If you haven’t read Amy Chua’s piece in the Wall Street Journal on “why Chinese mothers are superior,” you’re highly encouraged to do so now, if for the “WTF” factor alone. I mean, Jesus, I’d be the first to agree that American kids need a kick in the ass, but Chua’s essay left me speechless. And by speechless, I mean recoiling in abject horror, horror that begins straight from tip-off:
A lot of people wonder how Chinese parents raise such stereotypically successful kids. They wonder what these parents do to produce so many math whizzes and music prodigies, what it’s like inside the family, and whether they could do it too. Well, I can tell them, because I’ve done it. Here are some things my daughters, Sophia and Louisa, were never allowed to do:
• attend a sleepover
• have a playdate
• be in a school play
• complain about not being in a school play
• watch TV or play computer games
• choose their own extracurricular activities
• get any grade less than an A
• not be the No. 1 student in every subject except gym and drama
• play any instrument other than the piano or violin
• not play the piano or violin.
[...]
Despite our squeamishness about cultural stereotypes, there are tons of studies out there showing marked and quantifiable differences between Chinese and Westerners when it comes to parenting. In one study of 50 Western American mothers and 48 Chinese immigrant mothers, almost 70% of the Western mothers said either that “stressing academic success is not good for children” or that “parents need to foster the idea that learning is fun.” By contrast, roughly 0% of the Chinese mothers felt the same way. Instead, the vast majority of the Chinese mothers said that they believe their children can be “the best” students, that “academic achievement reflects successful parenting,” and that if children did not excel at school then there was “a problem” and parents “were not doing their job.” Other studies indicate that compared to Western parents, Chinese parents spend approximately 10 times as long every day drilling academic activities with their children. By contrast, Western kids are more likely to participate in sports teams.
That was a mild part.
Like I said, read the rest on your own.
{ 98 comments… read them below or add one }
Hilarious… but Western parents probably should take more of an interest (and guiding role) in their children’s education than they currently do. I also will agree that there are a lot of parents how there who care too much about how good their kids are sports while at the same time these kids are failing math, history, and foreign languages.
I note she has failed to produce a son.
I’d call it a vestige of a Sinological way of life that used to prevail in East Asia until the West’s cultural invasion. Old habits are like zombies…they don’t die easily. You hear people still talking about who’s “superior” or “inferior” or who’s 일류, 이류, 삼류 placing everything and everyone in a vertical cosmos.
It’s kinda unfortunate to think that America is growing un-American thanks to some, if not all, Chinese (and probably other East Asian) immigrants.
What a retarded article. I very much disagree that the west is “falling behind”. This makes no sense to me. If you’re into math, and you want to study math, and math gets you going, the dude who loves it is going to be the one who discovers shit, solves shit, and gets published. It really has nothing to do with having it forced upon you.
This “Chinese” mom is forcing her kids to play a western instrument, study western compositions, and excel at western creations. She’s raising robots, while the “misfit western-raised” kids are out there experiencing life and maybe spending all that free time at home creating things, imaging things, etc.
America is a nation of dreamers, creators, artists, musicians, and self-discovered talent. I’m not saying the school system is perfect, but I won’t be fear-mongering the rise of other nations until americans are studying from their textbooks and learning to play their music on their instruments in order to be “successful”.
Moms who mom like her aren’t fostering the next Bill Gates, Warren Buffett, Mukesh Ambani, or Eike Batista. They’re raising information age peons.
What utter bullshit. Couldn’t this post have waited until Friday? I shouldn’t be this flustered on a Monday.
Being part of a Chinese family… I know the article to be true. And the attitudes of “western” parents is the primary reason I teach in Asia and not the US.
I once worked with a Chinese gal in America doing her internship at a hotel. She was told more than once in training not to change the set formula of the accounting software(most wouldn’t even think of changing it or be that stupid) we were using. She took offense when told not to do it. Unfortunately, she wouldn’t listen so couldn’t reconcile the daily reports. China, Fighting!
The great irony, lost on this particular Chinese mother, is that her kids are excelling at studying western instruments and western knowledge.
A cynic would say they’ll grow up to be great copiers and followers.
On the other hand, I once worked with another Chinese gal at another place. She smelled like garlic and all she wanted to do is go out with me and f^*@. She told me I was the biggest she had ever had. Besides the garlic, it was orgasmic.
Well said, chiamattt. I don’t think that anything that she said in that article actually supports the title, ‘Why Chinese Mothers Are Superior’.
the article is spot-on except for her thinking it’s only chinese mothers who are superior. korean mothers are superior to their western counterparts as well.
creativity and next warren buffett? sure. how many slots are there for that?
@valkilmerisceman – to be fair, usually the writer doesn’t have any control over the headline. Editors write headlines that will get attention. This one obviously does.
As for the article, I’m torn. Many Western parents should push their kids more, regardless of what people are doing in China. Nothing pisses me off more than when people give up on things before they even make a decent effort.
That being said, what happens to the kids in these types of families when the don’t meet expectations? They end up as grease marks on the sidewalk.
Wow.
First of all, Chinese mothers can’t be the best in the world because Korean mothers already wear that badge. Duh.
Secondly, is this what Chinese Nationalism Bullshit looks like?
Thirdly, those daughters of hers don’t look 100% Chinese to me. Could mommy be praising Chinese mom’s to make up for being a “race traitor” to Western Jed?
Speaking of stereotypes: Asian dragonlady alert!
I like how she uses the term “Chinese mothers” to mean only mothers that are uberstrict on their progeny. One doesn’t seem to have to be Chinese to qualify, nor does being Chinese qualify one.
I’d love to see how her two robo-daughters stack up to my niece and nephews in 20 and 30 years from now.
Wow.
That’s the spirit Pawikirogii. It’s better just to be the best god damn office worker ever hired the month I started after graduating college. To hell with an imagination, I excel at mediocrity!
What did you score on the mediocrity test you took?
The way she poses in those photos, I think she is perfectly fine with the headline.
Seems like the author of “World on Fire: How Exporting Free Market Democracy Breeds Ethnic Hatred and Global Instability” is stoking ethnic hatred.
She says, “By contrast, the Chinese believe that the best way to protect their children is by preparing them for the future, letting them see what they’re capable of, and arming them with skills, work habits and inner confidence that no one can ever take away.” I know a lot of Chinese parents that do not instill inner confidence in their children. Verbal abuse is more like it.
Also wonder if one of her kids will still be speaking to her once they graduate from college.
Anyhow, western parents do need to be more school oriented than they are presently, and some of that includes more rote memorization that has been so long derided.
So Amy Chua THINKS she is superior?
……As an adult, I once [called her daughter] garbage in English when she acted extremely disrespectfully toward me.
…..Chinese mothers can say to their daughters, “Hey fatty—lose some weight.”
….Chinese parents can order their kids to get straight As.
….That’s why the solution to substandard performance (getting A- instead of A+) is always to excoriate, punish and shame the child.
….Chinese parents believe that they know what is best for their children and therefore override all of their children’s own desires and preferences.
…..Chinese children must spend their lives repaying their parents by obeying them and making them proud.
I call that child abuse, her children never had a childhood, and we all know what happens to adults who grow up without having a proper childhood.
Western parents try to respect their children’s individuality, encouraging them to pursue their true passions, supporting their choices, and providing positive reinforcement and a nurturing environment. – Yet, Amy thinks this is inferior?
“I call that child abuse…”
I think that she acknowledges this in there, no?
and the children who were abused need to repay their parents?
wait until she is elderly and see how the children repay her.
“BEIJING: Grappling with rapidly greying population, many of whom live in isolation and poor conditions, China is considering amending a law to make it mandatory for its citizens to visit their elderly parents and attend to their spiritual needs.”
audience, ask these folks whether they think westerners are more creative and see what they say. the objections raised here are simply an indication that these people think people from the west are better than everybody else. ask if they think westerners are more creative than asians. that way, you can see their hypocrisy.
We all thought so…
then we met you.
Substitute the word “Korean” for “Chinese” and the result is OECD’s leading suicide rate as a result of all that parental pressure. Knock yourself out, Chinese mom.
And, WTF is “have a playdate?”
My Western mother was incredibly strict on me too. She expected A’s (and nearly always got them, except in handwriting). B’s were not tolerated. Could she be part Chinese?
Hon, I hope you won’t become a strict parent.
I agree this mother is sick and that some middle needs to be found, still i find this glorificaiton of supposedly great American creativity quite frankly a little perplexing.
Now what is the purpose of Western civilization ? Fill up the world with failed rockstars (hey i got news for you, music is dead, ever heard of Nuendo ?), aspiring screenwriters, drugged up dj’s, derivative fashion designers and such ? A population of buffoons aspiring to be prima donna at the local circus while airports and other basic infrastructures go belly up after a few snowflakes ?
You know i barely buy anything American (even indirectly) while i can hardly imagine myself living without Asian products.
Wake up the world can survive perfectly fine without your shitty outdated rock and hip hop, without your clichè movies (k and hk flicks are way more fun) and without Warren Buffett too as liquidity is pretty slush around the world.
Maybe a little less emphasis on creativity and a little more on hard sciences wouldn’t be that bad
I don’t read the Wall Street Journal often, but in the past it was a respectable publication, right? Has the WSJ lost all credibility? I mean, this article was just pure trolling. Does the WSJ often have articles like this?
This might be a possible cause: The Wall Street Journal is now owned by News Corporation whose founder is Rupert Murdoch who is married to a Chinese lady.
My son comes from the Philippines and has been in the US for exactly six months, which means we have been playing catch-up on many subjects, including English. Nevertheless, my son has recently been recognized academically as being one of the top ten 6th-graders at his school for the third 6-week period. His school has over 200 6th-graders.
The reason he is doing so well in school is that I tutor him in his school subjects two hours a night, from 7 to 9. We also read one library book each week. That means my son has from 3:30 to 7 during the school week for sports and other extracurricular activities. I think that is a good balance of study and play because kids’ brains can handle only so much studying each day, and they need playtime to learn social skills.
Chinese and Korea mothers who force their kids to spend all their time studying could be turning them into social misfits or even driving them to suicide. On the other hand, American parents who think their kids get enough study time by just sending them to school each day are fooling themselves. Kids need study time outside of school to keep up with all that they are studying in school. These days 6th-graders are being taught things that I did not learn until high school.
By having my son balance both study and play, I think I am the superior parent.
Maybe a little less emphasis on creativity and a little more on hard sciences wouldn’t be that bad
You still need creativity when you reach the level of Einstein.
Hence, nothing major to have come in terms of physics since his time, and certainly not from China. (ok, maybe some from the Chinese expats/exiles) Actually it’s amazing as there are so many people in that country – i.e. you usually find the world’s fattest, shortest, tallest you’d find it’s only a statistical probability that they have more capable people. Maybe these mothers are stifling it.
blockquote Gangpeh’s comment.
However, I also have doubts on whether creativity is also something that can be nurtured. It’s up to the individual to find a productive channel for its release (such as making too many consecutive comments on a blog) – parents can do jack.
I admit there are some disciplines (classical music) which one needs to get upto a certain standard to be able to be creative – Mozart and Beethoven’s fathers must have been the forefathers of the Chinese mothers..but it’s exhausted itself in terms of genre of music, so Asian parents imposing this on their children really show the lack of creativity on their side..
You’re on the right track Yuna. Beethoven’s father was a mean SOB that pushed his son at mastering the piano. Genius and creativity are unplanned, unpredictable factors that defy prescription. If the Chinese are so creative, as a society, why could “Kungfu Panda” only come from a non-Chinese effort?
#24: There are a lot more outlets for creativity than music and screenwriting. Technical innovation requires a lot of creativity–that’s why the Chinese will always be followers, not leaders.
gbevers sounds like he’s doing the right thing.
The Chinese Mom has eliminated most of the joy from her children’s lives, which is simply unnecessary. On the other hand, American kids these days really lack self discipline. Learning a skill, like any job or life, isn’t always fun, all the time. It takes perseverence and dedication. I teach at a university in the US and often see kids who can’t read a college textbook – either because they lack the ability, the motivation, or both. They also won’t take correction, and they won’t take responsibility for doing a b.s. job.
Here’s a quote for those who think playing around is all you need to be creative: “Genius is 1% inspiration, and 99% perspiration,” from the creator of the light bulb.
You can’t come up with good ideas unless you’ve done your homework. You also can’t come up with good ideas if you’re ‘Chinese Mom’s’ robot kid. There’s got to be a balance – unfortunately many Americans aren’t doing their homework.
A few weeks ago someone (yuna?) posted a comment w/ links to the dorm rooms of Chinese uni students. Pigs live cleaner lives. Whose Chinese mum is to blame? Or is it when not firmly under mummy’s thumb these kids become savage? Like Lord of the Flies.
Wolf babies . . .
The author was speaking from Asian-American mothers, of course being Asian in White dominant society Asian parents wants their children to excel academically, this is why Chinese American have failed to produced sportsman to entertainers, not all Chinese American are turned out tobe successful. All I see is their usually Chinese commie styled child minding management from her essay. If what she wrote is true then why there’s so many screwed Chinese from China? They should have least taught their kids to wash their hair and take shower regularly because Chinese kids smells.
Everything aside, the US is still a leader in hard sciences, as well. Offer any scientist a job in the US vs. China, and I’m going to bet big that that scientist is going to choose the United States, no matter how much you think the world can live with out it. I’m Canadian, so it says a lot that I’M saying this.
As with most things, the best method usually falls somewhere between the two extremes.
On the Western side, it is completely frustrating to see a bright child not receive the firm guidance needed to excel in life. It is maddening to encounter mouthy brats who are products of the self-esteem movement.
On the Eastern side, it is heartbreaking to watch a child of average abilities shutdown because doing his level best will never, ever be good enough. Enduring the slave-driving approach to parenthood is probably not much fun to the smart/talented kids, but at least it will show great returns in most cases. The real problem is many kids who are so obviously *not* SKY/Ivy League material are pushed as if they were.
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/08/11/business/economy/11expats.html?_r=1
You know how many white boys, and girls, i heard recently telling me they’re sick of the UK/US/insert-whatever-bankrupted-shithole-you-want-here and would move to Asia, provided the opportunity ?
checked the per capita patents statistics lately ?
Let’s just check the stock market, what new great success story it has been produced in the last 10 years in the US ? We had the Google IPO in 2004, the Apple reinvention and possibly in the future the listing of Facebook (if it doesn’t go the way of MyShit). Other than that if you take a quick look at the S&P 500, one of the worst performing stock benchmarks in the last decade, you see how the bigest companies are pretty much still the same shit, a collection of the Microsoft, 3M and Exxon of this world.
i think # 32 has some valid points to whom # 33 responded appropriately
And i wouldn’t discount the Chinese contribution to the world of ideas either: they are proving that a stalinist autocratic country can succesfully compete economically without changing their system too much. It might be a repellent paradigm around Berkley or the LSE but it attracts billions of people around the world.
“You know how many white boys, and girls, i heard recently telling me they’re sick of the UK/US/insert-whatever-bankrupted-shithole-you-want-here and would move to Asia, provided the opportunity ?”
I usually don’t agree with Bastardo, but his comment above is accurate: say whatever you guys wanna say about US and Western Europe: these countries offer NOTHING these days.
I’m pretty sure that good mothers are superior to bad mothers; but I don’t think it’s DNA or even culture.
Maximus (#40),
The US and Western Europe offer “Nothing”? What about education? My son is getting a good education at a public school here in Texas, where his textbooks are impressive, especially his 6th-grade Math textbook.
My son attended a private school in the Philippines through the 5th grade and liked his school there, but he said his school here in Texas is better because his teachers are more interesting and there is less disruption in class, which was something that surprised me.
If the US and Western Europe offer “NOTHING,” why do so many Korean and Chinese students want to study here in the US and Western Europe?
“Wake up the world can survive perfectly fine without your shitty outdated rock and hip hop”
This is really strange coming from someone who seems to worship the most puerile cheese music known to man.
^ How dare you! Is that anyway to speak to G Dragon’s #1 groupie?
Here’s a thoughtful, humorous look at Chua’s piece:
http://www.chinahearsay.com/amy-chua-model-chinese-parent-or-insufferable-elitist/
I worship it the same way i worship a tasty hot giant triple whopper at BK…wait a second, that’s American i’m not supposed to enjoy it
Well i’ll readily concede that America among the Western nations is still the one in the best position, due to her flexibility and her drive to succeed, i wouldn’t be surprised if she re-geared herself into an engineering giant. At least people there seem to be more and more aware of the current problems, Europe what you wanna say about it, it ain’t been said already ?
#44: a nonstop-giggle inducer
(p.s. Sorry, YB. Just couldn’t help it.)
#38 Ms. Choi,
Hear, hear – I was thinking the same thing.
Is Ms. Chua serious . . . or ironic? I caught some irony and even self-parody in her article, but she seemed, deep down, to be utterly serious.
I showed the article to my wife, who as a Korean mother pushes our kids to study, and she was appalled by Ms. Chua — though sharing my question as to how seriously to take the article.
On one point, I would agree with what some have said, namely, creativity is also not easy and requires great effort and a lot of knowledge. But I doubt that Ms. Chua’s method nourishes creativity.
Balance is necessary. Require children to study, and expect good grades from them, but let them play, too, and definitely allow them to have their own interests. Their interests can be incorporated into education.
For instance, my son, En-Uk, is currently a fanatic about soccer and is always asking where some country or city is located. I showed him how to use Wikipedia, and he’s now looking up countries, cities, and teams on his own, so he learns spelling, reading, and geography, among other things.
I could say much the same about my daughter, Sa-Rah, who’s passionate enough about music to enjoy reading together with me a New York Times article on the rage for melisma in pop music and its recent decline. She was fascinated.
I have always tutored my kids in English and had them reading from a young age, and I expect their best, but I don’t expect them to be the best. That approach leads to children who will always consider themselves failures if they aren’t the best . . . which will be almost all of the time.
Jeffery Hodges
* * *
I started to watch it… and then was infected with the AIDS. Thanks, bud.
Slim was far too complimentary in calling this genre “puerile cheese music”.
Speaking of Slim, I visited his link to chinahearsay (above), a site that provided a link to this discussion. Based on the surnames it appears almost all of the commenters are Asian. There are several tragedies there.
Of Ms Chau I’m kind of a fan. She’s right that western kids are far too mollycoddled. They need to eat some bitterness. And kids do need direction and a firm hand to guide them. In her taking it too far I believe her kids will have issues someday; I hope for Ms Chua’s sanity her daughters don’t resort to acts described at the quora blog I linked to. Some of these “Tiger Mothers” have been shattered.
Perhaps Ms Chau is compensating for something. Given her background and her lifelong achievements I doubt she needs to live vicariously through her daughters. If I had to guess, I think her issues are that she defied her parents by not marrying a well-born ethnic Chinese fella and she hasn’t borne a son. Betcha Ms Chau’s mother is a real charmer.
“Hon, I hope you won’t become a strict parent.”
Beautiful, I’ll be whatever kind of parent you need me to be.
Why doesn’t Dragonlady Chau mention her most famous daughter? Knives Chau? That was certainly her greatest creation <3
"They should have least taught their kids to wash their hair and take shower regularly because Chinese kids smells."
–one of my favorite Korean stereotypes about the "Chiness." Really… posted here by koreasentry?!?
"If I had to guess, I think her issues are that she defied her parents by not marrying a well-born ethnic Chinese fella…"
–Duh.
“You know how many white boys, and girls, i heard recently telling me they’re sick of the UK/US/insert-whatever-bankrupted-shithole-you-want-here and would move to Asia, provided the opportunity ?”
–This whiteboy already has. Remeber when I said I was planning on leaving soon? …umm…well…
Slim, that response about Chau being an insufferable elitist was right on the money. Thanks for the find.
One could say that Asia’s winners go West and the West’s misfits go East, but that would be mean, mean, mean.
On the other hand, I doubt that any nice (Jewish) kids (do non-Jews even study the piano anymore?) whose parents followed Amy Chua’s advice would ever go East in the frist place, or stay very long if they did.
Not that there’s anything wrong with that….Really!
DLB
#19, The very fact that Westerners do not flee to the East in order to seek a better life in droves proves that westerners have every right to dismiss this woman’s claims. Nice to sit back and claim superiority when you are the product of immigration and assimilation. When Western born people start immigrating to Beijing or Seoul for a better life and force their children to learn Eastern ways of thinking, then maybe she can gloat.
Correction, take Seoul out and just leave Beijing.
DLB, your “Asia’s winners go West and the West’s misfits go East” @55 is dangerously close to my 53.
@slim – agreement with valkilmerasdf@54, good link thx.
It would be really bad if all the “creativity-prone” people were to essentially say the same thing: “Easterners” aren’t creative, and Westerners are, and therefore “our” civilization is better.
For my part, I saw a lot of creativity in Korea during my time there, and amongst the expat Korean population here.
Anyway, this article gave me a whole new understanding of where the “Chinese mother” is coming from: I think that bit about self-esteem and fragility goes to the heart of the issue, and I think that most Western parents could expect more of their children without actually doing the same things that the WSJ author has done.
–
By the way, to #56: it would be fairly safe to say that most of us here at the MH have “fled” to the East in some sense. And quite a few of those who have gone to either Japan or Korea have found an organized, hospitable country with a very high standard of living and a very low rate of crime–and a lot of wonderful surprises.
Let me ask again, are westerners more creative than easterners? Why nobody wanna answer? Hmmm, I wonder why. No westerners going to Asia? That’s true….for now. PS I am g dragons biggest fan. If yangchi says he is, then I will challenge him to a dual in which only one of us will be left to listen to ‘heartbreaker’ over and over again. I love k pop!
And then there’s an interesting opinion at the KT:
http://www.koreatimes.co.kr/www/news/opinon/2011/01/166_79431.html
“Whatever kind of parent you need me to be”
Honey, I’m sure you’ll make a wonderful dad.
Have a good one.
I think that the lady actually makes a few good points. She doesn’t let her kids give up, and she helps them to achieve their goals. She might be a bit batshit crazy, but I agree that by not letting a kid give up on something that is probably better than just saying to hell with everything.
She is a professor at Yale though, so it is probably safe to assume that the other parents that she deals with are probably other professors or upwardly mobile people. It is a bit unfair to paint all Chinese and all American people in the same broad brush strokes. There are probably parents in China who let their kids do whatever, and of course there are the psycho sports dads, the crazy beauty pageant moms, and other people who ride their kids pretty hard.
The lady is actually pretty lucky, since she has a husband to help out with the kids. She makes the mistake of describing the average American family as one with a mother and a father. Again, she is describing things from an Ivy League bubble, not every family finds it easy to provide for their kids.
Lastly, she should go move in with the Amish. Apart from the music, I think that she would fit right in.
The lady is actually pretty lucky, since she has a husband who has not yet been scared away. She frightens me.
For the sake of comparison, here’s the polar opposite: http://www.nytimes.com/2011/01/11/education/11class.html
It stresses useless skills like “inclusiveness”
Lessons are a series of complex choreographies. In the 2,000-square-foot kindergarten, for example, each child is assigned a “university”— a grouping by skill level — and another group by color: blue, red or green.
Every 40 minutes or so, the children regroup in a different part of the room. During a visit in November, an observer noticed that each move led to the children’s standing up, running, talking, and then having to quiet down again.
Sounds like a Korean kindergarten and Hagwon.
I recall vaguely a Koheler post a few months ago about how Singapore was the most desired immigration destination in the world.
Also well don’t you agree that the West has a gigantic unqualified immigration problem ?
America attracts lots of talent but it also seem to attract the very lowly educated and the criminal fringe, Europe’s the same minus the talent part.
Question…is it really such an advantage and a sign of economic success, let alone a policy with some sense, opening the gates to millions and millions of people with stomachs to fill up and nothing more than their arms to offer ?
When robots (probably made in Korea) will make obsolete the labour intensity of some menial services, what the West will do with the masses of Moroccans, Mexicans, Romanians, Hondurenos etc. etc. ?
^ Oi, ya ‘eard of soylent green, ain’t ya?
i had to google it, you’re asking me for too much…my view of the world was actually shaped by hokuto no ken
Ann Hulbert over at Slate.com has a review for the Chua book here: http://www.slate.com/id/2280712/
I found this particular bit at the very end worthwhile:
Ouch! Oh Snap! Zing! BURNED!!
On a completely tangential note, Professor Chua’s pretty easy on the eyes.
If Asian-American women “rebel” against tyrannical Asian papas by dating and marrying white guys then question: how will the well-bred but psychologically traumatised and mostly Caucasian-looking mixed daughters of a Model Minority overachievement Taliban of a Chinese mama and a Dickless Wonder of a Jewish papa “rebel” when they come of age?
@NetizenKim:
Why do you even care?
Well, this has turned into the usual slagfest all over the Internet, but if you read through the comments on Quora that Seouldout linked to (in comment #50), it turns out that all is not as it seems to be.
In fact, Ms. Chua replied via email to one commentor’s particularly heartbreaking story (see the top comment from a Ms. Lu), stating that she has largely stepped away from this style of parenting, after her one of her daughters rebelled against her. The long subtitle of the overall book (right there on the front cover) is “This was supposed to be a story of how Chinese parents are better at raising kids than Western ones. But instead, it’s about a bitter clash of cultures, a fleeting taste of glory, and how I was humbled by a thirteen-year-old.”
So in that context (which is woefully missing from the WSJ piece), it would appear that what she wrote is at least partly tongue-in-cheek, and/or self-mocking of her own previous attitudes. Sorry to burst the bubble with some sanity, but then again, the whole Web seems to have run away with this one.
Then again, according to the Slate review (per Tilly’s link)–assuming the reviewer has access to the whole book–perhaps that self-congratulatory tone extends through more of the book. It sounds like, by the daughters’ reviews, that some things are still not yet sorted out.
And the amount of pride and lack of self-criticism required for the very act of writing a book about how to produce Ivy League prodigies and Carnegie Hall virtuosi, is somewhat stunning.
I don’t know what she, the hapa, will do. I know what she won’t do. She won’t pretend to be your girlfried, she won’t ask you to accompany her to the Korean meatspace, and she won’t blow you off after the the plane touches down on the runway. Only the 100% pure ones can bamboozle you like that.
Here’s another interesting take from Julianne Hing-guest blogging for Ta-Nehisi Coates at the Atlantic.com:
Link: http://www.theatlantic.com/culture/archive/2011/01/thoughts-from-the-daughter-of-a-chinese-mother/69286/
(Do be sure to read through the comment sections as well. Some very thoughtful responses.)
Every damn story involving a Chinese daughter and her mother sounds like a badly rehashed Amy Tan novel.
This Amy Chua is a monstrosity. Her whole life and identity is a gigantic cliché . I’m glad I’m not psychopathically mind-fucked like her.
NetizenKim writes:
Well, given the the vast quantities of drivel you write, you would know.
My Korean mother, Dad died when I was 4, allowed me and my older brother and sister some social life. It was always on her terms.
One time my best friend Karen came to the house and asked if I could go out with her. Mom said no, I had to practice the piano. I got a sudden brainstorm. Karen went and found my brother’s old saxophone. I did practice but the music was closer to New Orleans bordello than classical. Mom ran the two of us out of the house. The saxophone was never seen again.
Another lesson in life- Never start a circumcision debate between Korean and Italian grandmothers. I have more stories. One day I’ll publish them but after Mom is dead. She turns 80 next month and she is still going strong.
@75 lol.
@77
yeah, we’d all hate for you to take to writing racebased horseshit too.
@79
Noted, thanks.
Methinks that any Asian female who has tainted herself with the white devil’s seminal fluid has earned NK’s ire.
Methinketh this Middle English impersonal construction with similarity to the middle voice in other languages is much overused.
Jeffery Hodges
* * *
Jeff,
It’s legit, particularly in a humorous usage.
http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/methinks
Let me guess. You’ve never been to China. Quel suprise!
If being “Chinese” is what makes her a “superior” mother, why’d she marry a Jew? Why not marry a Chinese man and have even more superior children? I saw her in an interview yesterday and she comes across as extremely arrogant.
I think everybody needs to take a chill pill here. If you read the tone of the article, I’m almost positive it wasn’t written to be 100% serious. There are underlying sarcastic tones here. Amy Chua probably is more American than Chinese (as the article points out that she came to the US when she was a baby), married a Caucasian, and is highly educated. She is selling her book here with this excerpted article and I’m sure it was written with extreme examples to serve her agenda (or possibly some kind of wake-up call or shock-value message). After all, her point about not letting kids play the piano or violin was obviously written to elicit some kind of smirk (since we all know that many Asians played one of those instruments at one point in their lives!).
texasleeshi,
I can’t speak for all Chinese ladies, but I did date one that was into Jewish guys. Her rationale? They are the White Chinese! Generally have good white collar jobs, highly value education, have traditional values, have close knit families, take extended families very seriously, value heritage and traditional culture, etc.
‘probably is more American than Chinese (as the article points out that she came to the US when she was a baby), married a Caucasian,’
whaaat? you mean if you’re colored and marry a white, you’re more american? are you more korean being with a k gal or does this just apply to asian females? think before you write.
I really don’t think “Chinese Moms” are too different from “Type A” moms – there are dozens of them in my daughter’s preschool (all non-Asian). I like Hsiao-Ching Chou’s idea of “a new generation of Tiger Mom” – moms who grew up with a Tiger Mom and are now trying to balance the Eastern and Western approach to parenting with their own kids. It’s in this article:
http://www.redtri.com/are-chinese-moms-superior
After reading these comments, it was quite fortuitous that MSNBC had this – perhaps it’s been up for a few days.
http://today.msnbc.msn.com/id/41005969/ns/today-books/
While I personally encountered no tiger mothers, I have met a few dragon ladies, but the birds outnumbered them both. I’d like to think she wrote much of that tongue-in-cheek.
You know what would be funny? If Amy Chua’s kids end up being burned out underachievers. Not saying they would be, but you never know. Her kids are what? Still teenagers? It’s too soon to be tooting your horn Ms. Chua.
However, having said that, I am surprised by a lot of reaction to Ms. Chua’s basic premise. I think there has been too much defensiveness. Also, my take on Chua’s premise is not that Eastern methods of raising kids are better than Western methods, etc. My take away is that high-quality immigration will continue to add vitality and strength to America, as Slate put it (when discussing Chua’s book):
Let’s go to a third of forth generation Chinese family in America and see just how “strict” they are.
WangKon936, that story had a bad ending, and in any case Slate was not saying in that example what you claim (though presumably Slate would agree with you, as do I).
@WangKon #87:
“I can’t speak for all Chinese ladies, but I did date one that was into Jewish guys. Her rationale? They are the White Chinese! Generally have good white collar jobs, highly value education, have traditional values, have close knit families, take extended families very seriously, value heritage and traditional culture tolerate blatant bigotry toward outgroups, etc.”
Fixed.
Jeff Yang clarifies much here http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/g/a/2011/01/13/apop011311.DTL
Seems the WSJ, without Chua’s input, did he kind of sloppy ass cut-and-paste job we might expect from the Korea Times.
the kind of…
We don’t need the obtuse racism of #93 here.
@88 pawi…instead of telling me to think before I write, why don’t you READ before you write. My assumption that the author was more “American than white” isn’t from the fact that she married an American…I put in parenthesis that it’s because she was raised here in the USA…so, she is more American than Chinese. How is that not clear??
watched her interview on the Today Show or whatever. She looks pretty when she’s not talking (could say this about a lot of girls were I a misogynist), but when her mouth is open, something seems amiss. Her face seems to move in ways that it shouldn’t, and not in ways that it should.. botox and/or sliced nerves during some 성형수술?
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