meaningful conclusions based on the premise that human beings aren’t naturally honest, but naturally out to maximize their own situation”
Right… I didn’t realize game theory portended to be so morally thorny.
Game theory is always best thought of as a minimalist mathematical tool. Stripped of its (emperically unsound) assumptions about human behavior, I’ve always thought of it as just a way to quantify certain situations and their outcomes – and, after the fact, with minimal predictive power. I’ve never seen it as being anything more than that.
I read the wiki article on Levitt’s work — seems like his results are independent of game theory.
I mean, if there is something that would be of particular benefit to sumo wrestlers (such as seaking deals with desperate wrestlers with 7-7 records) then why wouldn’t one expect it to occur on some basis? One wouldn’t need game theory to make sense of that. No need, even, to assume human beings act to maximize anything.
Then again I haven’t read Freakonomics. Don’t plan to.
αβγδε,
Freakonomics is not game theory, however, if you read the book, you’ll see that Levitt sees Game Theory as the precursor to Freakonomics. Personally, I don’t think there would be Freakonomics if Game Theory didn’t come first.
The connection was made even more stronger in the sequel, “Super Freakonomics” where Levitt said the basis of his work came about by broad theoretical applications of the Prisoner’s Dilemma by John Nash, one of the fathers of Game Theory. What is the Prisoner’s Dilemma but a pure application of Game Theory? Thus, the best technical term for the economic school of thought that pertains to predicting and analyzing real life events would be Game Theory. I certainly can’t call it “Freakonomics”…
Btw… I would think the rather matter-of-factly way Levitt uses the principles of Game Theory to explain away human emotions like “altruism” would appeal to an atheist like you…
In other words, Freakonomics is a contrived piece of shit which frames itself in the language of game theory for the sake of appealing to those who have an undue inflated sense of what game theory is or its importance. I get it now. I’d rather read Bonk or something.
“Btw… I would think the rather matter-of-factly way Levitt uses the principles of Game Theory to explain away human emotions like “altruism” would appeal to an atheist like you…”
That’s rich.
- Explain away? Or merely explain?
- What do you think “altruism” is to an atheist like me?
- What kind of atheist do you suppose I am? LOL.
Well… ummm…. I dunno. You seem upset about nothing. It’s usually very difficult and complicated to discuss [trivial] topics dispassionately when someone is in that mode.
Good book.
Just now I heard the name “Ban Ki-Moon” on CNN, in connection with the Egypt political turmoil story, for the first time since things broke out. He was standing there mutely next to David Cameron, and CNN felt it appropriate to make a cut just as Ban was opening his mouth to stumble through a clumsy prepared text. So Ban’s still UN General Secretary! Who knew?
I gotta say, if the reasoning behind supporting Ban Ki-Moon’s ambition to be UN General Secretary was that the guy’s a complete zero, and would therefore diminish the supposed moral authority of the United Nations — mission accomplished! Wow. Since I hate the UN, here’s hoping the guy gets re-appointed at the end of the year.
@129
No, I’m not offended by your comment. Please post away, WK, but do not expect me not to be sarcastic toward such naivety.
I also forgot to ask:
- Why do you suppose altruism is an “emotion”?
I do sense what you’re getting at, even though you make a wide load of assumptions about me. It would be hillarious to see your meaning written out, sentence to sentence. So please expand and articulate what you mean, WK. I am not upset. I’m just gravely amused. LOL.
EatYourKimchi on ondols:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SFcmZlxa-TE
Seems like a terribly inefficient way to heat one’s living space, no?
Kpop among Japanese fans:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pZsSPR6pXGc
Gotta love that stereotypical female Japanese voice. ^___^
And an MV cover- not just a dance cover- of a Kpop song by a French girl:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zT3kCfwjqf8
Talented girl.
On the contrary – there’s much research that suggests ondol heating is very efficient. The really old stone ondol systems (known as hypocausts in Europe) were said to have been able to retain heat in the floor for months.
There’s also the fact that heat transfer is much faster through contact than through air (something to do with emissivity, reflectivity and absorptivity). That’s why sprawling on an ondol floor in winter is heaven.
i always wondered why they can’t bring the warm floors to the USA. It would be a huge hit.
taking your shoes off in doors is also quite a hit among white Americans. It makes all the sense in the world, actually.
why dirty your house with shoes that stepped on shxt, dirt, allergens, toxins, petroleum, pesticides, bugs, eggs of who knows what, I repeat myself
i always wondered why they can’t bring the warm floors to the USA. It would be a huge hit.
taking your shoes off in doors is also quite a hit among white Americans. It makes all the sense in the world, actually.
why dirty your house with shoes that stepped on poo, urine, dirt, allergens, toxins, petroleum, pesticides, bugs, eggs of who knows what, I repeat myself
i know some of your readers love this stuff about koreans in the states, especially when it has to do with shady things:
http://www.dailynews.com/ci_17294483?source=most_viewed
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f2EtpAqcwqU&feature=channel
if you’re gonna sing in English and hardly know Korean, why AREN’T you in American Idol?
I hate these gyopos flooding back to Korea to become singers.
Big market rejects.
In a market tainted with slave contracts, casting couch, and copy right infringments.
re#135
The ondol system used to cause problems during summer.
http://www.jejuweekly.com/news/articleView.html?idxno=1100
[In the summer of 1905..... extremely hot due to the ondol underground heating system].
(towards the end of the page)
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