Oh boy, more protests, only bigger, with the government resorting now to water cannons to stop protesters as they tried to march on Cheong Wa Dae.
More on the protests here, here and here. Daum’s Agora is the place to go for all your protest porn. This photo of a female Korean music student having her neck stepped on by a riot cop has been making the rounds this morning in Korean cyberland:
Even the Chosun Ilbo thought deploying SWAT teams was a bad idea. The Hankyoreh (which, I notice, is running prominent ads for the Korean translation of Gail A. Eisnitz’s “Slaughterhouse“), on the other hand, is comparing the situation to June 1987, when massive street protests forced military dictator Chun Doo-hwan from office.
President Lee, meanwhile, is expected to shake up his cabinet, but that may be too little, too late, with President Lee’s approval rating at 21%. There is some legitimate reason behind public displeasure with Lee (regardless of the validity, or lack there of, to arguments against US beef imports) — he’s not a great communicator, and hasn’t quite adjusted to the fact that unlike his stint as Hyundai CEO and Seoul mayor, he cannot rule by royal fiat. That being said, voters knew this about Lee — or should have known it, anyway — before they gave him the largest landslide victory in Korean electoral history (followed by a fairly convincing victory for conservatives in the general parliamentary election). Indeed, he ran on a platform of getting things done with a minimum of bullshit… as opposed to the Roh administration, where a presidential committee needed to be formed just to decide who got to use the Cheong Wa Dae john first in the morning.
Anyway, I hate to beat a dead horse — or a mad cow, as it were — to death, but the major problem is with the Korean public, which regardless of its legitimate beef — no pun intended — with Lee’s administrative style, has made a questionable cause its reason for war. Should the Lee administration be forced to give into public opinion and demand the renegotiation of the beef deal, the United States MUST be prepared to teach the Korean public a lesson they will not soon forget. In 2002, anti-American protesters were glorified as heroes. That glorification ended once US troops started leaving. There’s a lesson to be learned there.
105 Comments
pool li’l 명박이…
i think he should get together with li’l 정일이 and hold hands and sing kumbaya and give all the imported US beef to them poor starving mofo’s up north…
that should appease all this mental retardation going on in this country.
we koreans love it when our leaders go up to pyongang and suck li’l 정일이’s dick while also getting raped in the ass by literally feeding its standing army that is pointing its guns at us, no?
say hallelujah brother robert!!!!!
Just not sure how much press this is getting in the states. Thats the key is to this whole plan. Yeah the US Ambassador is likely on the phone with Foggy Bottom but is anybody listening?
The US people dont give a shit, they are more concerned if Bradgenlia has had their kid
It’s time to mail your congressmen and women folks. I don’t know how much this beef brouhaha is getting played in the States, but it wouldn’t hurt to remind our congressional leaders how we feel. You can find your member in the House of Reps here.
There is a lot of stuff on You Tube with hyperbolic claims - typical of some of YT - but after the Korean in the US faked a tape using water cannon footage from FTA protests and footage of middle school students, I am very wary of what I’m seeing on YT and elsewhere.
I can’t believe I’m saying this, but I’ll probably have to stick with stuff from Voice of People or Ohmy!!news if not from CNN or the BBC.
As for the outside Korea source, it is getting some play. Not much by domestic US standards, but there is enough out there from the NY Times, Washington Post, Wall Street Journal, CNN, ABC News, BBC and the like — to tell the Western press is paying attention.
I wonder if the American public will finally hear about all this bullshit as the Korean mobs start to rule. It seems they’re deaf to it all.
Hopefully, that’ll change and the American public will demand that there be no more business done with Korea and demand that the troops be brought home.
Wishful thinking I know, but that would be cool and the best thing for America.
Also, it is a good time to remind those who haven’t been in or around Korea for long, the anti-US (and other radical) groups have been known to plan staged events to get art of police or GI brutality.
Even in one regular protest from a few years ago, I remember an article recounting how a typical university student mob at a USFK base started throwing themselves against the shields of the riot police while screaming out in English, “Why are you beating me?! We’re trying to protest peacefully! Why are you doing this?!”
Don’t tell your congressional leaders a damn thing! That’s not interesting. I want to see these people get what they are fighting for. The alternative isn’t really compelling, is it?
This is a domestic political SNAFU that the U.S. should stay out of.
These are legitimate criticisms on the Korean public that many Korean netizens acknowledge as well. Although embarassing, please remember we are but a fledgling democracy that’s only 20 years old. Most elections are just a popularity contest between opposing candidates, and many times the outcome is determined just by being in the right party for the right district. The people had no idea what the hell they were getting into when they decided to vote for MB, and now many, it seems, feel disillusioned.
That being said, I really don’t understand why Koreans would deserve retaliatory measures if we decide to renegotiate the beef deal. Correct me if I’m wrong, but I hear that no country other than Canada has agreed to import beef from cattle 30+ months old and even in the States, only beef from 20- months old cattle are mostly circulated and officially recommended.
You can email your Senators through this webpage.
While I have been involved in a number of letter writing campaigns in the past, and know how they can seem rather pointless, you would be surprised how politicians will take up a cause in an election here.
“the Korean mobs start to rule”
That’s a good point — with the protesters and opposition party and some members of the press saying this has become an issue of Pres. Lee not listening to the will of the people — and with all the You Tube videos with Koreans writing in broken English about how democracy is being crushed in the streets of Seoul.
He doesn’t have the mandate of heaven. This IS a democracy. He was voted into office along with a majority for the GNP in the National Assembly. Vote his party out of office(s) next election if he turns out to be not what you wanted.
Democracy - the will of the people - does not mean mob rule.
And just because you are a group of citizens, you don’t have a natural right to march on the presidential mansion or roam the middle of the streets blocking traffic and pushing on riot police when they won’t let you pass by.
“That being said, I really don’t understand why Koreans would deserve retaliatory measures if we decide to renegotiate the beef deal.”
I have no problem with both countries renegotiating a deal, but at this point, it’s pretty clear that the protesters and the politicians profiting from them have not interest in actually getting a deal that works. The made sure that ship sailed long ago. They are just getting easy political capital on the backs of the idiots in the streets.
And while we are “renegotiating” trade deals, we should go into the ones that benefit Korea.
I should have ended that last post with:
And while we are “renegotiating” trade deals, we should go into the ones that benefit Korea in the United States. I read on the internet somewhere by some guy that Korean phones give people cancer, and Americans are much more susceptible to this phone cancer than other nationalities.
you guys are evil. You want the KORUS FTA to die.
as far as I can tell, the protest is more about distrusting Lee Myung Bak, and not as you say, anti-USA.
where is the burning American flag? Huh?
that’s right.
By the way, you don’t think Koreans will gobble up on American goods such as, clothing, meds, and even American cars?
it’s a crooked bunch.
this all started when Lee named his all-star team, who were basically Korea’s elite whom were too easy to hate.
ha, you guys are getting as stirred up as the protesters downtown. who’s driving your bus. go, write a letter to your local senator, change the world. while your at it, get the US troops back from afganistan, iraq, korea and Japan and stop pharquing with the rest of the world. it may eventually stop trying to pharque you back.
all you whities living here in korea, please don’t write to your congressmen / senators.
don’t aggravate the already bleak situation of living here by making the US gov’ment slap sanctions on korea.
i know it is frustrating for you living here and having to deal with kimchi action everyday, but please don’t get worked up, don’t demean yourselves by sinking to korean levels.
let koreans be. we koreans have to live their entire lives not knowing how stupid we can be, isn’t that punishment enough?
i mean, u guys don’t have it that bad here, no?
just continue to smoke weed, fuck our stank ho’s and make easy money by teaching dumb fucks the same english lesson over and over.
just pray to god nobody takes a pic of you doing what u do and posts it on the internet.
Be careful what you wish for. You just may get it soon enough.
I agree with Jeez.
I think a lot of foreigners are missing the whole point about why Koreans are so against the import of US beef as outlined in the FTA. The FTA if ratified will allow the importation of beef from cows over 30 months old. Mad cow usually begins after 20 months. Japan only imports US beef from cows slaughtered under 20 months. Domestic beef consumption in the US is regulated as well to under 20 months.
That being said, you can understand why Koreans are so upset. The US wants to sell beef to Koreans that they themselves won’t eat, and for which they have domestic regulations against.
The beef imported to Korea isn’t the same beef as that sold in the US. The argument, “Well, I’ve eaten American beef all my life and I turned out fine,” just doesn’t hold.
Much of the protests going on now is aimed at the current administration for what the public perceives as incompetence and arrogance in handling the FTA.
According to media remarks by Korean trade minister Kim Hyun Chung in late 2006,
“We have about 3.5 million farmers, that’s 7.5 percent of the Korean population. Sixty percent of them are over the age of 60 and so when you take those facts together you basically realize what you have to do. That’s why we will be spending $ billion dollars in a support program as well as other programs that my colleague, the Ag Minister, is currently scrutinizing.”
The amount in billions was left out of the article I read on the USTR website. But even a billion is a huge amount of money to spend on benefits/ retirement, for this aging economic group.
Where were these mobs when deadly Chinese products came cruising in? Remember Kimchi with lead?
I’ve said enough about this issue here and elsewhere. Gord Sellar has some lucid points at his site that I recommend as food for thought (see sidebar link). On Saturday, I’m gonna go down to City Hall and try to start a chant of “Don’t taze me, Bro!”
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C-PcS-s9WtQ
I hope the US sets up some embargos…
these these knobs will realise they’re being selfish mofos
it’s parallel to the US protest of the Iraq War.
issue is basic distrust of the administration.
in fact, wackos in the US would go along with letting a group of “elite liberals” called “super delegates” decide who should run against the Republicans.
…just so that “full retreat” from Iraq can be done as the dude says…
and this will solve everything.
this, I think, is the
Mad American Disease.
I love the “it’s about Lee” thing.
This is what happens in Korea when the foreign press starts letting people know how irrational Korea is acting.
Lee and elements of the Korean press couldn’t get the people to admit clear cut, glaring facts even when they tried to pound the society over the head with them. The protests kept going and growing.
But, as the foreign outlets started paying attention and talking about how little facts there were in Korea’s righteous rage - a new narrative was created —- the “it’s about Lee’s arrogance!!”
Displeasure with Lee has its part.
The undeniable spark was anti-US habits and the beef issue is about anti-Americanism even if also about taking Lee down a peg or two.
Some questions:
Why beef?
Why not the canal? Why not Lee’s warming up to Japan? Why not his reversal of the Sunshine Policy? Why not early on when he made the major decision to move against the Unification Ministry (though he backed down from that)? Why not issue over China?
Why aren’t the trade unions running the show over the FTA or other issues Lee raised with them early on?
Why not the KTU against the push in school and teacher reform?
Why was US beef the “straw that broke the camel’s back” if you want to see it that way?
This is about anti-US habits.
Roh is gone. Korean society voted the conservatives back into office big time.
Now they know the house is secure foreign policy-wise. And to them, the recent talk from USFK and the US that troop reductions are on hold validates their thinking. The alliance is secure. Lee will do what is in the nation’s best interest in the end…
So, it’s time to get back to the sport of beating up on the US in Korea to stoke Korean nationalism.
Another question: how many large anti-Roh protests did you see gaining traction among the Korean people, even when he was cutting beef deals and FTAs and even sending troops to Iraq?
Could someone find and actually post the agreement so we no longer have to put up with heresay and conjecture about “we are being forced to eat beef even American’s don’t eat”
http://www.ustr.gov/Trade_Agre.....Index.html
here’s the letter of the FTA.
And by the way, what really pisses me off is that the US still has to pay a 3 percent tariff on Badger hair. The NERVE!
They do know that if they don’t want a product, they could simply not buy it, right?
Right?
Or do they still think that they’re under a dictatorship and if they don’t buy it, they’ll be beheaded like it the ‘good old days’?
They don’t still think that….do they?
BTW on page 201 under Korean tariffs you can see the %s that will be levied on auto imports. Go to the bottom of the FTA to find the tariff schedules of both nations.
What is the excise on Korean beaver tufts? Is the clause retained in an attempt at preventing development of Korea erotic wig market. Or to encourage brazil waxing. That would be good for english teachers, make all korean girls younger between the legs and lower the potential for trauma among young student as a result of rising sexual abuse from their canadian english teachers.
BTW, isn’t badger hair too stiff?
not to sound shallow, but a friend of mine and myself were out walking around jongro in awe of seeing so many beautiful young women on the sidewalks. we were even counting them just to see how our tastes compared. anyways, we watched the university students doing there protest and we only counted two girls who were relatively attractive out of well over a hundred. we wondered why this was, and decided hot girls had better things to do on a sunday afternoon. all in all the protests are a “nerd brigage” and they don’t really seem to know what they are protesting against. they just want to goof off and get attention. korea is embarrassing itself yet again and showing how ignorance spreads in a group-think mentality. korea is pathetic sometimes.
This whole protest shananigan is indicative of how insecure the Korean people are as a whole. When you’re insecure, you brain tend to become a mush and start acting irrationally.
Some “dood” from Korea says, “I think a lot of foreigners are missing the whole point about why Koreans are so against the import of US beef as outlined in the FTA.”
Are you serious? Can these mob of irrational people even articulate why they are demonstrating? I don’t hear anything coherent from any of them. I bet, the first one to be on a plane to “America” will change his/her tune. This is what’s so pathetic about Korean people. Sheesh..
I tried to post a comment but it is awaiting moderation. Do I need to make it more moderate, or is there a software problem. I am using Windows Explorer 7 and I have the update recently.
“Could someone find and actually post the agreement so we no longer have to put up with heresay and conjecture about “we are being forced to eat beef even American’s don’t eat””
Tried to read it, but then I remembered I’m majoring in Biology, not Prelaw.
Can someone tell me what the deal is with the 30-month deal? True? False? Dash of truth? Twisted truth? Half-Truth? All I read so far was bunch of scoffs and “Koreans are immature blah blah blahs”, and I don’t particularly have a taste for public beating of a horse corpse. Somebody, straight answer for someone who really haven’t been paying attention to the situation because frankly he didn’t care too much.
Which brings me to an interesting point… some of you are taking this situation waaaay too personal. Some of the comments written for the past few days almost convinced me that you guys all have ranches here in the States. Yeah, it’s stupid and irrational. But don’t get an ulcer over it.
Btw, that picture with a riot cop (I’m assuming)’s boot on a protester’s neck? Very nice. Can you guess how many horrifying historical events that imagery can trigger in the Korean society’s mind? The police already has enough historical baggage as it is… this is not going to help them at all…
I need to find some credible sources for what the deal says and what the US law says about domestic beef…
…but…..in the comment the above quote came from….
….the argument made seems to be that the disease (including the elements that cause it) is not like HIV and AIDS - where a “healthy” looking person can have the HIV virus for years and years without showing any symptoms. But with HIV , an infected person can still pass the “disease” onto others before they actually “have” AIDS.
Are you saying beef under 20 months old can’t have Mad Cow Disease?
Or that they can’t pass it onto humans (or other cows) until after they are over 20 months old?
If you are not saying either of those things, then your argument that the beef protests are reasonable falls apart.
You are arguing that the beef Americans eat is safe only/mainly/significantly because it is under 20 months old and thus can’t have MCD.
I don’t think that is how the disease works.
Anyway….
The bottom line is: no cows with the disease have turned up in the US since the initial (extremely limited) scare in 2003.
Koreans have no leg to stand on when it comes to justifying the protests over the US beef that will be coming to Korea - from a 30+ month old cow or not.
Oh, hello!
This beef will still likely be subject to illegal non-tariff trade barriers, no matter the outcome. The FTA is very unlikely, and I think US rejection is a more probable reason than opposition here. Beef or no beef, was the US ever really going to ratify this deal, Bush had to squeeze the signing in anyway. Global beef market is growing so fast US can make up lost sales to korea market by sending to China.
1) It is the same beef eaten in the states.
2) I do think it is Anti-U.S sentiment driving alot of this. To all the people saying its not look at the netizen comments on the korean linked pages, or to the anti-lmb or michinso pages…recently the leaders are saying “lets boycott all U.S products~! no starbucks~! no mcdonalds~! no kfc or burger king~!” Not to mention when is the last time we have seen protests of this magnitude or type? 2002, anybody?
For once I am starting to feel like if this gets to a point were it gets really anti-american, the U.S should “be a dick” as robert says. Let the public feel the pain for a few years when their biggest export market comes to a schreaching halt and U.S investors stop coming.
“Slaughterhouse”
Oooooh…. reading a book by Upton Sinclair about the meat packing industry at the turn of the century U.S. That makes A LOT of sense…
“I don’t understand why Lee did not bother to ask his people just once about it [U.S. beef], before using a food issue as a negotiation card,” Kim said.
Don’t remember Kim Dae-jung asking the people before he gave half a billion to his mates North either. That is why you elect representatives.
I wondered why people gave a shite about this, till I realise it has been going on a month today. My partner is so embarassed she does not talk to me about it. She asked me to stop reading Korean newspapers.
Thanks for the FTA link, but I was more interested about the impending and related move to open the market to US Beef, It was this decision and what beef that will be allowed that I am interested in. I though they were different things as the market will be opening this month, but the FTA is ways away from happening.
Insecure? Teach Koreans a lesson? I agree with the fact that the protests have, to an extent, become a rally against America but is that really wrong? As an Australian, I can’t help but to think of this as America/Americans acting the role of the World Police (again) with the whole “we’re great and you’re wrong” attitude. (I’m sure many Koreans and non-Americans agree with me)
I have to sympathise with the Koreans on this issue. If something has even the slightest potential to harm a life, it should not be imported/exported. Governments are elected to protect the people from harm, and the way in which the Lee administration opened the market is ridiculous. If the government considers the economy/power more important the lives of its citizens, then I’m afraid the future is bleak.
“I have to sympathise with the Koreans on this issue. If something has even the slightest potential to harm a life, it should not be imported/exported. ”
Exactly, thats why Americans should stop importing Korean phones, cars and LCD TVs if this turns into anti-americanism. Because in fact, those things have cause far more injury/death to people than American beef has.
They may indeed agree with you, but both you and they would be wrong. You think there’s nothing wrong with the Korean public rallying to keep out US products? Fine — I happened to agree with you. That’s their right, and Korea has a right to keep out whatever it likes. But remember, too, that the United States is also a sovereign state, and it is under no obligation to open its markets to those states that refuse to open their markets to its products.
I’m pretty certain Korean cars and cell phones — not to mention, as shown in the case of Virginia Tech — actual Korean nationals have killed far more people than US beef. Are you suggesting the US should ban the import of Korean cars and cell phones and stop issuing visas to Korean nationals?
@29 I’ve been getting my Korean beaver for free ever since I got off the plane. I’ve yet to meat a Korean girl who didn’t get off on US meat.
Puns intended.
Well, it was on the headlines of the BBC and Al Jazeera today, but the blurb they read mostly focused on the police tactics. There was one line that said the protesters were questioning US beef safety.
It made me think of a comment someone from a newspaper made this past week about the implications the media has. From the BBC blurb, it sounded like Koreans were protesting because American beef is not safe. I don’t know how they could have phrased it without implying that, though.
In answer to #36…
There has not been a spike in activity like this since the summer of 2003.
There have been large protests - of any variety - but I can’t think of anything that has been able to sustain itself for this long at this size.
Not the FTA, previous beef talks, the Pyongtaek base expansion, or anything else.
The same goes for non-US/USFK related activity.
Look at this point: not too long ago, we saw Chinese citizens coming to Korea by the thousands to end up staging violent protests against China protests. With the Chinese showing they had taken to the streets prepared.
How long did the outrage over that last?
Another point: President Roh’s ratings were so bad, saying they were in the toilet is kinda an insult to toilets.
And he cut the FTA and did other things that got the people angry. He was disliked by the left and the right. And the press relentlessly pounded his administration.
….But how many lasting anti-Roh protests periods can you remember?….
But it’s mostly about Lee’s arrogance….
….it’s mostly about the age of the cow the beef came from….
No. It is about confidence going wild over Lee and US beef is safer than taking to the streets was under Roh. The citizens are confident Lee will make sure there is no significant damage to the US military alliance and Korea’s export potential.
Not to mention the authorities responded to the Chinese riots by doing… fuck all.
“I have to sympathise with the Koreans on this issue. If something has even the slightest potential to harm a life, it should not be imported/exported.”
Fine. No smokes, no Budweiser, no cars, no nothing…all of which cause far less damage than the ridiculously low chance of catching this disease (even in beef older than 30 months). Have a sucky life.
and I meant “far more” not “far less.” sorry.
What happened to that link with the goofy satire about eating Koreans? I didn’t care much for the post, but the comments have all disappeared.
“Not to mention the authorities responded to the Chinese riots by doing… fuck all.”
“No. It is about confidence going wild over Lee and US beef is safer than taking to the streets was under Roh. The citizens are confident Lee will make sure there is no significant damage to the US military alliance and Korea’s export potential.”
More so to ensure that the Chinese government trusts the South Korean government enough not to intervene when it tries to annex North Korea upon its collapse.
The Koreans know the US market will always be open to them. Always. They have been pulling these stunts for decades while increasing market share in the US, and that ain’t gonna change anytime soon. Don’t know why Lee is all fair-tradey all of a sudden, after all those years working for the company that did the most to keep our cars out of Korea.
Anyway, all this talk of America having to be a perfect dick: we all know that won’t happen. Why: 1) American wussiness and naivete. (”An important US ally,” etc) 2) Americans demand cheap products as a right. 3) Those enormous US flags in front of Hyundai dealerships, the “imports give Americans jobs too” angle. Etc, etc. 4) A free media that draws the line at deliberate hate-mongering. So dream on, folks.
Lana #27 - once it’s in, it’s in. That is, once the beef is in the country, there’s no way to know where it’ll end up, or how it’ll be labeled. Koreans can’t trust their restauranteurs, school cafeterias, local butcher shops, etc., not to buy and mislabel US beef. It’s already well-established that many (mostly small) Korean merchants mislabel beef and other foods, saying that it’s Korean in origin, when it’s not. In the case of bulk purchases for the ROK military, or major food processors like CJ and Ottoggi, they might not even be able to keep track of what pile of meat came from where.
Not, I would add, that proper compliance and enforcement of food labeling regulations would remove the motivation for the current protests. Not by a long shot.
Bullshit.
Bullshit.
Bullshit.
You fucking morons would come here proclaiming the Sun was an ocean of ice if some dipshit Korean netizens told you it was true.
For all those looking for clarification on the “US won’t import/eat cattle older than 30 months, so why should Korea accept beef that Americans won’t eat” bullshit being thrown around by ignorant jackasses, here’s the truth:
The US accepts Canadian beef imports older than 30 months. In fact, they accept any cattle born after March 1, 1999, which is determined by the USDA to be the date of effective enforcement of the ruminant-to-ruminant feed ban in Canada. Yes, America imports 8-year old cattle from Canada. So not only do we Americans eat 30+ month old beef, we eat 100-month old beef imported from Canada, which has had 20 times the incidences of BSE than the US.
If you want to go stand around in your candle-holding circle-jerks in Seoul, scaring each other with stories of American Frankenbeef…knock yourself out. You’re free to be ignorant assholes.
But if you’re going to come and post your horseshit here, expect to get called on it.
You’re fucking idiots, being manipulated by fucking morons. Now go douse yourself with soju, light a candle, and stick it in your hair.
http://tinyurl.com/2jonk6
http://tinyurl.com/ccjlj
i second #53
well said!!!!!
blueballs just gave me a raging boner.
@53 for the benefit of those who take blue’s advice, I wish soju was flammable.
i dont think it will be long before one of those stupid asses actually does set themselves on fire!
I have this theory that Koreans are passive/aggresive people. They tolerate all sorts of shit from each other, and just smile and nod. Meanwhile their anger builds and builds and builds, and then POW! Violent so called protests or mass shootings!
Thank you, #53.
Too bad they CHOOSE too believe lies, so they can feel like ‘poor victimized Koreans. Aiguuuuu!!!!!!!!!’
Once again Blueballs nails it better than the rest of us could in a cogent, concise message (i.e. less than the 1000 words or multiple hairbrained posts of some people around here). Respect.
Well, as an American all I can say is…..
“We’re Great, everyone else is wrong.”
Koreans acting like retards in the streets of Seoul : Par for the course.
Defending retarded Koreans in an attempt to join the anti-US party: Pathetic.
If Koreans will eat dogmeat, which is often butchered and processed in unregulated, fly-infested crapholes, then they will eat anything. These protests are not because Koreans are worried about mad-cow disease protests; these protests are because Koreans are, at their core, anti-American.
Anyway, if oil hits $200 a barrel, trade with Korea may stop, regardless.
“The Coming Energy Wars”
First, in the scope of things, its really not that big of an issue to the USA or its people. US beef has not been sold here for five years and somehow America survived. Tens of thousands dead in natural disasters in China and Burma, are far more significant.
Second, the AP released a story on this and it was picked up in some state side newspaper. However most stories about Korea rarely show the true facts or are usually written in a biased opinion that sometimes is less than an accurate depiction of the news events. I do not believe that Korean writers or Korean American writers write about Korean affairs in a non biased way. This may be part of the problem why all the BS that Korea pulls is rarely reported in the western press.
Thus, events in Korea are either insignificant to the West or the true story is not being told by Koreans working in the foreign media.
heard that recently during an interview with the korean press the american ambassador, after answering several questions, paused, and then said something to the effect of:
‘let me get this straight after a 60 year relationship are you suggesting that your chief ally is now trying to poison your children?’
apparently everyone got quiet after that.
Additionally its ridiculous to argue the merits with a Korean person. Most Koreans 35 or younger have been taught most of their lives that the USA is bad. The USA uses Korea. The USA looks down on Korea. The USA does not respect Koreans. The USA divided the Koreas. There are a million other negative things they are taught to believe about the USA. Thus, any issue you can tie into this reservoir of anti Americanism, you can get 50,000 people in the streets with the drop of a hat. I mean, MBC could do a program suggesting its the USA really responsibly for yellow dust from China and the next week 100k people would be protesting. Facts are not that important to Koreans, its reinforced that the USA is bad and Koreans in their patriotic duty must stand up to them.
Finally, no foreign person would give a rats ass about what Korea chose to import if it did not make the majority of its wealth selling its products in foreign nations. It seems Korea does not play fair. Expats see that every day. One wishes other countries beside China would call Korea on its unfair trade practices.
Some Korean students ate it . . .
This whole affair is no longer about beef but about civil anarchy and whether or not Koreans will sabotage their duly elected government on some mis-educated whim.
iheartblueballs: THANK YOU. You had me laughing more than anybody else in this thread.
So, as for the “beatdowns” going ’round at Cheonggyecheon, anybody got an idea where I could pickup a Korean riot police outfit? I’d like to issue a few beatdowns.
This issue has been pissing me off because 2MB has neglected putting forth a massive PR campaign proclaiming that the beef is safe and that this is all political theater. They did the PR campaign for bird flu, I saw the posters. Where the hell are OUR posters?!
Unfortunately, I got an impression that some(or most)of americans are somehow nationalistic and also show hysteric even childish and mentally ill-matured response.
Anyway…in answer to #52, according to Reuters newsreporting, there are some ground to believe that the US wants to sell beef to Koreans that they themselves won’t eat.
***
[WASHINGTON (Reuters) - U.S. makers of pet food and all other animal feed will be prevented from using certain materials from cattle at the greatest risk for spreading mad cow disease under a rule that regulators finalized on Wednesday.
The U.S. Food and Drug Administration, which oversees animal feed, said excluding high-risk materials from cattle 30 months of age or older from all animal feed will prevent any accidental cross-contamination between ruminant feed (intended for animals such as cattle) and non-ruminant feed or feed ingredients.
The new rule takes effect in April, 2009.]
***
NOw, satisfied???
Quote: “I have to sympathise with the Koreans on this issue. If something has even the slightest potential to harm a life, it should not be imported/exported.” Name something, anything that does not have the potential to harm a life. Ever seen the stats for car accidents (especially in this country), high calorie diets, lead paint? Away with cars, sugar cookies, and Chinese toys!
Lana back at post 27 seemed to have it pegged. If you don’t want something, don’t buy it. It is amazing what will happen to beef sales (or any other sales) if people don’t buy it. (US beef exports have declined to 1/3 what they were prior to Mad Cow being found in the US. Meanwhile, there has been no increase in Creutzfeldt-Jakob. Yeah, yeah, I know, “it takes years to develop”. And what if it never does?) To the positive, the corn that fed beef is being used for ethanol. (Yes, I’m being sarcastic. More silliness, turning the world’s food supply into cheap fuel for a vacation is a long term negative).
Linkd made the point “Koreans can’t trust their restauranteurs, school cafeterias, local butcher shops, etc., not to buy and mislabel US beef. It’s already well-established that many (mostly small) Korean merchants mislabel beef and other foods, saying that it’s Korean in origin, when it’s not”. Well now, what else is getting in, and from whom?
Fucktards, that’s all I can say. Women with their baby carriages protesting - how much more stupid and disgusting can it get? (using children to score violent political points).
If the public is scared of mad cow, why they don’t protest the unsafe Korean beef which is internationally rated less safer than the US beef? Lee’s government should just disband the riot cops, let the mob go wild and make a fool of themselves. Why try to stop them rioting and end up looking evil?
This is coming from me, a fifth columnist evil Gyopo: Fucking retards hell with them! These stupid fools and tools are getting used and they don’t even realize it. I wish somebody would rake the fuckers with a machine gun and get rid of all the ignorance (relax, I don’t really want that but I can always dream).
I was waiting for someone to get so tired of it all that they’d actually find a link. Thanks Blue Balls! So we’ve got three mad cows in the US and twelve in Canada. What I’d like to know is how that has translated into the human variant. How many people in North America have had their brains Sponge-Bobbed? In all of history?
Relax, cm! Let’s just see if and when the light ever goes on. I’m really interested in finding out. To me this is an amazing sociological experiment on a mass scale. As Spock would say, “fascinating”!
I’m with you. Call off the dogs. Does he think he’ll sway them with jack-boot persuasion?
i’m still waiting for someone to tell me why koreans should eat beef that’s almost three years old when the same beef would not be consumed here in the states. why?
‘america doesn’t care about korea!’ declared the expat
what country does america care about, can you tell me? listen, if americans don’t care about killing a million iraqis, you think americans are going to care about a country called korea? poo-leeze.
‘let’s pull the troops out! sanctions!’
poo-leeze, you think the folks who run our country are going to ruin a relationship with one of the largest ecnomies in the world just to help you nurse your need for revenge against the k-man? are you seriuos? me thinks the excee deludes himself into really believing his self hype.
lastly, it’s so fun to see you all blow a rod. lol. all huffy puffy. lol. the huffy puffy expat. lol.
ps dong9, just wanted to mix it up, that’s all.
I am left utterly speechless and disappointed in Mr. Koehler’s assessment of the situation.
The beef being American is no where near the crux of the matter. People couldn’t care less where the beef came from. People were waiving the Korean flag (not burning US flags) and the chantings against “dictatorship” reminded you of the days from the 80s. The crowds were marching towards the Blue House before being stopped by riot police lines, not demonstrating in front of the US Embassy.
This is a domestic situation. People are infuriated by the current government’s complete lack of respect shown towards popular opinion in matters of beef import and the canal project.
Koreans may have done the US injustice in the past and I understand the sense of betrayal, but you have gone too far to generalize this civil movement as an anti-US protest. You may have had your feelings hurt, but emotions aside, in the big scheme of things, Korea has more or less always stood by with the US. Koreans should, the US led forces liberated them.
Pulling the plug on Korean exports of cellphones and cars to the US? They can’t ever be sold without passing inspections and regulations set by the US government; a right that the MB government seems to have given up in the import of beef. Your “dick”-for-tat line of logic is frail but it does serve to reveal your immaturity. Yes, the Korean economy would be devastated if it can’t sell Samsungs and Hyundais in the US. Nothing comparable to the invisible scratch the US economy would endure in the case of barred beef in Korea. Yes, all “mad” Koreans on the streets now should immediately scrap their protest, turn their heads toward the direction of the US embassy and kowtow.
You having to invoke the case of Cho at Virginia Tech to defend your position shows you just how low you’ve stooped down to.
There are many mostly-silent reader of your blog. You wouldn’t care, but you’ve just lost one of them.
It all goes back to #23.
The beef is just one of the many issues the that have led to these demonstrations. The public is pissed at Lee for his insensitive leadership and US schooled senior staff. The canal, the end of the sunshine up their ass policy, teachers and school curriculum, aid to the old and infirmed.
It wasn’t just the 386 generation out on Friday and Saturday night. Older folks, families with small children, grandmothers and grandfathers were all part of the crowd. Sure the grandma’s and toddlers were toward the middle and back of the crown with the youngsters out front for the water cannons and rubber clubs, but is was a crowd of all ages.
The fact is, this is a relatively new democracy that has only seen a handful of free elections. They have had to resort to these staged events as their means of expression to get their point across.
I was surprised to see that not one station had any live coverage on Friday evening when a lot of the shenanagins were going on and then Saturday after one agency “broke the story” every KBS video crew was running up a down the street trying to get a “combat cop” to push them around or smack them down on camera.
This has probably already been tried, by why doesn’t someone get hold of this suspicious American beef (I guess it must be available at the bases no?) and we can have a cook-up down in the centre of Seoul. Put our stomachs where our mouths are, so to speak. We’ll probably get shit thrown at us and it’ll probably rain but I’d be up for it. Make it a social event. Does someone have a portable hot plate?
Is it illegal to have a barbecue with American beef in the centre of Seoul? I doubt those of us on visas would be expelled for political activity. It’s just a barbecue. How about “the Marmot’s Hole Appreciation Society’s Annual Summer Barbecue”?
one more thing, if koreans don’t want beef that’s almost three years old, who are you all to tell them any different? it’s their country, they can do what they want.
by the same token, if the people of the us don’t want cheap, high quality, korean cars, then, by all means, they should be banned.
write your congressman today!
Even if word got out that we’d been paid by the US Embassy or American Beef Industry to do it, people would still have to conclude that we were willing to put our lives on the line for a publicity stunt.
pawi’s fallen for the disinformation and demagoguery.
The fucking retards have done it. The government is forced to delay the beef import and is expected that they would ask the US to renegotiate the beef deal - possibly irreversibly damaging the US-Korea relationship over a silly beef non-issue. The reports are coming in.
I’m with Marmot here, the US needs to play hard ball and stop the usual Korean left wingers who will gain the most politically.
Is any blogger or reporting tracking the amounts of black-market US beef entering the economy from AAFES outlets?
Not that facts have mattered at all in this hysteria, but that data would certainly undercut the anti-beef movement.
Everyone calm down. Take a deep breath and look out your window tonight and ask yourselves, “how is the weather tonight in Korea and how will it be for the next month?” The answer is piss-poor raining.
LMB is no dummy (personally I liked Park Geun Hye but LMB is fine with me as a second choice). If I was LMB and had to do something tough and politically controversial (as to cause a public reaction like we see now) I would do it when the weather is very unkind to any outside demonstration.
It is rainy season and there will be no more demonstrations. The beef issue will be an after issue soon.
The timing of this agreement is shrewd and counter sanctions warranted or not (that means your opinions Robert) should wait till the storm blows over (literally).
If the protests continue in this weather then I am wrong but if they stop it is no accident that the deal was done at the most opportune time.
LMB has five years of cart blanche rule in Korea and will get things done . He has a mandate from the public and will govern so.
*I bet ALL the protestors didn’t even bother to vote (what was the turn out for the election by the way?).
It is reasonable to let a good government have some time to govern before everyone starts reacting to temper tantrums. LMB is smart and deserves more than 100 days of governing before we start talking about tit-for-tat economic bull-sh*t.
There won’t be protests in this weather and I will place my reputation on the fact there won’t be protests (like we see now) in two months. The timing of the deal is no accident.
#74
During the Hi Seoul festival, they were serving American hot dogs off the base. I did not ask but they may have been beef hot dogs. An hour later the candle light vigil was going on in the same place.
Koreans imported US beef from most of the time from 1988-2003. Since the Korean War, large quantities of US beef has been sold on the Korean black market. For the wealthy Koreans with PX access they did not even have to buy it on the black market. Trying to argue or demonstrate with logic with the Koreans is a practice in futility. As previously mentioned, once US is part of the problem, is included, time to put on the flag and fight against the evil USA.
This is Korea. Its good it happens every couple of years, so new comers can see the true heart and soul of the country.
Do not be deceived by those late comers who come and try to justify what has happened and is happening, those with any experience at all in Korea, no much better than that BS.
I appreciate Blue Balls’ comments and especially the links too. On this:
What do Americans do with that beef? Do they use it in food, or is the old stuff used in dog food etc? I could imagine the crappy (if it is) 8-years old beef gets sold at discount and put in dog food.
i guess i should proofread more, i meant 76
I’m sorry to hear that.
The beef being American is nowhere near the crux of the matter? Surely, you must be joking. Are you suggesting that if the beef had been, say, Canadian, we’d be seeing “people power” like we’re seeing now?
I’m also glad you find the demonstrating reminiscent of the 1980s… the fact that the current president was elected in a landslide and backed up by parliamentary plurality notwithstanding.
Alas, it wasn’t the canal, or Lee’s English education fanaticism (both of which will prove much more harmful to Korea than US beef) or Korea doing nothing after organized bands of Chinese students ran riot in the heart of Seoul that brought people onto the streets. It was “I don’t want to die!!!!” US beef.
Moreover, while it MAY have been a domestic situation, Lee’s decision to postpone the beef deal has made it a bilateral one.
In fact, a) I don’t feel “betrayed” by Koreans (frankly, I think we’re beyond sentimental politics) and b) I didn’t generalize this civil movement as an anti-US protest, although I certainly think anti-American sentiment is a factor. Whether or not protesters are motivated by anger at Lee, anti-Americanism or the planetary alignment, US beef producers stand to lose out substantially if the beef deal doesn’t go through. Just as the protesters think Lee should stand up for Korean interests, I think the Bush administration should stand up for American interests.
So much for an “equal relationship.” Were you expecting US beef producers — as if industrial workers in the US weren’t displeased enough with the FTA — to roll over because the US is a big, big country and should do favors for small, small Korea? Ironic that you should invoke kowtowing, because you can’t get more sadaejuui than that. So no, I don’t think Koreans should scrap their protests and and kowtow to the US embassy, but if the US gives in — and knowing my country, it probably will — THEN I expect kowtowing to the US embassy. Preferably with gifts of ginseng and pottery.
Hey, I’m not the one who argued, “If something has even the slightest potential to harm a life, it should not be imported/exported.”
Again, I’m sorry to hear that. I regret that you felt offended.
@37
The “Slaughter House” they are talking about is not Upton Sinclair’s. It’s written by Gail Eiznitz and I think it’s a more recent review of the meat industry.
@74
go back to your blogs on “Naver” and “Yahoo.co.kr”. You would be a popular “netizen” there. Dipshit.
“The “Slaughter House” they are talking about is not Upton Sinclair’s. ”
Um.. lol, isn’t that book by Sinclair titled “The Jungle”?
@#86
I really think that anti-Americanism is no longer relevant in these waves of protests. I’m pretty sure it was ignited by anti-Americanism, but that doesn’t mean the protests are about the same thing. Populism’s dissatisfaction with elitism seem to be the pile of cowpies that’s keeping this fire going, at least from what I could see (<– not much).
Also, wouldn’t retaliatory trade ban be qualified as ’sentimental politics’?
No need for that. The commenter in question was quite polite.
Not really. It’s just tit for tat.
You all are overreacting. This isn’t about beef or the U.S. You don’t see the protestors holding “Down with US” placards, burning the US flag or throwing stuff at the US embassy. These guys and gals don’t like the fact that LMB is acting like a dictator and literally bulldozing policies down the throat of the ordinary Koreans.
Now Robert mentions the fact a lot of people voted for LMB, but what he failed to realize that the vote for LMB was 1) there was no other choice and b) the vote was a vote of no confidence against Roh and the so called liberals. So what if the people want to protest against LMB’s administrative style. This is a democracy. If people want to express themselves, it’s their right. Besides, Americans do it too.
Of course its a political play against LMB. It has been since the start. The fuel to the fire was; America is sending us its garbage and food to eat and it looks down on us. The Americans got a better deal against the Korean government. Korea somehow lost in the negotiations. This act of unfairness and the American threat to our children can not stand. Now the fire is stoked, suddenly its no so much a health issue, but LMB is a dictator. There are economic and political issues at play here. To say this is solely a political play without also examining the underlying economic ones, is as best intellectually dishonest.
Someone may have pointed this out already, but I made an error on comment 37. Upton wrote the “Jungle” not “Slaughterhouse.”