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	<title>Comments on: &#8216;No Contempt for Koreans&#8217;</title>
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	<link>http://www.rjkoehler.com/2008/07/04/no-contempt-for-koreans/</link>
	<description>Korea... in Blog Format</description>
	<pubDate>Wed,  3 Dec 2008 02:09:17 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: basilides</title>
		<link>http://www.rjkoehler.com/2008/07/04/no-contempt-for-koreans/#comment-168234</link>
		<dc:creator>basilides</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 05 Jul 2008 16:08:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rjkoehler.com/2008/07/04/no-contempt-for-koreans/#comment-168234</guid>
		<description>Oh, brother! You pulled out the "foreigners just don't understand Koreans" card a little too soon. As your homework read "Japan Unmasked," by De Mente, and you can substitute the word Korean for Japanese. On the cover there is this quote: "The Japanese are probably the most knowable and predictable people on Earth." -- George H. Lambert. Koreans ranks a very close second. Read especially Chapter 5: "Beware of Using Logic in Japan." What has this got to do with Korea? Everything.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Oh, brother! You pulled out the &#8220;foreigners just don&#8217;t understand Koreans&#8221; card a little too soon. As your homework read &#8220;Japan Unmasked,&#8221; by De Mente, and you can substitute the word Korean for Japanese. On the cover there is this quote: &#8220;The Japanese are probably the most knowable and predictable people on Earth.&#8221; &#8212; George H. Lambert. Koreans ranks a very close second. Read especially Chapter 5: &#8220;Beware of Using Logic in Japan.&#8221; What has this got to do with Korea? Everything.</p>
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		<title>By: Peter</title>
		<link>http://www.rjkoehler.com/2008/07/04/no-contempt-for-koreans/#comment-168215</link>
		<dc:creator>Peter</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 05 Jul 2008 14:02:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rjkoehler.com/2008/07/04/no-contempt-for-koreans/#comment-168215</guid>
		<description>#6: "Yes, Breen is feeling the heat. But he is right about one thing: Korean identity is racial, not national (Koreans don’t even have a nation; what they have is a northern Chinese colony facing a southern U.S., Japanese, and Chinese colony — militarily, economically, and culturally, that is)."

The comments I read from non-Koreans about Korea on the blogosphere are ironically very reminiscent of comments made by some earlier Western visitors to Korea in the first part of the 19th century.

Well, the above simply echoes what colonialists were saying prior to violating Korea’s sovereignty. Only in this case I think it just comes from built up resentment from living here for a while (understandable, but simplistic). I mean, in that case the US is a rip-off of European thought and society. The Enlightenment is just an imitation of medieval Islamic philosophy. Societies borrow, they influence, and they clash.

It sort of begs the question, though: is it that Korea has fundamentally not changed in its character? Or, rather, that non-Koreans continue to fail to understand what is essentially a very different and equally complex society? I think one thing is true: there is a tendency to measure Korea to certain standards that ultimately Korea will not live up to, simply because it is a different country, with a radically different history that has produced an outlook that is offensive, challenging, dynamic, and on the whole no better or worse than any other. 

On the other hand, it’s hard not to dismiss these comments. especially when you look around and see them proved day in and day out. Bulguksa, the temple in Gyungju, was restored by the Japanese, who said Koreans simply let their historical legacy fall to waste. I look around and see this type of neglect very often here in Korea.

Also, I remember once reading a comment about how, during the Tonghak rebellion, Koreans were seen by Westerners as simply walking by starving or rotting corpses, oblivious to the suffering around them. This too I see in Korea today. Whether it’s bus-drivers who could give a shit about the fact that you’ve got a child and a stroller while trying to balance on the bus. Or drivers who’d as soon run you down on the road as stop for you. And the homeless woman I pass daily who seems so alone in a sea of youngsters more concerned about their Converse than the fact that someone’s grandma is rotting in front of them. 

I see this, and yet I know the same is true for the US, Europe, or any other modern society. Hell, I walk by devouring my morning toast without as much as a glance these days.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>#6: &#8220;Yes, Breen is feeling the heat. But he is right about one thing: Korean identity is racial, not national (Koreans don’t even have a nation; what they have is a northern Chinese colony facing a southern U.S., Japanese, and Chinese colony — militarily, economically, and culturally, that is).&#8221;</p>
<p>The comments I read from non-Koreans about Korea on the blogosphere are ironically very reminiscent of comments made by some earlier Western visitors to Korea in the first part of the 19th century.</p>
<p>Well, the above simply echoes what colonialists were saying prior to violating Korea’s sovereignty. Only in this case I think it just comes from built up resentment from living here for a while (understandable, but simplistic). I mean, in that case the US is a rip-off of European thought and society. The Enlightenment is just an imitation of medieval Islamic philosophy. Societies borrow, they influence, and they clash.</p>
<p>It sort of begs the question, though: is it that Korea has fundamentally not changed in its character? Or, rather, that non-Koreans continue to fail to understand what is essentially a very different and equally complex society? I think one thing is true: there is a tendency to measure Korea to certain standards that ultimately Korea will not live up to, simply because it is a different country, with a radically different history that has produced an outlook that is offensive, challenging, dynamic, and on the whole no better or worse than any other. </p>
<p>On the other hand, it’s hard not to dismiss these comments. especially when you look around and see them proved day in and day out. Bulguksa, the temple in Gyungju, was restored by the Japanese, who said Koreans simply let their historical legacy fall to waste. I look around and see this type of neglect very often here in Korea.</p>
<p>Also, I remember once reading a comment about how, during the Tonghak rebellion, Koreans were seen by Westerners as simply walking by starving or rotting corpses, oblivious to the suffering around them. This too I see in Korea today. Whether it’s bus-drivers who could give a shit about the fact that you’ve got a child and a stroller while trying to balance on the bus. Or drivers who’d as soon run you down on the road as stop for you. And the homeless woman I pass daily who seems so alone in a sea of youngsters more concerned about their Converse than the fact that someone’s grandma is rotting in front of them. </p>
<p>I see this, and yet I know the same is true for the US, Europe, or any other modern society. Hell, I walk by devouring my morning toast without as much as a glance these days.</p>
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		<title>By: Blogs in Korea &#171; Korea Dispatch</title>
		<link>http://www.rjkoehler.com/2008/07/04/no-contempt-for-koreans/#comment-168213</link>
		<dc:creator>Blogs in Korea &#171; Korea Dispatch</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 05 Jul 2008 13:59:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rjkoehler.com/2008/07/04/no-contempt-for-koreans/#comment-168213</guid>
		<description>[...] A comment on the Marmot&#8217;s Hole: Yes, Breen is feeling the heat. But he is right about one thing: Korean identity is racial, not [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] A comment on the Marmot&#8217;s Hole: Yes, Breen is feeling the heat. But he is right about one thing: Korean identity is racial, not [...]</p>
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		<title>By: ElCanguro</title>
		<link>http://www.rjkoehler.com/2008/07/04/no-contempt-for-koreans/#comment-168088</link>
		<dc:creator>ElCanguro</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 04 Jul 2008 22:57:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rjkoehler.com/2008/07/04/no-contempt-for-koreans/#comment-168088</guid>
		<description>#23 - I misinterpreted your initial comment, though agree wholeheartedly with the statements you made.

Here's hoping with increased trade and contact with non-Koreans, and with God-forbid, some of the 'ink being spilled into the Han', Koreans will adapt a more accommodating approach to the issues of race, ethnicity and identity.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>#23 - I misinterpreted your initial comment, though agree wholeheartedly with the statements you made.</p>
<p>Here&#8217;s hoping with increased trade and contact with non-Koreans, and with God-forbid, some of the &#8216;ink being spilled into the Han&#8217;, Koreans will adapt a more accommodating approach to the issues of race, ethnicity and identity.</p>
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		<title>By: basilides</title>
		<link>http://www.rjkoehler.com/2008/07/04/no-contempt-for-koreans/#comment-168064</link>
		<dc:creator>basilides</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 04 Jul 2008 17:13:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rjkoehler.com/2008/07/04/no-contempt-for-koreans/#comment-168064</guid>
		<description>To #19 and #21: I said "Korean identity is racial," obvious to any firsthand observer, but I wasn't implying that Koreans were actually racially pure, or even a distinct race. How could they be, after enduring thousands of foreign invasions (as we are constantly reminded, and as one excuse for all the rabid enthnocentricity)? Be that as it may, biologists now regard the concept of race as a toxic fiction. See http://www.apa.org/journals/releases/amp60116.pdf. Korean culture is fundamentally fascist because it is based on race, delusional or otherwise. 
Recall this exchange (copied from Brian from ChollaNamdo):

Last Wednesday, major-generals from North and South Korea were chatting before a second day of tough talks on border security. The North's Major-General Kim Yong-chul noted that farmers must be hard at work. Indeed, replied South Korea's Major-General Han Min-gu. But since the rural population is falling, many are marrying women from Mongolia, the Philippines, Vietnam and elsewhere.

That did not go down well. According to the Seoul daily Chosun Ilbo, Kim grimaced and snapped that "our nation has always considered its pure lineage to be of great importance."

Far from challenging him, Han replied that this is "but a drop of ink in the Han River."

Kim was unmollified: "Not even one drop of ink must be allowed to fall into the Han river."

Koreans are not a pure race, of course (or even a race, other than members of the human race), but they sure as heck think and act as if they were. It would be an understatement to say that this is not good at all.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>To #19 and #21: I said &#8220;Korean identity is racial,&#8221; obvious to any firsthand observer, but I wasn&#8217;t implying that Koreans were actually racially pure, or even a distinct race. How could they be, after enduring thousands of foreign invasions (as we are constantly reminded, and as one excuse for all the rabid enthnocentricity)? Be that as it may, biologists now regard the concept of race as a toxic fiction. See <a href="http://www.apa.org/journals/releases/amp60116.pdf" rel="nofollow">http://www.apa.org/journals/releases/amp60116.pdf</a>. Korean culture is fundamentally fascist because it is based on race, delusional or otherwise.<br />
Recall this exchange (copied from Brian from ChollaNamdo):</p>
<p>Last Wednesday, major-generals from North and South Korea were chatting before a second day of tough talks on border security. The North&#8217;s Major-General Kim Yong-chul noted that farmers must be hard at work. Indeed, replied South Korea&#8217;s Major-General Han Min-gu. But since the rural population is falling, many are marrying women from Mongolia, the Philippines, Vietnam and elsewhere.</p>
<p>That did not go down well. According to the Seoul daily Chosun Ilbo, Kim grimaced and snapped that &#8220;our nation has always considered its pure lineage to be of great importance.&#8221;</p>
<p>Far from challenging him, Han replied that this is &#8220;but a drop of ink in the Han River.&#8221;</p>
<p>Kim was unmollified: &#8220;Not even one drop of ink must be allowed to fall into the Han river.&#8221;</p>
<p>Koreans are not a pure race, of course (or even a race, other than members of the human race), but they sure as heck think and act as if they were. It would be an understatement to say that this is not good at all.</p>
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		<title>By: knox</title>
		<link>http://www.rjkoehler.com/2008/07/04/no-contempt-for-koreans/#comment-168059</link>
		<dc:creator>knox</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 04 Jul 2008 16:28:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rjkoehler.com/2008/07/04/no-contempt-for-koreans/#comment-168059</guid>
		<description>As far as I can tell, citizens of the republic here classify foreigner discourse into two categories; praise and insult. I may be making critical arguements about some Korean issue of such originality, cleverness and humor, Mark Twain would smile in his grave. Were I to do that, however, I'd be verbally accosted. You're just a loser racist shouldn't be in Korea no how, know nothing bigot teacher, they'd think. Ah, but if I say, "Boy, kimchi sure are good." I get my comments posted in the Korea Times, and TV stations ask to be in my house in hopes of understanding why foreigners think Korea is so grand.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>As far as I can tell, citizens of the republic here classify foreigner discourse into two categories; praise and insult. I may be making critical arguements about some Korean issue of such originality, cleverness and humor, Mark Twain would smile in his grave. Were I to do that, however, I&#8217;d be verbally accosted. You&#8217;re just a loser racist shouldn&#8217;t be in Korea no how, know nothing bigot teacher, they&#8217;d think. Ah, but if I say, &#8220;Boy, kimchi sure are good.&#8221; I get my comments posted in the Korea Times, and TV stations ask to be in my house in hopes of understanding why foreigners think Korea is so grand.</p>
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		<title>By: ElCanguro</title>
		<link>http://www.rjkoehler.com/2008/07/04/no-contempt-for-koreans/#comment-168044</link>
		<dc:creator>ElCanguro</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 04 Jul 2008 14:19:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rjkoehler.com/2008/07/04/no-contempt-for-koreans/#comment-168044</guid>
		<description>#19 - Too right. Koreans are as much a 'race' as natives of the British Isles are, a 5000 year old mix-match of early-settlers, invaders, conquerors, traders, hoarders and the offspring that rabble produced.

Judging by looks alone, I can spot a range of phenotypes of varying degrees not dissimilar to those found in  Japanese, Chinese, Pacific Islander, Mongolian, Caucasian populations. They're a nation of mongrels, just like we all are, myself included.

I love to jab my gf every now and then when she indicates that she buys that "pure Han race" baloney. Her father's roots are from Haeju, north of the 38th parallel, and I reckon he's got a fair share of Chinese, Mongol and possibly even some Caucasian ancestry; whereas her Mum's family are from Jeonju and I'm certain she's got a fair share of Chinese ancestry judging by appearance (not the most scientific methods of determining ancestry, that said).

It's a tough job getting a local to whole-heartened admit to this though given the strict regime of indoctrination from infancy.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>#19 - Too right. Koreans are as much a &#8216;race&#8217; as natives of the British Isles are, a 5000 year old mix-match of early-settlers, invaders, conquerors, traders, hoarders and the offspring that rabble produced.</p>
<p>Judging by looks alone, I can spot a range of phenotypes of varying degrees not dissimilar to those found in  Japanese, Chinese, Pacific Islander, Mongolian, Caucasian populations. They&#8217;re a nation of mongrels, just like we all are, myself included.</p>
<p>I love to jab my gf every now and then when she indicates that she buys that &#8220;pure Han race&#8221; baloney. Her father&#8217;s roots are from Haeju, north of the 38th parallel, and I reckon he&#8217;s got a fair share of Chinese, Mongol and possibly even some Caucasian ancestry; whereas her Mum&#8217;s family are from Jeonju and I&#8217;m certain she&#8217;s got a fair share of Chinese ancestry judging by appearance (not the most scientific methods of determining ancestry, that said).</p>
<p>It&#8217;s a tough job getting a local to whole-heartened admit to this though given the strict regime of indoctrination from infancy.</p>
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		<title>By: Park Hyun</title>
		<link>http://www.rjkoehler.com/2008/07/04/no-contempt-for-koreans/#comment-168041</link>
		<dc:creator>Park Hyun</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 04 Jul 2008 13:56:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rjkoehler.com/2008/07/04/no-contempt-for-koreans/#comment-168041</guid>
		<description>I would also like to apologize for my decade or ridiculing fan death, baldness-via-acid-rain, anti-SOFA protesters, and Hanchongyeon.

It was not right.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I would also like to apologize for my decade or ridiculing fan death, baldness-via-acid-rain, anti-SOFA protesters, and Hanchongyeon.</p>
<p>It was not right.</p>
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		<title>By: arthjm</title>
		<link>http://www.rjkoehler.com/2008/07/04/no-contempt-for-koreans/#comment-168033</link>
		<dc:creator>arthjm</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 04 Jul 2008 13:07:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rjkoehler.com/2008/07/04/no-contempt-for-koreans/#comment-168033</guid>
		<description>#6 I wasn't aware 'Korean' classified as a race (pet peeve), and I don't see it meaning the alternative since they discriminate more against, say North Koreans and Chinese, than they do against any sort of white or black foreigner.  I learned English in the UK though, so perhaps the term is more general in American English?  Definitely your concept of nation and colony is quite off, or you haven't really been around town, yeah?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>#6 I wasn&#8217;t aware &#8216;Korean&#8217; classified as a race (pet peeve), and I don&#8217;t see it meaning the alternative since they discriminate more against, say North Koreans and Chinese, than they do against any sort of white or black foreigner.  I learned English in the UK though, so perhaps the term is more general in American English?  Definitely your concept of nation and colony is quite off, or you haven&#8217;t really been around town, yeah?</p>
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		<title>By: bigrich</title>
		<link>http://www.rjkoehler.com/2008/07/04/no-contempt-for-koreans/#comment-168032</link>
		<dc:creator>bigrich</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 04 Jul 2008 13:00:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rjkoehler.com/2008/07/04/no-contempt-for-koreans/#comment-168032</guid>
		<description>I think most expats know all of this already. I am careful at work to never express any non-glowingly-positive opinion about Korea at any time. It jars sometimes, but it has led to me being popular with everyone there. If I complain, even if it is 100% justified, I'll be less popular, my days will be harder, and I won't enjoy my job as much - so what would be the benefit to me?

The much-noted Korean inadequacy/superiority complex and ethnocentrism mean that comments from foreigners are not sought or welcomed - so why fight to give them? Korea will change gradually, and when it wants to, and no amount of whining from me will speed up that process. Instead, I bite my tongue, take my paycheck, and concentrate on the things I love about this country. It's just pragmatism.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think most expats know all of this already. I am careful at work to never express any non-glowingly-positive opinion about Korea at any time. It jars sometimes, but it has led to me being popular with everyone there. If I complain, even if it is 100% justified, I&#8217;ll be less popular, my days will be harder, and I won&#8217;t enjoy my job as much - so what would be the benefit to me?</p>
<p>The much-noted Korean inadequacy/superiority complex and ethnocentrism mean that comments from foreigners are not sought or welcomed - so why fight to give them? Korea will change gradually, and when it wants to, and no amount of whining from me will speed up that process. Instead, I bite my tongue, take my paycheck, and concentrate on the things I love about this country. It&#8217;s just pragmatism.</p>
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