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Open Thread #56
This entry was written by Robert Koehler, posted on July 5, 2008 at 12:38 pm, filed under Open Thread. Bookmark the permalink. Follow any comments here with the RSS feed for this post.
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Check out 280 Slides. Three guys working on porting part of the Mac OS X GUI infrastructure to JavaScript. And showing off the results in a web-based port of Keynote. Amazing…
Who’s going to Gwanghwamun today?
This is the weirdest day — with the directions things have been going, nothing, absolutely nothing would surprise me. If it goes off smoothly and peacefully, if a million people show up, if it goes violent three police and five protesters are beaten to death, finger-chopping, self-immolation, totally peaceful proceedings — NOTHING would surprise me.
An excerpt from a paper by Jae-Ho Cha, citation below.
“Korean Personality as Revealed in Behaviors
[W]e will focus on the behaviors that persisted throughout the periods studied. Some 62 behavior categories were shown to have remained relatively stable [] Only the dimensions or “dispositions” indicated will be presented and discussed here.
The first disposition has to do with emotionality. According to the data, the Koreans are emotional. The categories suggesting this dimension in the Korean people are: their being emotionally labile or rich in emotions and affects, their tendency to suppress their emotions and desires, their remembering favors or disfavors for a long time, and their tendency to be shy and emotionally unstable. This disposition seems to describe a feminine personality.
The second disposition is a dependent attitude. The specific categories suggesting this trait or dimension are: inability to assume responsibility, begging and expecting forgiveness after making mistakes, overprotection of children, blaming others for faulty outcomes, thanklessness, inability to abide by the laws and regulations if not under surveillance, and inability to proceed without the backing of family or group. It is obvious that many, if not all, of these categories are linked to collectivism.
The third disposition is affiliative tendency. Relevant categories include: displaying excessive kindness, holding official meetings in restaurants, inability to contradict others in conversation, inability to speak out forthrightly for fear of offending others, expressing thoughts in circuitous ways, being self-conscious about overtaking superiors, appointing people to official positions on the basis of personal relationships, and tendency to make friends quickly. This trait apparently is also related to collectivism.
The fourth disposition is hospitableness. This dimension is closely related to the third dimension, but warrants a separate treatment because of the specific context involved. The relevant categories include: behaving kindly to others (foreigners and fellow Koreans alike), being hospitable to guests, and being cordial to guests. This tendency seems to reflect the feminine side of the Korean people.
The fifth disposition may be labeled as irrationality. This dimension is not easily defined, but it generally involves acting in a way that does not make good economic and scientific sense and an inability to plan or to think in terms of universal values, goals, or principles. The categories suggesting this dimension are: inability to make long-term decisions, changing plans often on the basis of divinations, paying salaries even when no work is done, serving food and drinks without ever asking the preferences of the one being served, exchanging bribes, refusing to stay away from children ailing with contagious diseases, thinking and behaving irrationally, tending to put form ahead of substance, concern for saving face and inability to admit one’s weaknesses or shortcomings, encouraging rote learning (which does not allow place for the question “why?”); lack of flexibility in thinking and creativity, and inability to abstract and reason. As Hofstede (1991) has shown, many of these categories are indicative of a collectivist culture, and still others appear to be indicative of weak uncertainty avoidance.
The sixth disposition is high concern for education. The relevant categories are: feverish concern on the part of parents for educating children, confining children in the house to drill book learning, and eagerness toward getting education. Its implication in terms of culture dimensions is not clear.
Finally, the seventh disposition is concern for hierarchy. The relevant categories are: strict distinction between the superior and the inferior positions, reluctance for overtaking superiors, modesty shown in attributing one’s achievements to parents or to the head of state, and a tendency to turn suddenly over-bearing toward someone who is shown to be a sang’nom (a commoner or a man of law birth). This dimension undoubtedly is closely related to high power distance.
The Basic Korean Personality-Now we can describe the basic personality of the Korean people as nearly as possible in terms of these seven dispositions: The Koreans are: (1) emotional (2) dependent (3) affiliation-oriented (4) hospitable (5) irrational (6) eager for education, and (7) hierarchy-minded. Some of these dispositions can be “explained” in terms of collectivism and power distance. In addition, some of the categories indicate weak uncertainty avoidance and femininity. The “personality data” seem to differ from the culture data, in that the personality data suggest a weak uncertainty avoidance, whereas culture dimension scores indicate a strong uncertainty avoidance.”
Jae-Ho Cha, Korean Culture and Personality, - Korean Personality in Relation to Its Culture -, Korean and Korean American Studies Bulletin, Vol. 7, No. 1/2, Summer/Fall, pp. 6-22, 1996
Where are the protests against the import of the Chilean pork and the Korea-Chile FTA?
I wanna know so I can go to them.
See also SproutCore — Cocoa for the Web. Apple owns the future of computing.
#3: Bingo! Any chance you could post this paper online? Save a trip to the library.
f*ck the seattle mayor and council. and wa state legislature. and howard shultz.
#6. Pretty interesting, huh? I don’t think I would put the whole paper online without author’s permission… I looked to see if I could find a copy of it online, but couldn’t. Sorry.
#8: Well, could you tell us where Cha (Prof., Dr., Mr.) is working? Many professors have their articles online. Or I could email him for a copy. Or alas as a last resort I could make an arduous trip to the library to copy the thing. I noticed that SNU has the series, but the library closes in a few hours.
#7
Thank god I don’t have to go to Oklahoma.
Truth be told, I don’t think anything’s going to happen in Gwanghwamun… at least as far as the counter-protest is concerned.
Of course, I could be wrong.
#9. email me at jsk.hanglo[at]gmail.com — I’ll give you those details.
Yeah, it’s as likely as not that the whole thing’s going to go off without anything getting out of hand, and in retrospect, it’ll be remembered as the death-rattle, as people get sick of this bullshit… But I’m not ruling out ANYTHING, given the players, and their behaviour so far.
Still, I like to imagine the civil groups, the police, the counter-protesters, King Baeksu, Lee Hoi-Chang, the North Korean defector honour guard and the rest, getting ready for the night like this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QpaS2v-r7cE
Rob, I like it. I was picturing something closer to the intro scenes in Gangs of New York, but your choice may be more realistic. However, if there is alot of singing, particularly here in Korea, I would think there’d be more time in front of mirrors involved and instead of “Tonight”, they might instead choose “I Feel Pretty”.
Regardless of the leadup and aftermath I hope people bring cameras.
As it is summer in all (if you are in the northern half of the world) I remember bathing once at the Hang River park pools 한강공원수영장 and despite the abundance of talent to look at I was baffled by two things.
1) Why on Earth do I have to get out of the pool after I just got in and wait 15-20 minutes? Forced ‘rest time’ as I was told. Apparently it is a safety thing but I want a logical reason! The water is not being cleaned, life guards aren’t changing shifts of getting a feed. Also looks a funny sight driving along the 88 on a hot day and not one person is in the pool with crowds sitting around it.
2) Why are all the apartments on the south side (older style) facing away from the river — facing south? So facing the river are the stair cases and apartment doors and maybe a bathroom window. Is it a feng shui thing?
@1 You just crashed my browser.
Anyone know what, if anything is going on downtown Seoul? Wondering if there’s anything to check out down there. Don’t want to waste my time trekking down there if there’s not a lot of action to take it.
Hey CMM–I was downtown this afternoon and saw a group of kids heading for Kwanghwamun, and a lot of would-be protesters are milling about.
Also, a bunch of shamans and hookers are gathering at the Kyobo building. just kidding.
This monsoon has me thinking about a dryer but places like Costco are actually more expensive. Does anyone have any suggestions as to a decent place for bargins on dryers. Is the new electronics building by the Shin Yongsan KTX station any good for these things?
Yes, but not the giant Digital Park place itself. You’ll have to meander through the tunnel to the other side of the tracks. Much better deals in the hive that meanders between the tracks on the other side of Shin Yonsan and those major streets. I suggest taking the little green 2 shuttle bus, (you’ll have to catch it on the opposite side of the street from station itself otherwise you’ll just end up in Haebangchon), from Nam Yeon yeok to the stop just after the winding bridge that takes you into the digital market area, two stops before Shin Yongsan. The left side of the street is computers and musical devices while the right side, which you’ll get off on is more for home appliances. There’s a lot to choose from but much better prices than at the complex near the KTX terminal.
Although I do agree that some Koreans are making a big ass of themselves via the candlelight protests, I can’t help wonder that the expats and the kyopos are also making a big ass of themselves too.
What’s the difference between the Korean continually protesting against beef which he or she belives will lead to instant death, without considering the opposite view and the expat/kyopo who continually believes that the protesting Koreans are a “mindless mob”, without considering the opposite view? And what moral ground do the expat/kyopo have that gives them the right to diss the protestors?
Put it simply;
Korean Candlelight Protestor = Whining Expat/Kyopo
Business must be booming in the alleys behind Seoul Plaza hotel.
who would have ever thunk it? find following article at the wsj:
Regional Cities Vie
To Host Olympians
By SUNGHA PARK in Seoul and HIROKO TABUCHI in Tokyo
July 5, 2008
a tidbit:
‘For South Korea, hosting so many Olympic athletes holds symbolic significance. During the Seoul Olympics in 1988, the fast-growing nation still lacked advanced facilities, and many athletes chose to train in Japan. Accommodating numerous top athletes is a sign of how much South Korea has developed, says Ki Woo-kyoung, a member of the Korea Triathlon Federation. The group lured 12 triathlon teams, including those from the U.S., Hong Kong, Germany and the U.K., to Jeju Island.’
i can just see the steam coming out of you-know-who’s ear.
‘Bush assured Japan that the issue of North Korea’s past kidnappings of Japanese citizens will not be ignored by the United States. He told Fukuda that he was “fully aware of the sensitivity of the issue in your country” and that “the United States will not abandon you on this issue.”‘ cnn
i wonder if bush realizes how offensive this is to asians. to be concerned about a few japanese while saying nothing of the hundreds of thousands kidnapped by the japanese. man!
day of reconin is a comin
Dear white men and the woman of the marmot’s hole
I thought it to be criminal of me, not to post an opinion, noting the world events, and some blatant hypocrisy.
Stop comparing Koreans to your ancestors/relatives who have committed crimes on earth that have never been equaled. Colonialism and its crime aside, and the 2 world wars,
Please note that,
There are no Nazis in Korea. There are still Nazis in Germany, despite heavy, heavy education and re-education, and artificial promotion of interracial marriages. None of this exists, none of this government sponsored acceptance of other races, yet Korea is not a bit racist like your kind.
There is no Kim Jong Il-youth in Korea, al-gan? Babo shae-ki.
I can’t say nobody, but precious few in SOUTH Korea adore Kim Jong Il, much less are willing to die for him.
Stop sleeping with your Korean women, if you don’t have the balls to send the progeny to Korean public schools.
Better yet, DO NOT sleep with Korean women, sire a child, and run away back to the US.
You’re a fucker of all fuckers, deserving of being stoned to death, if you do something like that.
Ronald Reagan was nice enough to allow these Amerasians who could not prove US citizenship to gain US citizenship, but I’m not sure if future Amerasians in Korea can be so fortunate. Nor am I certain if that was a temporary measure or a permanent one.
Obama. Did you catch his shift in July? His platform was most solidly based on running away from the war in Iraq. Then, he considers staying a little while in Iraq. Then he wonders why his base is disapproving of him. Uh, that was the whole reason you got the primary vote, and you trumped Hill Clinton, dude.
Bush. Did you catch the US secret operation of getting weapons grade uranium out of Iraq towards the US? There are indeed WMD’s in Iraq, and a butt load more in Syria. Bush deserves his place in history, for making the world a better place.
Hey dude who settled into Indonesia,
You don’t find something wrong with their people? Didn’t the locals there use some racist ass tactics and blatant hatred to drive out the Chinese? Almost the same as how Germans drove out the Jews. You don’t find anything wrong with that? I don’t see you calling the Indonesians Neo-Nazis. You hypocrite. Will you ever get your ass bombed in Seoul for dancing in a night club as a tourist, the way you do in Bali? I didn’t think so. But, not a word about that from you. Yeah, you got integrity. Don’t get bombed in Bali. Oh, yeah, look up East Timor. Hypocrite. Truth denier.
Sonagi, those African American cast shows are all comedies, and African Americans have long been complaining that they are given sitcoms, where they are laughed at, but never serious dramas. You can discuss this with Metropolitan, if you desire. He’s strangely mute when it comes to things like this, for obvious reasons. He’d rather be on the train pointing out negatives about Korea. You claim to be a civil rights activists of sorts? How? This is common knowledge, that AA shows are virtually all comedies in North America. Only the white man doesn’t notice.
Yo, kyopo hypocrite.
Your pops slept with a Korean woman (your moms), yet didn’t have teh balls to send his progeny (that’s you) to Korean public schools.
Your hypocrisy and irrationality is why no one takes your comments seriously.
@23, the issue will never surface. While that regime is still there it’ll never care, and everyone involved have more pressing matters like averting WW3.
@25, don’t worry dogbert you probably won’t have any children of your own so don’t concern yourself with the irrationality of people choose to send their kids to school.
I did go to Korean public primary school, and I endured some, thus the air of superiority over the likes of other gyopos.
So long, and nice knowing you, Roger Federer!
“Dear white men and the woman of the marmot’s hole” … blah blah … “Stop comparing Koreans to your ancestors/relatives who have committed crimes on earth that have never been equaled. Colonialism and its crime aside, and the 2 world wars,”
Why does every asian pinhead with a chip on his shoulder and a smattering of history see “whites” and “white countries” as some big undifferentiated mass? As a Canadian I have to hang my head in shame for the two world wars, or colonialism in the Congo, according to wjk? Fuck you. My buddy from the Ukraine has to hang his head in shame over colonialism, although none of his ancestors ever engaged in it? How dumb an opinion is that?
According to your logic, wjk, you owe me an apology. You see, my great-uncles were captured by the Japanese, treated horribly, and one died. Their Japanese captors were Asian. You are Asian. So since you think all whites are historically the same, I’d like to follow your logic and demand you feel shame ‘as an Asian man or woman’ and apologize.
This “you’re all guilty by virtue of being born white” original-sin pomo crap, that you all seem to think is so logical, really falls apart with the slightest bit of a look at it.
No one is responsible for the crimes of other people. No age is reponsible for crimes committed before they were born. Anyone who says otherwise is simply trying to control through guilt.
And one more question to wjk: how can the indonesians driving out the chinese be termed racist when they are the same race? This sloppy use of language when talking about a subject as serious and important as racism doesn’t lead us to take you very seriously.
I hear this error a lot and it gets my goat. French Canadians are racist to English Canadians. America in Iraq is racist. Etc. Racism does require TWO DIFFERENT RACES, no? Between two ethnic groups of the same race we should use ‘prejudice’ or ‘discrimination’. Yes, I’m harping on a tiny point, but this is how words get devalued and lose all meaning. Soon, ‘racism’ will just get applied to any ‘that guy was nasty to that other guy’ situation.
I guess I’d have to go to a very special school to learn to decode English as atrocious as yours.
Yesterday, I saw a piece-of-crap Kia Pride parked on the street in my neighborhood. It looked like it its major function is to provide the most humiliating form of locomotion possible.
A piece-of-crap Kia Pride - with diplomatic plates.
This is not the first time I’ve seen a Crapmobile™ ply the street in my neighborhood. Someone with some sort of diplomatic status drives a rundown Hyundai Elantra. I’ve also seen a truly beat-up white Jeeep Cherokee whose most attractive feature was, in fact, its diplomatic plates.
What’s up with that? Have things gotten so desparate for foreign service personnel that they can no longer afford the sort of vehicles one would be proud to be assasinated in? Are there no minimum standards regarding the sort of hooptie the corps diplomatique can or cannot use?
Hopefully, folks in my neighborhood haven’t mistaken me for being the employee of some foreign government, because that would be embarassing.
Don’t look now, but the atrocity monger is back. I wonder how long he’s going to milk this shite:
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/200.....cutions_us
If you read long enough, you’ll even see a quote from Cumings.
GIVEN? Black entertainers don’t have to be given anything. The highest paid woman in entertainment is Oprah Winfrey. The highest paid movie actor is Will Smith. Jodie Foster became a producer because she wanted to make sure she could keep working as an actress by making movies with good roles for women. African-Americans can do the same. There are enough successful, wealthy African-American A-list entertainers to produce a quality TV drama with a black-dominated cast. As noted by another commenter on another thread, the white creator of The Wire doesn’t have a track record of making hit shows, yet The Wire ran for five seasons, so it wasn’t exactly a bomb.
#32: So you expect the junior political officer from East Krapistan to ride in an Equus? Or the dependent son of the U.S. naval attache (just making that up as a possibility)?
Back in the days when France had the draft — and the elite’s boys would dodge it with cushy “internships” in French embassies, Seoul had a slew of hand-me-downs with diplomatic plates [actually 준외] starting with 003 [France]. These cars would usually get parked wherever their temporary owner would feel like, and had exactly zero care over their life-span. They would be sold as a package by a departing “intern” to his successor, and after a few rounds, you can imagine how they’d look. I have a friend whose Scoupe, yes, Scoupe, died on the street, near the Shilla. Which is where he left it, until a tow truck could come. They were a fooking disgrace, but apparently nobody important in the Embassy was aware of the “image problem”.
I have seen only a few other crapmobiles with diplomatic plates, but they were usually from 3rd world countries, with 3-men embassies. Mongolia comes to mind
Keep dreaming.
The triathletes are going to Jeju because it’s very close to Beijing and the air there is infinitely better. I’ve just come back from Beijing and I was coughing up black/gray soot just from walking around. I can’t imagine competing for one day in that miasma, let alone training in it for weeks on end. Otherwise, Korea’s sparkling tourist infrastructure sucks. There simply aren’t enough decent places in which to stay and eat - or hold major conventions. My wife had an opportunity to have her local sub of a multinational host the annual worldwide distributors meeting - involving the participation of 10-15,000 people - but had to turn it down because the available venues are marginal and there just aren’t enough acceptable accommodations, e.g., there are essentially NO hotels @ Kintex in Ilsan (because of govt ineptitude in (mis)managing the development process - they could have had at least two major hotels if they hadn’t turned off the foreign investors by trying to force them into unwanted local “partnerships”.)
Okay, some of these comments are getting out of control. Anyway, I’ll reply to one.
@28:
He’s a cool dude, but I was getting tired of Federer always winning Wimbledon….especially when Nadal was just as good as him during at least the last two years. But today Nadal was just plain better…by a notch. Excellent match!
#36
“I have seen only a few other crapmobiles with diplomatic plates, but they were usually from 3rd world countries, with 3-men embassies. Mongolia comes to mind ”
Mongolian diplomats on crapmobiles? No Way.
All the public servants in Ulaanbaatar drives fancy cars.Here in Tokyo,the Mongolian ambassador is driving new Mercedes and I don’t want to think about where that money came from.
Wedge, of course I don’t think that everyone has to drive an Equus. I think you might agree, however, that a crumpled and crapped-out Kia Pride is a far step away from that. I mean, what does a car like that cost - W500,000 at most, right? Hell, it’s almost more of a liability than an asset.
really pisses you off, don’t it, spewy?
how’s your korean wife? btw, i only read your first sentence. so boring. so full of hate.
yawn.
korea, you’ve come a long way, baby. now, people actually choose you over japan. and not just cheju but chunchon too!
i am so proud!
What’s up with this KT headline?
http://www.koreatimes.co.kr/ww.....27135.html
“South Koreans Sweep US Golf Titles”
… and one of those “South Koreans” is Anthony Kim, who was born in the U.S. so that would make him an American, rather than South Korean national.
Wouldn’t a better title be “Ethnic Koreans Win US Golf Titles?”
Eh, probably would sell less papers…
I’d like to ask everyone for some advice regarding traveling in South Korea and Japan.
Because I’m a Korean native, I’m not very interested in traveling in South Korea, but I might have to travel there because my girlfriend wants me to take her to South Korea at the end of August. She also wants to see Japan.
Would you recommend any places in South Korea and Japan, such as cities, temples, castles, mountains, or anything,
that could be nice for a non-Asian female visitor? If we will decide to travel in those countries, we will stay in Korea for 6~7 days and in Japan for 3~4 days.
Any idea or opinion will be helpful and appreciated.
# 43,
Jejudo… especially the museum of sex…
Perhaps the Chosun Ilbo listened to my advice…
Thank you, Wankon. I’ll consider Jeju. A couple of people somewhere else suggested we go to Kyung-Joo. I’m personally interested in the Honam area because I’ve never been there before.
Kyoto is the place to go in Japan, but in August it’s hot there and can be unpleasant. If you’re not so keen on medieval stuff, Hokkaido will be nice. Fly in at Sapporo, and go to Otaru which is about an hour’s ride by train. Otaru is Meiji-era Japan frozen in time.
If you more have time, you should also go to Furano or Tokachi in the countryside. Maybe 3-4 hours one-way by bus or train. The mountains in the distance may be steaming, because they’re volcanoes.
typo, 1st sentence, 2nd para: “If you have more time”.
Also, don’t forget to try out the sea-urchin/crab/ikura(salmon roe) three-in-one-bowl at Sapporo/Otaru.
Hokkaido is great, but distances are huge for a short itinerary — and for the first-time visitor in search of “Japaneseness” (if that’s your quest), Hokkaido (Japan’s Alaska, for lack of a better comparison) is not terribly Japanese in the cultural sense.
Notwithstanding the heat, Kyoto/Nara or a combination of Tokyo and Tokyo day trips to Kamakura, Nikko, or Hakone would give you a decent if brief Japan experience. Mt Fuji is crowded in summer, and often obscured by clouds in the humid summer.
For accessible rustic experiences, I’ve always been fond of the coastal/mountainous regions of Toyama, Ishikawa, and Gifu prefectures, which have decent temples and more comfortable weather than Kyoto.
Thank you for the opinions on Japan. Because I don’t really know much about cities in Japan, your opinions are invaluable. I think the Kyoto&Nara trip is a great choice and will consider other cities mentioned above as well. I’ll appreciate any other opinions.