Oddly, the government has not been amused with gangs of punky young foreigners running riot in the heart of the national capital — the government has decided to deal with the rioters in stern fashion, including deportations.
In a Cabinet meeting today, Prime Minister Han Seung-soo said, “As the pride of our citizens has been hurt badly by this incident, legal and diplomatic measures that can recover the peoples’ pride will follow.”
That’s a line I’m sure our Chinese friends can appreciate.
In a Cabinet report, Justice Minister Kim Kyung-han expressed “deep regret” that foreigners had held illegal and violent demonstrations at a time when Koreans themselves were holding off on such behavior with a new administration taking office. He noted that the torch relay would have ended peacefully if not for the Chinese rioters, and the Justice Ministry would deal sternly with the problem makers, regardless of nationality.
Later, a motley crew including the cops, prosecutors, NIS, Foreign Ministry and Labor Ministry met at Seoul Central Prosecutors Office to mesh out a plan to criminally prosecute the rioters and forcefully deport them to China.
In fact, even if the rioters receive only fines or suspended sentences, they may still be deported.
Unfortunately, only one Chinese — a 21-year-old student — has been arrested. But fret not — police are examining the tons of footage from police, hotel CCTVs and ordinary citizens, so expect more arrests.
UPDATE: Police have identified four more Chinese and are now looking for ‘em. Oddly enough, all four of them live in the Busan/Gyeongnam area.
72 Comments
So pressure from the media and public opinion forced them to search their innermost recesses for a smidgen of sac. Congrats!
Strongly regret this!
Those who are found guilty should be deported. If Korea is fine with deporting illegal workers and casual pot smokers, I’d hope that violent offenders might face similarly harsh consequences. Now if they would only throw the book at local demonstrators who injure police officers and destroy property…
Send ‘em all home… collect! Chinese authorities wouldn’t do anything less for foreign rioters there.
Aside from those who threw rocks the rest should stay, with a few conditions:
1. A signed apology to the government of Korea.
2. A signed apology to their parents in China.
3. A signed apology to the embassy of China in Korea.
4. A signed open letter of apology to those injured on Sunday.
5. Attendance of a one day seminar on human rights focused on N. Korean refugees and freedom of speech focused on the rights of people to state opinions (for and against) on matters such as Tibet.
I doubt many who participated in the riots would take up this offer, but the point is civilized countries treat people differently than they do in China.
I wonder what the people who wanted to have a non-violent protest during the flame ceremony think of my suggestion. The rock throwers are lucky if all they get is deported, but for the rest of those involved in the riots this could be a good chance to educate them in ways China has obviously failed to do. I could care less what happens to the Chinese hooligans, but I would really like to know the opinions of those who were accosted and injured on this matter. It could be a good chance to take their messages of freedom of conscience, human rights, and freedom of expression directly to some affluent young Chinese that in the future will shape China.
schadenfreude
I like iwshim’s idea. Besides, the deported might just become heroes to some of China’s netizens. Having them make public apologies and acknowledgement of their bad behavior might take the wind out of their sails.
Just wait, there will be another anti-Korean backlash all throughout the Chinese internet sites. Another boycott Korea coming. Oh joy. Knowing the nature of the Chinese government, it’s also a possibility they may retaliate in kind to recover their pride.
The Chinese government doesn’t like real boycotts that might scare off foreign investment. It only likes threats of boycotts that let off domestic steam and intimidate foreigners. The government is already calling off the anti-Carrefour dogs.
“Intimidate foreigners” should read “intimidate foreign critics into silence.”
The Korea boycotts and Korea bashings are usually started by Chinese netizens. This is after the history row where Koreans are accused of stealing Chinese history and after each and every perceived slights against the Chinese by Koreans.
That’s what you get when you make It Hurts Our Pride™ the basis of public policy. Try It’s The Law, And Applies Equally to Everyone™ on a regular and sustained basis for once and see how it works.
To #3, your final comment is right on. I’ve been thinking the same thing since seeing the coverage on TV of some of the thuggery. Doesn’t seem too different from what goes on at many a demonstration here, and perhaps the local boys in blue would say that home-grown protests tend to be even more violent with sharpened bamboo poles and flaming LPG tanks among the arsenal they have to contend with.
Perhaps the incidents which took place over the weekend will result in stronger domestic condemnation of these dangerous and illegal tactics when employed by Korean protesters.
I was going thru some of the Chinese internet reactions that got translated into Korean. Not one remorse for what happened. It’s nothing but glee, pride, insults and name callings on Koreans, post after post, no remorse, no shame, no embarrassment whatsoever. Natta. If anything, it’s just the opposite - they did nothing wrong and it’s the Koreans who are making trouble because Koreans are jealous of Chinese economic rise. (If I hear one more about the Chinese economic rise…I hope the bubble burst and hopefully that’ll bring them back down to earth)
Dude, I had my adjumma class and they were pissed!
I don’t know who was angrier at Sunday’s events me or them. We all were frothing at the mouth over the antics of those object-throwing, flying kick-throwing Chinese protesters.
I predict there’ll be few Koreans making the trip over for the Olympics in August, along with China flag-biting, bee-laden, pig-tearing tomfoolery to come!
Brendon is completely right. This series of events is about rule of law, not pride or envy.
If these jackasses had not done what they did, the relay would have ended well enough to please most people but some Chinese do not know how to give people or other societies the common respect due them and seek to export their politics where it is not appropriate.
#5,
Guilt by association? I don’t think Korea should go down that route again.
#14
It seems like those netizens need to learn that the Lelang Commandery no longer exists.
There WILL be Chinese retaliation and, as has been the case throughout this spring of discontent and distortion, facts and principles won’t matter. As much as possible in the wake of years of indulgence of violent domestic protesters, Korea needs to keep the high ground and stick to the law with those Chinese rioters it expels or otherwise punishes.
Re # 15:
I don’t yet know about the other ‘adjummas’, but my wife is pissed!
Actually, so am I.
Jeffery Hodges
* * *
I agree with slim here. There are reports of Chinese being targetted for threats on their lives. Korean internet is full of anti Chinese hatred, calling them dirty chinks. And calls for retaliations and mass deportations. Does Korea want to let another 2002 happen? I hope not. Korea has to take the high moral ground. Hopefully, this will quickly wind down and initial feelings smoothed.
As today’s NYT shows, Chinese students are having a hard time expressing themselves politely even in the United States.
The students must be shown that their actions have consequences. I know, I know - Korea’s not a great model for that. But if the government doesn’t round these guys up and put them on a boat to China, it might as well kowtow and invite the Lelang back in.
Rare to say, but the Korean government is doing the right thing here.
You mean when large bands of GIs — perhaps with backing from the US embassy — ran riot in front of City Hall, looking for anti-American protesters to attack?
Doubt it — foreigners running riot in your capital never just winds down with initial feelings smoothed. And for the Chinese students to do what they did took such a level of contempt for Korea and its authorities that, frankly, I cannot even begin to fathom it. I mean, Jesus, if a picture ever said a 1,000 words:
http://blog.naver.com/ksas868/70030446138
Regardless of what Korea does, the kids will be heroes in China, so just deport the hooligans and be done with it. If they discover
Chinese intelligenceChinese student groups organized the violence, jail the leaders and then deport them. The government shouldn’t fear China — they should fear their own people.#19, 21,
Agreed. There is a world of difference between a fun little Internet slugfest and violence (or advocating violence) against people.
What’s the bet Jacques Rogge and the IOC wished old man Juan Antonio called out Toronto instead of Beijing as the ‘08 host city back in 2001.
Doubt you’d see Canuck youths running amok during the torch relay. Or would you? . . .
I don’t know. Maybe if you put a horde of Canadians with the munchies on one end of Seoul City Hall Plaza and a 7-11 on the other end…
#26,
Bah, I doubt it. Korean Cheetos suck.
What does it tell you about the status of the Rule of Law idea in Korea, though, when the “It Hurts Our Pride” rationale for action is not invoked by just another political hack but the Minister of Justice?
Correction: by the PM, whose approach was later also adopted by the MOJ
A quote from a NY Times article on the 30 Tibetans that were sentenced:
These people are shamelessly arrogant and are an affront to any rule of law. Perhaps people should really consider boycotting the Olympics this year after all, sad to say.
#5> All that signed apology stuff also smacks of the self-criticism sessions that China had in spades during the cultural revolution and still loves (see the little ‘understanding’ memo that China and France announced a day or two ago). Don’t make them sign it if you know they don’t mean it.
Wow! What Ms. Yu says seems to parallel precisely the missives that were purported to have been sent out by the Chinese Embassy to student groups around the country. If you saw the pictures you know that the police didn’t even allow the North Korean protesters to even see the torch pass much less obstruct it. Yet wave after wave and obect after object were hurled at these protesters from Chinese student nationalists nearly frothing with zealous indignation.
It’s interesting that these students are from the more affluent ranks. Perhaps the Emperor’s syndrome having some impact. “Mom, they told me this word over and over again. No! What does it mean?”
Perhaps instead of a slow boat to China, maybe have it get side-tracked and end up in the North. It could be chalked up as just some faulty navigation and could also teach them a valuable lesson in compassion and freedom of expression or a lack of it.
“Now if they would only throw the book at local demonstrators who injure police officers and destroy property…”
The riots escalated that much before because Roh Moo Hyun and the NHRC are a bunch of pussies. If you’ve noticed in the recent riots, the Riot Police didn’t use their signature tear gases as part of protocol, that is because the NHRC labeled it as a “human rights abuse”. They are a bunch of fucking morons. It’s also an embarrassment to the police, because the Riot Police were essentially detoothed and most of all dishonored.
And people wonder why the current police force has little pride left, it’s because they voted for dipshits into office.
This might be the first riot under the Lee Myung Bak administration. So we’ll have to wait and see if he will follow suit with the other riots. The riot itself isn’t embarrassing, the way the Korean police has been ineffectual in stopping it is embarrassing (especially compared to their past history for..well you know). If he is as conservative as I think, he’s probably doing this to salvage the police’s reputation rather then our society. So yeah, I think he would have a hardline stance to any future riots, whether done by foreigners or local Koreans.
Wow, quite the “riot,” eh? Wow, five people! It’s funny how quickly media distoritions can become accepted truth.I doubt a single one of you was there on Sunday for the peaceful protest.
It’s still nothing compared to the rampaging Tibetans in Lhasa. At least no one died at the hands of frothing-at-the-mouth Tibetans hunting for Chinese blood. Of course, the hippocrits on this site like to rationalize away the former with references to “human rights.” The Lhasa race riots were infinitly worse than Sunday. All of you who are condeming Sunday’s protest MUST condemn the lhasa race riots, which were led by criminals, thugs and forieng infiltrators. Not students
Just so everyone gets it right:
SUNDAY WASN’T A RIOT; IT WAS A PEACEFUL PROTEST.
THE LHASA RACE RIOTS WERE A REAL RIOT. THAT’S WHAT YOU SHOULD BE CONDEMNING
The Al Qaeda 9/11 guys all came from relative affluence as well. Especially in China, the poorer people just don’t have the time to protest. The young protesters have been the ones to benefit from the reforms, but they have 1) not had to go through the cultural revolution or Tiananmen and 2) aren’t in the business world and so don’t see the corruption and aren’t jaded about their own country.
Most importantly, people need to realize propaganda really works, especially when it is stuff you want to believe anyhow.
If I had a nickel for every time I heard ‘humiliation’…
Amen to 36: “people need to realize propaganda really works”
Ok buddy. I’ll tell the Korean media, population, and immigration officials of your revelation. This is all just blown out of proportion. I’ll make sure everything goes back to normal, to your definition of reality.
Man, I really want to smack the look from that kid’s face.
MoralMidgetElgin, does your white wife know of your love for Chinese pussy?
“Perhaps instead of a slow boat to China, maybe have it get side-tracked and end up in the North.”
You don’t need a lame excuse for getting a boat “lost” in North Korea, since the shortest route to the Chinese border is through the DPRK. March them through Panmunjom and let them find their way home from there.
MoralMidgetElgin,
I agree that the Tibet riots were orders of magnitudes worse than the other day’s protests. Hunting and killing minorities is an abomination. It would be good if we could find out more how the monks’ protests escalated so far and why the cops didn’t have a chance to get in earlier. We need more information.
And yes, while only five people being injured in Korea is relatively small for the number of people involved, it’s pretty clear that it was not a peaceful protest. What I am worried by is how a handful of legitimate grievances managed to instantly polarise concerned Chinese. It’s fine to disagree and complain, but to elevate the situation to the point where any dissent is seen and punished as treachery puts the protesters under a pretty unflattering light.
In Australia, for example, there were a few scuffles, but the Chinese students were diplomatic enough to hold up the Australian flag as well as their own. That was a peaceful protest. Kicking, throwing missiles, and chasing an opponent into a hotel in Korea doesn’t count as peaceful from my point of view.
Am I the only one who keeps hearing from Chinese visitors to Korea that “It doesn’t seem like a foreign country”? I’m wondering if this is part of the problem.
And #38: I get to slap him when you’re finished.
#41: Perhaps it’s relevant that Chinese studying in Korea are not of the elite that end up studying in English-speaking countries. Just a thought.
Robert Koehler and #38,
Yes, the pictures look like they represent arrogance.
The only problem is that reading 1,000 words into them is exactly what many posters here are complaining the Chinese have done regarding the sloppy reporting in the West.
Do you look like an intelligent, erudite man in your passport photos? If so, how many times did it take to get it right?
MME: Wow, quite the “riot,” eh? Wow, five people! It’s funny how quickly media distoritions can become accepted truth.
Five people, my arse. Let’s go to the YouTube…
http://youtube.com/watch?v=TTcNdZ9kMUM
http://youtube.com/watch?v=hi_.....re=related
(check out the circle of friendship at 0:23 and the good times at 1:00 and 1:09)
Here is a mob chanting “Daoqien!” (道歉, Apologize!) while hitting a handful of opponents or trying to stab them with flag poles in the hotel:
http://youtube.com/watch?v=3wT4scEwMIc
This video is more organized and has explanatory subtitles and adds footage of similar actions in Japan:
http://youtube.com/watch?featu.....tBZTixTAxU
MME, maybe you mean there were just five Chinese per opponent.
This is simply infuriating. I am almost speechless.
China as a nation needs to look these acts square in the eye, recognize things are way out of hand, and give an apology for how its citizens have acted in South Korea, Japan, and other places.
The world is watching, and what they see is not as distorted as you’d like to think.
Alejandro Marivosa,
I think the reason for the peaceful protest is probably because Australia’s new PM, Kevin Rudd, earlier the country’s ambassador to Beijing, has a big space in his heart for China and speaks decent Mandarin. Hell, he even—as a friend—brought up human rights when addressing students at Beijing University. The comment was more or less ignored and drew no criticism.
Here is a translated version of his speech:
http://www.theaustralian.news......47,00.html
And a short video of his stand-up comedy routine in Beijing:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v.....re=related
A secondary reason for the peace might be that Canberra put up a wire fence around the torch route and refused to allow the blokes in blue track-suits to defend the flame.
@# 35 MME
“SUNDAY WASN’T A RIOT; IT WAS A PEACEFUL PROTEST.”
Please tell about it to all other Chinese in China, as I am afraid there would be real hatred riot against Korean in China when does Chinese student deported.
In the spirit of Olympic, please tell Chinese that please stay clam when team China loose any game to other countries as the whole world will see how Chinese would react to the those games.
Rest easy, Jimong. The Chinese media has been silent about the violence that occurred last weekend in Seoul although news has spread among young Chinese on the internet. If the Korean government does deport, CCTV viewers and readers of the People’s Daily won’t know about it. No anti-foreign protests take place without the government’s blessing, and the Chinese government isn’t going to butt heads publicly with Korea over a few punks.
As relevant as this latest episode makes Chinese actions to Korea, I’m not convinced that the Marmot’s Hole needs to remain on the radar of Chinese nationalists. Take a look at the Peking Duck to see how insufferably futile it is to engage in dueling monologues with the angry young subjects of the Middle Kingdom, who really only have one line of reasoning and very selective set of facts. That Moral Amoeba dude is just the tip of the iceberg and, frankly, he makes me miss the clarity and good sense of a Pawigirogi.
CM, please name one well-publicized boycott of Korean products in China. I lived for four years in Qingdao, where 90% of the foreign population is Korean, and Korean businesses abound. I never heard of even one boycott threat. To the contrary, the city of Qingdao hosts an annual tribute to Korean culture, called “Korea Week.” The mayor and his cronies roll out the red carpet when a POSCO or LG delegation comes to town and for good reason - multimillion dollar investments in job-generating plants and factories.
Korea-bashing is an internet pastime for university students with inferiority complexes .
i didn’t read all the comments so someone might have already mentioned it. if the korean government deports them, the chinese got nothing to complain about. i mean, they deport n.koreans right back to n.korea, right?
Actually, for a government that calls one of the greatest policy disasters in history the “Great Leap Forward,” calling these riots a “peaceful protest” seems fairly apt.
Great news! See how these arrogant brats feel about wasting an attempt at university here.
Perhaps I am alone here, but while taking pictures of the torch relay at olympic park and the tibet march near kyobo books, I must say I think the police did a good job keeping order. I fully agree that those chinese students who acted violently should be held accountable for their actions…but to blame the police for what happened is, in my opinion, not right.
I think the Koreans should respond to the Chinese on a level they can understand and appreciate.
Have the government contact all their gangster buddies, truck in about 100 busloads of toughboys wearing red bandanas and brandishing iron pipes (come on, you’ve seen this time and again in all those Korean gangster films). Let the Tibetans stage another rally. Let the Chinese Embassy amass 500 “students” again. Except this time… the riot police evaporate and the Chinese “students” get beat into a bloody pulp by 5,000 of the most violent men from the dregs of Korean society. After the Chinese are knocked unconscious, the police come in to “break up” the violence, letting the Korean gangsters leave on their buses, and then club the heads of the Chinese “students” a few times Kwangju-style before arresting them all and deporting them back to China.
When Hu Jin-Tao starts bitching, the Korean ambassador to China can say, “A few Koreans felt very strongly about the Tibet issue, and they showed up to express their good will. But alas, things got a little violent, and anyways the Korean people express sympathy for all the Chinese students which got injured for making a ruckus. By the way, good luck with the Olympics.”
Tit for tat.
韩国警察 加油!
Mongoloid he was a mongoloid
Happier than you and me
Mongoloid he was a mongoloid
And it determined what he could see
Mongoloid he was a mongoloid
One chromosome too many
Mongoloid he was a mongoloid
And it determined what he could see
And he wore a hat
And he had a job
And he brought home the bacon
So that no one knew
Mongoloid he was a mongoloid
His friends were unaware
Mongoloid he was a mongoloid
Nobody even cared
“Take a look at the Peking Duck to see how insufferably futile it is to engage in dueling monologues with the angry young subjects of the Middle Kingdom, who really only have one line of reasoning and very selective set of facts.”
Same with many overseas Chinese immigrants in America and Canada too. They’re also extremely anti-American to boot, and distrust the American presence in Korea as a threat to China. They don’t tell you to your face what they think if you’re white, but I’ve heard enough “us Asians should stick together against the big bad white man”, or “White man is jealous of China’s rise so that’s why they’re trying to derail the Olympics” crap. Chinese also say riots in Tibet is the Chinese 9-11. They say Chinese were the ones killed not Tibetans and that Chinese are the ones being blamed by the white man.
They also liken the USFK in Korea, as colonial “occupation”. And that Korea is America’s bitch. (even worse than accusations by people here complaining Korea is China’s bitch). And these are American and Canadian citizens with these kinds of views. Makes me sickened that there’s not much dissent toward these extreme views in the Chinese community.
I was at the relay, both at the beginning near the Olympic Park and at the end near City Hall. In my opinion, for what I saw, the vast majority of Chinese people just wanted to take photos of the flame, wave their flags and chant their slogans. It wasn’t difficult to get a free flag or pick up that chants but that’s hardly against the law.
#47, user-81, thanks for posting the videos. They certainly show that there were more than 5 people involved in violence, but they still don’t show the vast majority of Chinese people at the relay. Most of them were peaceful and the comments here should reflect that.
In the last video the “Korean policeman stabbed by several Chinese men” at 01:42 has the words “PRES” on his shirt and looks like he has been hit by a flying object, probably a stone, rather than stabbed.
cm: Makes me sickened that there’s not much dissent toward these extreme views in the Chinese community.
What we have here is a failure to see the obvious. For most of its history, the primary threat to Korea’s continued existence as an independent state has come from a single country. That country is not Japan.
The fact that there isn’t much disagreement with these views in the Chinese community indicates not that they are extreme, but that they are mainstream. Do a little comparative history sometime. Look at India’s history and then look at China’s*. Which has more cause for grievance? Which constantly harps on about humiliation? Let’s face it - the Chinese really, really think that they are superior, and have this sense of entitlement that really has to be seen to be believed.
* I really don’t get how China gets off railing on about imperialism. Empire, thy name is China.
#47,
Yes, clearly there were more than 5 violent Chinese
protesters.
One thing…I wonder if some of the young Korean ‘pro-Tibet’ protesters were more interested in antagonizing the Chinese because of the China-Korea dispute over ancient history (not that I support Chinese historical revisionism).
This was a government conspiraracy to embarrass China on the public stage! I have proof this was orchestrated by the same inside group who orchestrated the 9/11 attacks: the U.S. government, in particular the CIA.
Several Chinese students report that undercover CIA agents infiltarted their peaceful protests to make it seem like a riot occured. The CIA also orchestrated the Tibetan Race Riots and the other olympic torch protests. Notice the pictures: those students didn’t look Chinese, they looked like Americans wearing heavy makeup. Look carefully and you’ll see! This is a move to discredit China so the U.S. has an excuse to boost arms sales to Taiwan and strenghen its military forces in Asia.
This CIA group is the exact same shadow group that was responsible for orchestrating the 9/11 attacks. Of course, it’s common knowledge now that 9/11 could not have been pulled off by Al-Queada, however after their faliures were exposed, the CIA changed tactics to attack China.
Don’t be duped by the CIA! LEarn the truth!!!
Classic!
Yup this is the same group that orchestrated 9/11, killed Princes Diana, JFK, RFK, MLK, hides stories about ESP and UFOs. The reason they do this: those folks knew too much! now they are targeting the Chinese in their plan for global domination to relaunch the new world order. That’s what I’ve been trying to warn you about.
This group is led by the same group of people who contend the holocaust actually happened: yup, the Jews. The Jews are behind all of this in their plan to control the global financial system and form a unified world government. Except the Jews aren’t the Jews. They are actually a species of reptilian space aliens who control all the strings. Don’t be duped by the reptiallians! They grays are not your enemy! don’t be afriad!
“Look! It’s a wall of make-up wearing CIA agents, I mean Jews, I mean space reptiles. What the hell is it! Quick, call John Carpenter!”
I have to admit I can’t distinguish MME’s serious views from the (perhaps) attempted sarcasm. They exist on virtually the same plane of reality — and most likely were carried by the HwanQiu Ribao (a People’s Daily lite) in recent memory.
I believe the correct pronunciation is “joos”
I am a ethnic Chinese and would like to offer my opinion.
What would you feel if someone from China says something like this (I replaced China with Korea to illustrate my point):
“…but the point is civilized countries treat people differently than they do in Korea.”
I have no problem if the few violent young Chinese were called “uncivilized” because that is what they are. I do have an issue with extending this label to a whole nation.
Most people in China are not chauvanist pigs. You have plenty of those given the large Chinese population. The same may hold true in Korea, I guess?
I don’t know about everyone else on this blog, but I’d probably give him a slap on the back and buy him a beer. I say stuff like that all the time!
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