A 28-year-old fashion designer by the name of Mr. Park has been booked on charges of sexually assaulting an American man in a Mapo-gu sauna.
According to police, Park assaulted (which probably means in this case inappropriately touched) the American, a 27-year-old English teacher, as he slept in the sauna jjimjilbang. The victim had his loins covered with a towel as he slept.
Park pleaded with the police for leniency, claiming he did it “out of curiosity since he was a foreigner.”
(HT to Baduk)
UPDATE: Funny comment by a Chosun Ilbo reader:
Curiosity? What were you curious about? Did you think he had two dicks?
{ 62 comments… read them below or add one }
I’m torn. Shall we parley this into a discussion of whether or not Koreans see non-Koreans as having the same basic human rights as they do, or just have a laugh at Mr. Park, the goofy, possibly-repressed-homosexual buffoon of jjimjilbang follies?
Why not both, Granfalloon?
Well hell, who hasn’t wanted to grope some guy in a sauna at some point in their life, out of curiosity.
#1 Both are ripe for discussion!
Let’s start:
by this idiot’s logic, if an American in America was curious about that completely idiotic rumor of Asian women having sideways vaginas and went in for a closer inspection ala this guy’s assaulting style. The ignorant person should get leniency from prosecution because they were “curious”?
We can all benefit from this logic-
Gee, I’m curious what that girl’s boobs feel like. Maybe I’m just curious!
exactly why i never go to those places
I hope that you continue to update this case as I’m sure it will prove hilarious.
sideways vaginas?
Listen kids, back in the 70s white foreigner males were often groped by both Korean women and men on crowded buses for exactly the same reason as this poor guy in the jjimjilbang… sheer curiosity! Yes, some Koreans back then really couldn’t quite believe that foreigners had the same anatomy, and curiosity got the better of them. You can call it what you will, deplore it, denounce it… but the historical precedents are strong. Like so many things about Korea, it came with the territory.
cm: strange but true! There were, until recently at least, quite a few Americans who believed this about Asian women.
“Listen kids, back in the 70s white foreigner males were often groped by both Korean women and men on crowded buses for exactly the same reason as this poor guy in the jjimjilbang… sheer curiosity! Yes, some Koreans back then really couldn’t quite believe that foreigners had the same anatomy, and curiosity got the better of them. You can call it what you will, deplore it, denounce it… but the historical precedents are strong. Like so many things about Korea, it came with the territory.”
Your point (and his defense) is moot in light of the fact that Koreans are, by some accounts, the biggest surfers of internet porn in Asia.
He was probably homosexual. They seem to hook up at jjimjilbangs, and thats why I avoid them now.
Guys should never go to one alone (unless of course they are homosexual and looking to hook up with someone).
#8
one of them was my roomate while i was in army and he was from Atlanta GA not some small hick town from Arkansas or Alabama
In 93 we came from AIT (job training) Ft. Belvoir VA and got orders to Korea and he said all the women had horizontal vagina’s
I just laughed but always wondered how many people may have believed this myth
he’s lucky he didn’t fall asleep in the sauna between geckos and the hill.
I heard the sideways vagina myth from several of my ignorant kinfolk.
Personally, I think it’s just dumb, but the joke/myth seems to persist.
Anyway, luckily it hasn’t happened to me, but a few of my friends have had their johnsons grabbed by Korean men. One friend had it done to him twice in a bath house. Another friend was into taekwondo when he was here. His instructor grabbed his package right in the middle of class.
I have heard that traditionally Koreans don’t feel the same fears of homosexuality or cross-the-the line rudeness of checking out others junk.
That said, I truly believe that thereis a large population of repressed homosexuals in Korea who clandestinely seek out the satisfaction of their urges. They seem to think of us foreign men as easy targets for some reason. Could it be that they think most foreign men can easily “take a walk on the wild side”? Could it be that if their advances were spurned and the foreigner protested over the assault, no one would believe them? Who knows!
foreigners are easy.
Bad Monkey:
This is my point exactly, except towards the end where you dismiss it as something that “comes with the territory.” I’m not a relativist, so UNDER NO CIRCUMSTANCES is it ever OK to handle a stranger’s junk. Now, I’ll never know what it’s like to interact with Koreans as a Korean, but in cases like this, I really have to wonder if junk-handling is something that goes on between Koreans all the time, and it’s only we foreigners who get bent out of shape about it. Because if it isn’t, then Mr. Park’s actions are partially the result of him as seeing foreigners as a quasi-subhuman category, where junk -handling is somewhat more excusable.
Gotta admit though, despite the horrific, Mengele-esque racism implied, this is pretty funny.
@11 so Koreans were the biggest surfers of internet porn in the 70’s? I didn’t know Korea had the same mad internet infrastructure back then.
@9 I’ve had some girls grab my junk in Itaewon, but at the time, seemed like they KNEW what they were after.
As far as the curiosity thing… reminds me of a anecdote in Michael Breen’s book of anecdotes (”The Koreans”) about the foreign visitors who were given a bowl of rice by some Koreans, who watched eagerly to see if the foreigners would eat the rice, the bowl, or the chopsticks. If I recall, it didn’t happen all too long ago, relative to the 5,000 year history of this civilazation. Within 100 years I recall.
@17 It’s 2008. Mr. Park is either homo- or bisexual. Period. He took a risk and lost. He’d be better off to go to Itaewon in the future and find some gay-friendly venues where he can grab him some junks more freely.
Laughter is an acceptable response for this story, correct?
It’s the preferred response.
The guy is a “fashion designer.” I think it was more than just curiosity.
Bad Monkey,
I was here in the 70s, and I had Korean ajumas touch the hair on my arms and chest, but none ever groped my privates, at least, not out of curiosity.
“Listen kids, back in the 70s white foreigner males were often groped by both Korean women and men on crowded buses for exactly the same reason as this poor guy in the jjimjilbang… sheer curiosity!”
Are you a believer in the Tooth Fairy?
#8
the sideways vagina is true
in fact the Japanese got the inspiration for the transverse engine from that…
A couple of guys came onto me at the sauna located just past the Sorrento’s restaurant on I’taewon Street back in 2003. Also, a well-known administrator at The Korea Herald used to pat me on my backside from time-to-time and once even groped my package. After a, ehem, handful of these overtures, I asked him if he was gay or thought that I was of that sexual orientation. He went ballistic and insisted that he thought that was how all guys in Europe and North America behave towards their male friends or colleagues. I used his acts of sexual harrassment against the company when they tried to ding me out of over 4.6 million won by truthfully asserting that I’d go to all of the Korean papers in the world and the government if Hong did not pay me within 3 days. For the record, I got my money in 24 hours.
The owner of the first wine bar in I’taewon also pulled this shite on me twice in Gecko’s when I was a newbie and at least 5 other local males have done the same to me in different sorts of situations.
Last, I saw the owner of Woodstock Rock-n-Roll bar grope an eighteeen year old G.I. in his sack on a Tuesday night in November, 2000. The G.I. pushed him away in disgust and then threw his bottle of brew at the lech. Hell, the Yank was immediately grabbed by some other Koreans and taken to the M.P.s. I ran into him in front of Club DeBut on Hooker Hill on the same night that he had finally completed his punishment: 60 days of being restricted to Yongsan Base.
The point of this post is that Korea does have pervs who like to sexually attack foreigners.
Later y’all.
Wow. I once woke up to discover a guy spooning me in a jimjilbang in Hongdae, and I’ve been on the receiving end of a queer-leer or two, but I’ve never had any teste-testing.
Metropolitician recounts an ajussi who pulled the “emergency stop” cable on the subway, and also said, “I was just curious” — (Feb 12th: Ajussis Ruin Everything)
I guess “I was curious” counts as “get out of jail free” card #2, for when the usual, “I was drunk” defense fails.
It definitely holds more water than the Namdaemun Arsonist’s “I was thinking about firebombing a subway station. . . thought I’d do this instead. You should be thanking me” defense.
I wonder if this guy is a successful fashion designer? What’s the going rate in court these days for nut grabs?
and at what point did I move to Australia, according to the flag here? I’m pretty sure I’m still in 서대문
I have frequented jjimjilbangs before many times. they are cheap places to sleep. I have had men roll over onto me from time to time and Ive suspected they werent really sleeping. other times I have had over attempts at people grabing my hoo-hoo dilly in the sauna. One man in particular was successful. I glared at him and shaked my head. I know, being a foreigner, if you confront them and fight, the foreigner loses(legally). Now I keep my head on a swivel using the Gay-dar at all times.
Still I have noticed korean men grabbing little Boys johnsons out in the open. i often wonder if this is this is the pretext for the childrens “ddong chim” where they stick their finger in a quick movement up another boys (or male teachers) arse.
with the prevalence of porno in this society, I suppose I shouldnt be surprised! Also i think koreans know that most foreigners dont have these places in their countries (except russia) and they assume we are there because we are gay.
a side note: if a guy tries to grab your hoo-hoo dilly while you are sleeping , you can say to the police your knocking his lights out were an unconscious reflex to his waking you suddenly. Its plausible!
1 more thing:
How to sleep in a jjimjilbang.
1. Best possibility is get one of those private single sleeping caves,
2. Sleep next to a wall.
3. Sleep next to a family in the common sleeping areas.
4. dont sleep in the male only rooms
5. dont sleep naked, whether you have a towel covering your hoo-hoo dilly or not.
You know, this sort of curiosity could have its fun. One could simply put a fake limp down their pants so that they look like Iggy Pop in concert and that would make people crazy curious.
Maybe it is time to start a Korean Candid Camera.
learn something new every day.
Never heard of anything like this happening in ladies’ saunas. Our bits get ogled, but no touching, accidental or otherwise.
34. sonagi: envy – wish I could have more notgrope in my sauna experience
32. elgin: such a premise would be hilarious — but hard to pull off in a naked Korean sauna; in Japan, where people usually use towels more, it might be feasible, though the idea of setting up lots of cameras in a sauna sounds a bit sketchy to me. it’d have to be late night candid camera, and I’d feel bad for the person who has to edit the footage.
31. hit it on the head. (that’s praise; not a further piece of advice)
hoo hoo dilly:
the synonyms for junk are getting funnier and funnier on this thread. I’ve always liked saying blurry bits, and anyone who’s looked for a rental at a video shop and checked one shelf over from the kids’ animations, or channel-surfed at 2am in Seoul knows why.
Obviously this is way beyond the bounds of decency etc. but there really is the whole “foreigners are so strangey” thing. I recently gave birth to my first child here in Korea and the lack of personal space/privacy amazed me! When I was still pregnant little kids and ajummas wanted to rub my belly and ask me about the baby. It made me a little uncomfortable, but I didn’t really mind, I mean, little kids and ajummas have no boundaries anyway!
But I found it really uncomfortable the day I came to the hospital nursery to find all of the nurses examining my son’s private parts… I know it was totally innocent, but it was still weird! And of course the women who wanted to touch my son while I was nursing…
It’s just so different in Korea, the people are so homogenized that they’re like little kids seeing exotic animals for the first time.
In 1998 I was on a bus with a group of Koreans in Rangoon, Burma, when I felt something on my arm. A 40-ish ajuma was staring at and stroking my arm hair, which I have a good bit of. It was weird, but not really disturbing.
No Korean men ever went for my other bits, but I did notice a few gazers in the kisuksa shower and at the local sauna.
#34 and #36, my wife gave birth in Korea as well, and found the same things that the latter poster did. She also attended a pregnancy yoga class in Cheongju, where we lived. Being that she is way more stacked than the average Korean lady, she drew quite a bit of attention, to the point where a group of mommies felt inclined to cop a feel of her titties in the change rooms afterwards.
cmm made a good point about this guy probably just being a closet queer, and I figured he was probably right. However, what with all the stories of ajumma touching arm hair and pregnant women grasping boobies, I’m inclined to return to my original premise. Do you think Koreans are more prone to this sort of behavior with waygookin, because, hey, foreigners don’t count?
Why can’t these english teacher tight arse who make 40-50k an hour fork that out for a motel. Get a good night sleep and maybe even rub a couple out to the lame arse pron they have.
Wow. I’m now glad I never made a habit of going to saunas while in Korea.
‘However, what with all the stories of ajumma touching arm hair and pregnant women grasping boobies….’
let’s keep in mind these stories are just that. and told by expats. don’t forget that.
#38 just like a Canadian friend of mine who used to live here.
She has very large chesticles and she said that sometimes ajumma would grab them on the bus or subway. She would get pissed, but the ajumma just gave the same excuse.
Now, a Korean lady friend of mine is large chested as well. She has told me that ajumma in the bath house regularly talk about it right in front of her and have grabbed them a few times. In the bar, there are some other Korean women her boobs, in their 30’s, who get a bit tipsy and start talking about her cans. Mostly it’s just envy.
Whether this grabbing is done more to waygookin than Korean, I can’t say. What it does point to is from that website “stuff Asian people like”. One of the things was the constant comparing themselves to other people. They are extremely competitive and very curious to see if someone has something more or less than them.
Generally, I would guess that they think pretty much all Koreans are the same when it comes to anotomy. They seem to believe that we waygookin are very different and they are very curious about it. This leads to the staring at privates in the bathroom and the grabbing of goodies by Koreans.
This curiousity does not ever excuse sexual assault. It’s illegal and they should know/behave better!
That said, I truly believe the fashion designer/schlong grabber is a closeted gay man who was looking for a little action. When he was spurned, he went for the excuse of “I was just curious. He’s just a foreigner anyway, so it’s no big deal”. I hope he is shamed and friggin’ learns to never do that again to an unwilling participant.
Error! 2nd paragraph is supposed to say this:
Now, a Korean lady friend of mine is large chested as well. She has told me that ajumma in the bath house regularly talk about it right in front of her and have grabbed them a few times. In the bar, there are some other Korean women we know, in their 30’s, who get a bit tipsy and start talking about her cans. Mostly it’s just envy.
In a decade here, I have about 20-30 instances of strangers on trains, co-workers, and people in bars and restaurants reaching out and touching the hair on my arms. My arms are not really very hairy, but they are not the pre-puberty hairless boy arms Korean men sport.
I think it is the same thing, but a ‘one-step-further’ expression of Koreans willingness to shout “Hello!” at foreign strangers, or walk up to you and begin matter-of-factly demanding information from you, (where you’re from, where you work, etc. Notice too they never ask ‘what’s your name?’ That would make you uncomfortably human-like.) And the reason is, in the rank-pile that is Korea, white and black foreigners rank dead-bottom. Respect is not necessary.
Who can be freely addressed by strangers? Children, and dogs.
Here boy! Ohhh, hey little fella!
Where are you from?
Whether we rank below or the same, I don’t know or care.
Look at Pawikirogi. He’s made it abundantly clear that he regards whites and blacks as inferior to himself. His attitudes and views are the fully-articulated opinion of the majority of Korean people, in my opinion.
Pawi,
My ’story’ is 100 fact. Don’t forget that.
pawi – “let’s keep in mind these stories are just that. and told by expats. don’t forget that.”
Translation: If a foreigner happens to say anything remotely unfavorable about Korea – even if he or she happens to like and/or respect most other things about the country and its people – it must be false.
By the way, how much time have you actually spent in Korea lately?
Somewhere in the ether, Pawi laughs maniacally, and cackles, “These expats are so easy: they get defensive at the tiniest little swipe! Mwahahahaha!” his buddies WJK, Wiesunja and UltraKorean (from the Korea Times comment board) give him high fives. “You da troll! VANK forever!”
another important tip:
If you here a man enquire if you are alone (honja)and you are, say “no My wife is in the sauna.” Homos, if they bother to talk to you, usually ask that question.
I also have had my arms stroked by kids but never adults.
But I have to say i believe it is an innocent reaction to so many years of living ina foreigner free homogenous society. I do believ curiosity is a defense to an extent however, Koreans are no dummies, they must understand that a mans hoo-hoo-dilly is off limits and that foreigners, though interesting to stare at, are proven to actually be Human and they need to check their western science books which were first created by foreigners. soemtimes i feel like i am an animal on display at the zoo, but I flt the same way in africa. ( I must confess no african ever grabbed my monkey though)
Thanks for the tip crazy monkey!
Most know their boundaries, but a few need to learn that curiousity is not an excuse for sexual assault. Maybe of there are more publicized cases like this, some will get the hint.
Pawi is the ultimate nemesis of expats troll!
Anecdote of wifes annual school reunion after our marriage:-
Me: So how did the reunion go?
Her indoors:- All the girls wanted to know whether if the rumours that westerners are much bigger than koreans were true.
Me: So what did you say.
Her indoors:- Don’t worry chagi, I lied!!!
Pawi,
So you think either my wife is lying or I am making it up for the sake of embellishment? I know plenty of other women who have suffered worse indignities in saunas, but you are programmed to filter out stories from der vaterland which aren’t to your liking, no?
52 aaronm: don’t take Pawi’s bait. trolls are like Paris Hilton: they’ll only go away if we ignore them. if you feed the troll, it just comes back stronger and meaner. (see my comment: 48)
the fact you and I are having this mini-conversation pleases the troll, and increases the chance he’ll bait someone else on the comment boards again, later.
I believe you.
Reminds me of this kyopo I know of in Busan. He once said that one of his favorite hobbies is making up new ID’s, getting on message boards, and winding people. He just likes to get people mad and watch them go at it.
Yes, he is a loser!
Actually, in this particular case, I think pawi has a point. I’m skeptical of any notion that’s supported only by anecdotal evidence. No offense people: I’m sure you’re all wonderful folk. But I take everything I read on the interwebs with three grains of salt. And so should you. A few stories about grabbin’ da wimmins’ hooters an’ da mens’ weiners is not a foundation for making assertions about Korean socio-psychology.
S’fun, though.
granfallon: well said. grains of salt should be liberally applied, and provocation/baiting radar should be set on high sensitivity before wading onto comment boards.
Personally, the post-wars that show up from time to time on Marmot make me giggle with glee, much the same way I get a kick out of watching couples argue in Subway stations, (though I try to avoid the comment boards at Dave’s), and I’ve been saving that Paris Hilton comparison up for just such an opportunity, but mostly I just hope everyone involved is taking the whole discussion as lightly as I do.
and you’re right about universalizing a personal experience too, of course: as we know, ALL generalizations are false. All of them. even this one.
#45 hello johnson^^
i laughed when you said that people never asked for your name. i would have to agree with you on that.
whenever i start a conversation with a stranger (im asian but not korean), i tend to ask other questions first before asking for the person’s name. it seems more polite because you can converse about trivial stuff with a stranger without being too personal (asking for his name). i have noticed that people are more open to talk about themselves if they remain anonymous. ask them their name without making small talk first and they would be wary and clam up.
(example, a conversation between two complete strangers in a bus stuck in traffic)
A: oh my goodness, im running late! let’s go already!
B: so am i! my boss is gonna kill me.
A: yes, i hate this area. i always get stuck here. where do you work?
B: downtown, near so-and-so
A: really? i go to so-and-so
B: oh, we’re neighbors! what’s your job?
…
and the questions go on until one of them decides that it’s time to ask for the name of the other person. sometimes, the conversation ends even without exchanging names.
it never occurred to me that people might find that practice rude.
HOWEVER,just for the record, i only do that to the locals.^^ i always introduce myself and shake hands with foreigners. (cause i know for them it’s the polite thing to do). for the locals, they would think it as rather unnerving.
just sharing^^
Lorin: interesting observation.
With other people who are obviously not Korean, I’ll use any number of conversation starters, or just leave’em alone and not stare (sometimes other foreigners stare as much as kids do), but when I notice a local eyeballing me a lot on the subway or the sidewalk, I usually wave and say, “Welcome to Korea,” or ask, “Where are you from?”
Guaranteed to get a laugh, and that first half-second of “hey wait a minute. . . I’M supposed to say that” is high comedy.
hello roboseyo~
i bet whenever that happens, people are either amused or they’d just shrug it off and mutter, “those crazy foreigners”.
well, people are strange when you’re a stranger
actually, I get a laugh almost every time, and it’s been the foot-in-the-door for some of my best conversations with strangers.
It’s effective because it subverts the usual “fine thank you and you, where are you from?” rote recitation of the high school textbook, skipping right past the boring stuff, to an actual person speaking to another actual person.
All that to say: it’s led to some very refreshing and not-like-every-other conversations with strangers, and also some great double-takes and laughs, when the person I addressed didn’t speak enough English to converse. (I also usually get a laugh when I say “fine thank you, and you?” with a big, silly grin on my face.)
ps: re: comment 57: I only ask names when I’m way deep into the conversation — if I ask it too early, I forget it every time. It’s easier for me to remember the name when I can attach it to something — “annie’s the one with a story about getting lost in Kuala Lumpur” is easier to remember than “annie. . . two eyes, nose, ears. . . uhh. . . what else. . . ?”
The person that this happened to was my friend. He was wearing the pajamas given by the jim-jil-bang, not the towel that was mentioned in the article. The guy was trying to take off my friends pants and put my friends… thing in his mouth. He also had his cell phone out. The man said it was for light, but my friend though he was going to take a picture. The man also had a picture of himself in a bikini when you open the phone, and one of those cell phone decorations shaped like a male genetalia.
To sum up the situation at the police station, the reaction of this man (and his mother who came to help him) led both my friend and the police to believe that this situation has happened before. The man tried to buy off my friend, who basically said, “Screw you!” and pressed charges.
The Korean man is NOT indicitive of typical Korean culture. I’ve never, personally, had an experience like this in the 2+ years I’ve been in Korea.
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