French director Luc Besson has apparently made fun of Korea — again. And Korea Herald columnist Kim Seong-kon isn’t happy about it. He writes:
Luc Besson’s “Taxi” is so popular that many people around the world have seen it. Perhaps Koreans gravely underestimate the impact of the silver screen, but “Taxi” has devastated the image of Korea. In the famous French movie, Korea is portrayed as nothing but a destitute Third World country of poverty and smuggling, which is far from the truth. Compared with “Die Another Day,” also criticized for its misrepresentation of Korea, “Taxi” is far worse, for it maliciously damages the image of Korea.
Strangely, the Korean people remain silent about the French director’s unabashed distortion of Korea. Where are those who once vehemently demonstrated against “Die Another Day”? Where are those who passionately called for the boycott of “Falling Down,” in which a jobless American smashes a Korean grocery store in L.A.? Why do the anti-American activists keep silent about the French movie that seriously mocks Korea?
Kim later suggests that Korea should use Hollywood to promote its image by using Korea as a filming location or by distributing Korean films through Hollywood studios. Good luck, I say to that. And I’m not being sarcastic.
Still, Kim’s bitching about foreign films that make Korea look bad will evoke only so much sympathy from me. Yes, I understand that a film like “Taxi” will have more of a global impact than films such as, say, “Hanbando,” “The Host” or “Welcome to Dongmakgol,” but still, given the less-than-positive depictions of Japan and the United States in recent Korean films, you really can’t complain when it other countries do it to you.
(HT to reader)
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He has an ax to grind because his movie ‘The Fifth Element’ had been edited without his permission so that the theaters could fit more screenings in a day as it was common practice in Korean until he, Luc Besson, trashed the movie distributors in the press and threatened to never release one of his movies in Korea again.
…or so goes the rumor.
PS. Woops, didn’t read the article. It mentions the “censorship” of The Fifth Element.
amen, robert.
“Why do the ANTI-AMERICAN activists keep silent about the FRENCH movie that seriously mocks Korea?”
I could think of a lot of dumb answers to this dumb question.
Does Kim not know that Samsung paid money for that product placement of the phone in “Ocean’s Thirteen”? This qualifies for dishonesty or stupidity (or both). Why should foreigners (essentially) not be allowed to criticize Korea? If she could stop it, she would. Thus, Besson is proved correct in my opinion.
They did it with ‘The Host’, they get it back in ‘Taxi’. Haven’t they heard of the saying “what goes around, comes around”?
It’s not just in the movies he directed himself. In the American remake of Taxi, the character played by Queen Lateefah refuses to get into a car (looked like a Daewoo Avella to me), does not want to open the door and get in. She explains, “I don’t want no Daewoo on my hands!”. (The Korean subtitles translated that to, “I don’t ride in compact cars!”, LOL).
i’ll take the same stance as someone else here did (and i’m sorry i can’t remember who it was–maybe iheartblueballs) a few months ago when there was another instance of childish whingeing by a korean journalist regarding how korea and/or koreans were being “unfavourably” portrayed internationally in certain films or books or whatever:
korea, you want to be a big-time player in the world? welcome to the big leagues, where people constantly take potshots at you, fair or otherwise.
to paraphrase a popular english idiom, if you can’t stand the foreplay or sex, stay out of the bedroom.
to paraphrase a popular english idiom, if you can’t stand the foreplay or sex, stay out of the bedroom.
Ooo, I like that. Can I patent that like what Brandon did with “The Expat™”?
Kind of funny, reading French reviews and entries about The Host I was struck by French indignation at the film’s anti-Americanism, termed “unjust” and “propagandistic.”
I searched Luc Besson and Korean in French (Coreen & Coree) but found nothing, for what it’s worth, apart from some positive reviews of films like Secret Sunshine, Oasis, Spring Summer Fall Winter and Spring and even Shiri.
I’m sure that if France played a larger role in Korean affairs a virulent strain of anti-French sentiment would emerge like a slimy, fast moving monster from the Han…
#10: you may patent that phrase if you like, but i require compensation of exactly 69 indian kama sutra-style rupees every time it’s used.
This is an example of what I call the one-way mirror syndrome. Undefensible, racist crap like that most recently seen in “The Lobbyist” is put out for domestic consumption without any compunctions because, as we all know, what is said and done in Korea in Korean is only for Koreans. And yet, when something regarding Korea surfaces in the real world (i.e. in another langugae) there is an entirely different standard. It’s as if until now there was this general sense that they could see out but no one could see in. This is one reason why internationalization still really means Koerans learning English and other languages and not foreigners becoming really fluent in Korean and Korea. Many Koreans are not at all comfortable with non-Koreans knowing too well how they actually think, feel and speak.
CMM stole my thunder a bit, but man, did Kim Seong-kon ever consider that his countrymen are far more prone to freaking out at what they deem American or Japanese insults to Korea?
Thanks for posting this Robert. I thought it would get some response on this site.
I know it is an opinion piece.. but it is typical blind nationalistic bias we often see from some Korean people and I wonder why it makes into the Korean Herald. And the Samsung mention (of paid product placement makes it even more laughable). Whenever I use product from Korea..do I have to know it is from Korea? Personally I usually do.. but what about the raw materials…or the nationality of factory workers who assembled that product?
The author should tell our Korean-American friend in NY (or was it Washington) to advertise a one pager in the Times or Post and mention all the companies that are Korean..so movies like Oceans 13 don’t invariably boost the image of ‘Japan’ when they are doing their product placements.
I suggest the author create a website (similar to the one on “Knocked Up”) with the exact time and seconds in every movie ever where there is a mention of Korea and Korean culture instead of nudity.
There are a lot of movies where Americans, Japanese, British etc aren’t seen in favourable light, not to mention minority groups and our Middle Eastern friends.
I think most foreign directors would see Korea as the last place to make a film and I can’t even think any foreign films (mainstream) ever made in Korea…maybe one Jackie Chan film.
I thought the Taxi movies were really funny..and just silly satire at that.
Korea has a lot be proud of and I actually miss living there.. but please ease up on blind nationalism.
Wow…blinkered Philistine nationalism, one hardly ever sees that in countries like USA, Canada, the UK, ect….
That being said, it might be a good idea for Koreans to get used to the idea that not being insulated against the rest of the world isn’t all puppies and sunshine. Don’t feel bad Korea, the French have said much worse about America than that.
The scenes in “the Host” (the English name makes no sense and the Korean name is laughably simplistic) and “Welcome to DongMogo” both portray Americans as brash, hostile, and sadistic…imagine if Koreans had gotten the press they deserved for that…I guess Kim Seong-Kon would have something else to whimper dejectedly about. Snivelry.
Koreans really have to change their self-image as a nation if they don’t want to create the wrong impression…lest they get the “nation of self-pitying crybabies” title they’ve been working so hard for. You wanna be proud, then BE proud dammit.
you mean the anti american sentiment you saw in movies such as the ‘host’ and ‘dongmakol’ has no validity whatsoever? are you saying this french guy depicting korea as third world is the same thing? sorry, it ain’t the same. frechy basically telling an outright lie about korea. no such thing occurred in either korean movie. still further, each k movie had positive american characters. does the french movie have a positive korean character?
moreover, how is it so many of you condemn korea for it’s allegedly anti american film industry, but actually defend a guy who does what you condemn koreans for? if it’s wrong for koreans to do it, why isn’t wrong for others do it to koreans?
why aren’t you consistant?
moving on, those who wonder why koreans aren’t getting worked up by this french film, i can sum it up with a brief question: where’s france?
as a korean, i couldn’t care less what some french guy or the french people think about korea and koreans. I have no respect for a people who don’t bathe (that’s according to the french government). I’m sure some frenchy might look down on me. he may, however, be surprised to find that i simply dismiss him and his country outright, and could’t care less about his views of things korean.
france is a nation of yersterday.
Classic.
Indeed! I like the way he worked in “frenchy”.
okay, i saw falling down years and years ago, and don’t particularly remember the scene in question, but if it is merely as the author describes, where the ‘protagonist’(who happens to be a man who has clearly lost his shit) smashes the window of a korean grocery store, then htf does this portray koreans in a negative light? that seems akin to saying that silence of the lambs portrayed women in a negative light because some batshit insane dress enthusiast killed a bunch of them. and perhaps i’m remembering incorrectly, but didn’t the opening scene of die another day take place in north korea? or are southies taking negative depictions of our fearless leader’s republic personally now as well? maybe i’m mis-under-remembering some subtleties and nuances here, but i don’t recall anything particularly unflattering in either of these. as for besson possibly being a little out of line? maybe, but edit anyone’s shit solely for the purpose of creating space and making more money and see if they don’t lose it a bit. i wonder how miss kim would feel if her article got picked up by the nyt and showed up as:
Luc Besson’s “Taxi” is so popular that many people around the world have seen it. Luc Besson visited this country a few years ago in order to promote his movie, “The Fifth Element.” Besson attended a screening to greet the audience in person and watch his movie, which was a smashing hit. Unfortunately, he became enraged when he found his film censors. He hurriedly left Korea. Perhaps the censorship of Luc Besson’s SF movie was not right. Henceforth, we should be more careful not to offend foreigners. Or, we ourselves can make fine movies and have them be distributed by major Hollywood movie companies to international audiences. Either way, we can use such methods to enhance the image of Korea in the world arena.
as a korean, i couldn’t care less what some french guy or the french people think about korea and koreans.
Maybe you should tell that to Kim Seong Kon. She could learn a lesson or two.
The KH piece was clumsy, but I thought Kim was calling the anti-American brigade a bunch of hypocrites.
I’m, still confused (and amused) by the objections to the Bond movie wherein it was claimed that Korea was portrayed as a third world country (see above). The greatest umbrage seemd to come from the scence toward the end of the movie where the sports car falls from the airplane and sticks nose first in a rice paddy observed by a Korean farmer plowing with his oxen. The problem is this was meant to be north Korea which is a third world country where a great many still use oxen to plow. This reaction (again, see above) seems to stem from the same inability to be objective with oneself and one’s own (one-way mirror)that explains the “nation-wide outrage” at a joke about Koreans eating dogs even though a great many do. To anyone concerned with objectivity, the truth, you know, stuff like that, this could only be offensive if there weren’t dog restaurants in most nieghborhoods. This is why its called “blind nationalism” and makes those espousing it look so foolish.
# 16
“each k movie had positive american characters.” Yeah well, Korea ruined that when they kicked out the guy(positive american character) for acting illegally in the Host! Don’t you remember? When are they going to make a movie about illegal American actors in Korea?
You went off their a little bit on France didn’t you?
If Americans do it, it’s Korea-bashing. If the French do it, it’s Art.
The thing about the Korean taxi drivers sleeping in the trunk, well, Koreans *do* work more than double the hours of the French, though so many of those hours are just mandatory for social/cultural reasons that productivity is actually really low, less than half that in France and some other Euro countries. This isn’t a stage of development thing; it’s basically true in Japan as well.
But anyway Pawi, do you even know how ridiculous your anti-French stuff sounds? As a dual US/French citizen, I guess I’ll take your bait. First, why are Frenchies going to look down on you (unless you make those ludicrous assertions)? And you know, this might sound obnoxious, but along with having its share of problems France has one of the very highest standards of living in the world, in many ways higher than that in the States, a per capita GDP of about $35,000 vs US’s $44,000
(but much more evenly distributed), a great culture, the highest worker productivity per hour in the world (though not only for good reasons), excellent health care, second longest life expectancy in the world, it’s a leader in many industries, and as the architect of the EU has, along with its neighbors, created the world’s new superpower, one based on laws and not long-range bombers. If Sarkozy’s reforms succeed then France should not fall behind more than it has (which is less than its critics claim). And I’m not knocking the States or Korea or any other country in saying these things, Pawi. But maybe you can temper the hate a little.
Anyway, did Besson’s flick actually have any scenes in some ersatz Korea? I didn’t understand that part.
Nobody outside of France likely gives a shit about these movies. (I’ve seen the first two in the series and they are crap.) I suspect few viewers - in France or elsewhere - come away with a lasting/meaningful negative viewpoint of Korea and Koreans. (Hardly the focus of these mediocre movies.) But, for guys like Kim Seong-kon, supposedly negative exposure/publicity is better than none at all…
Were I a film director, I wouldn’t even consider shooting a movie here. Until Korea grows up, it wouldn’t be worth the trouble. Anything negative about Korea would be amplified ten-fold, and any positive elements would be largely ignored.
“where’s france?”
Was that an attempt at a joke? You can fault the French for this or for that, but on the world scene they make Korea is an ass pimple next to France. K-pop and kimchi exports will never change this simple reality. Not saying it is fair, but you’re the dummy who raised the issue.
BTW, as for the French being racists, I don’t know, but my understanding — which is admittedly limited — is that the French are the biggest Japanophiles in Europe.
What’s the point of the KH author being so whiny? Doesn’t Korea have its own movie industry? Just do the same thing right back at them. Portray the French as unemployed, poor, criminals living in ghettos pulling a donkey cart.
Hold on there, day4night — What’s really missing from France’s version of the “world’s new superpower” is not long-range bombers (although they ought to have more of those too, instead of depending on America) but consent of the governed. The EU is a supposedly high-minded endeavor, but the fact it’s being crammed down the throats of its citizens despite their clearly-stated desire to have no more of it, is really worrisome to me as a lawyer. Even though it’s based on laws, laws, laws, more laws, Directives and endless regulations — a paradise for lawyers! — that’s not so admirable.
EU Constitution rejected by the voters? Well, let’s just not put it to the bastards this time! They don’t know what’s good for themselves anyway.
I never did understand the flap about the end of the Bond movie. So the cars fell in a rice paddy with some farmer strolling by. Does S.Korea not have farmers/rice paddies? Me thinks the bucket-heads be too muchy sensitive. Can’t be in the Big Leagues when you cry over the small stuff. Rather than cry about how their image is portrayed in 10 seconds of a Bond film, they should consider how whining about it really affects their global image. Reason #3,549 why Korea isn’t yet ready to sit at the grown-ups table.
Kim Seong-kon: “Or, we ourselves can make fine movies and have them be distributed by major Hollywood movie companies to international audiences.”
That’s a great idea, maybe Korea can focus on the home front first though. According to the Korean Film Council, only 13 out of 112 Korean films released last year made profits.
Here’s an explanation: Korean movie studios “need to be more creative and stop making cheap comedies and gangster movies with similar themes and inane plots.” (Ko Jeong-min, senior researcher of Samsung Economic Research Institute).
Good idea. If only Korea could analyze its own movie industry as much as it analyzes that of France and other countries.
By the way, I wonder if it ever struck Kim Seong-kon that Luc Besson’s frustration at his censors probably had no relation to his brief, light-hearted comical portrayal of Koreans. (At least light-hearted in comparison to some portrayals of foreigners in Korean movies/media).
The day Koreans stop whingeing about imagined slights in movies is the day they join the community of nations. That day will not be seen in any of our lifetimes.
Kim Jeong Il, are you implying you are about to unleash your nuclear powers?
Did anyone tell Pawi that France is the birthplace of a key pillar of Korean national identity arguably second only to Confuscious: Nicolas Chauvin?
Pawi,
Congrats, you have just answered the eternal question; “what do you get when you cross a pig-headed Korean supremacist with the worst aspects of knee-jerk American Francophobia?”
And why should you care what the world supposedly thinks of Koreans, after all, you are an American, non?
OK Brendon, I’ll accept your cold shower. The Lisbon Treaty? Yeah, a little weird. For those who don’t know it’s a treaty that basically gives Europe a constitution that doesn’t have to pass public referendums (except in Ireland) but rather will be ratified by each state’s legislature. Referendum would obviously be more legit. It does seem fair to point out that the US Constitution was also ratified by state conventions and was never put to public referendum. And in fact it only had to be ratified by 9 of 13 states, though all 13 agreed in the end.
As for the EU laws laws laws, yeah, from my unlawerly vantage point it also seems a little nuts, as if hundreds of bureaucrats had to debate for months about regulations concerning dental floss. But overall those laws may have a civilizing effect, and indeed many are becoming global standards.
I generally agree with you on European defense as well.
But the upsides to the Union seem so large that I’m in favor. I think we need more supra-national and multinational organization, not less.. The anti-internationalist stance of many US conservatives seems dangerous to me.
But anyway, only 13 K-films made money last year? That’s sad. But the best Korean films are, to me, very strong.
“‘Taxi’ has devastated the image of Korea”???
If Kim Seong Kon is so concerned about the image of Korea, he should STOP WRITING BULLSHIT ARTICLES and call it journalism. And dont use words like ‘devastated’ bc I, as an ethnic Korean, sure dont lose sleep at night over a lame movie depicting Koreans in a negative light.
tag team with pawi,
you guys are mostly white, that’s why.
You see, even in the states, African Americans and Latino Americans take the greatest offense at what seems like something meant for comedy from the white man’s viewpoint. One of my least favorite, but arguably funny radio host, Don Imus, formerly of 660am of the original tri state area can tell you that, I’m sure.
You see, white people were as chauvinistic just like anyone else, approximately prior to World War II. You guys simply decided to tone it down with mass propaganda in the school systems. Well, you did in the free world. Take a good look around Russia and its former cronies, and you’ll see they’re as chauvinistic as ever.
Which brings to the point that France has decidedly lost the language and influence war against the English. French language is limited to France, Quebec, Belgium, and west Africa. Thus, my highschool French education was limited to listening to chansons, watching French movies, and tv5 news. Of the people I know of who made good use of French, those people take business trips to France, dealing with French businesses. That’s about it, really.
Take a good look around and you’ll see that China is just as nationalistic. And to tell the truth, I think you’ll agree that those Middle Eastern nations are nationalistic to a degree that they don’t give a damn about who they hurt in the protest process. You must admit that you’ll take a protesting Korean over some of those guys in Muslim world, cutting themselves, bombing innocents, over a Mo cartoon.
Which also brings to the point that, admittedly, Mo’s people have more power in the world. Europe, or the Danes, bowed down fairly quickly to its knees to apologize over something like that.
that’s because there’s a secret in Europe that white peeps don’t like to mention. There’s a growing racially segregated Muslim ghetto in Europe, where living standards aren’t so high, and they are projected to be the majority population in say, our lifetime, if I make it to 90, 95 years old. Come on, now. You saw the French riots last year or so. President of France can tell you, too.
Korea won’t be in the future Earth’s best nations group, in the next 100 years?
Yeah, right. There has been pretty much amazing progress over 60 years of the existence of the ROK.
I’d like to end this with 2 rules for you to remember.
1/ White people can’t dish it, because they’ve tortured and murdered themselves and the world for, say 500 years.— Gotta be careful. Or you’ll be an Imus someday.
Don’t blame me. This rule is kept consistently by liberal people like the Democrats. Ever notice the Clinton Obama show?
2/ Communism is evil. On the way home, I listened to CNN radio, stating that France, Germany, and British are sex worker importers of grand scale, from former communist nations, but present EU nations, such as Czech Republic, Romania, Poland, etc. You guys are hypocrites. True, communism forced the world in these parts to resort to 14 year old girls selling themselves to human rights preaching liberals in West Europe, but what about the West Europe guy buying and sustaining this white slavery economy?
new york tom; look who’s come out of the gyopo closet.
Tommy, you’re not a real Korean, in any sense.
but, I’m sure people in South Korea already told you that a couple of times, maybe with some bad memories.
You don’t think like them, fundamentally.
So what, if a gyopo like me minds about Korea? I see first generation immigrants from Ireland talking about Ireland all the time. So, what? Stop your lies about when my non-racist, grandpa landed in America, all he cared about was America, and he betrayed his home country in World War I.
but tom, if you do something newsworthy, they’ll call you Korean right away, even if you were half, a quarter Korean, etc.
Some US Koreans come to mind.
I’m sure to your mind, too.
when I came over to the ROK in the 3rd grade, for the next 3 years, I had every fucking teacher telling me that
1/ this is not America.
2/ this is how a Korean does things, and you’re not doing it this way.
in a way, a re-circuiting.
Maybe New York Tom didn’t have to even attend ROK public schools.
what probably really hurts France is that in Vietnam, they’re probably eager to learn English vs French.
what probably really hurts France is that in Vietnam, they’re probably eager to learn English vs French.
Actually the French probably don’t even care, and are no better at placing Vietnam on the map than Americans are. It seems you are projecting your own hyper-sensitivity on other cultures. You should be more concerned about your English.
I don’t think comparing
“But that guy is not Korean. How can you be so sure?” says the detective, pointing at the athlete. “Look at his slant eyes,” answers the police commissioner.
to movies like the Host and Dongmakgol is quite… accurate. Definite differences between anti-[insert a nation] ideology and flat out racism.
I haven’t seen it but I’m guessing that the film was mocking the character who says “Look at his slanted eyes.” that’s to say mocking the commissioner’s racism. Meanwhile those Taxi films mock other people, including the French, just as much as the Koreans, from what I understand.
By the way I saw a Goldman Sachs report projected that by 2050 S. Korea will be the 2nd wealthiest nation on earth. Those kinds of predictions are pretty ridiculous, but it was interesting.
WJK
FYI, I actually did go to school in Korea, albeit only elementary school. I know, I know…it does NOT make me a Korean in Koreans eyes in any way..even when I speak and write Korean almost flawlessly. Of course, I work and live in NY so I am definitely gyopo.
But I know EXACTLY what yer saying. When I say/do something that’s not “Korean”, Koreans are quick to point it out and shake their heads saying, “He’s too Americanized. He couldn’t and doesn’t understand Koreanness.”
On the other hand, if I do something right, the same people also are quick to point out, “It’s the Korean in you that paved the way for your success.”
I’m sure you’re thinking of Hines Ward when you say what you said. And I can attest to that. I had many half-Korean friends who were DOD schooled who were constantly ridiculed for being a mixed race. Had Hines Ward not played pro football and lived in Korea, he would most likely be called a kkamdoongi right to his face. And that is such a shame.
I DO NOT look forward to about a decade or two from now where a very sizable portion of the population in Korea will be half/quarter-Koreans and not make the cut in Korean eyes. You KNOW that there will be some sort of Korean style KKK… the KKKK.
I never realized just how “Hermitized” South Korea still is in mentality. The first thing Korea needs to do is stop falsely telling itself that their civilization rivals Ancient Egypt or Mesopatania in antiquity, (5,000)years?, seriously?. It causes bloated head syndrome. Korea according to Korea, has an ancient history which predates China, unfortunately 99% of the rest of the world and its scholars cannot find any proof of this besides a few tomb paintings that really are not any more impressive than any other ones that cultures in Asia have produced. Maybe Koreans are telling the truth that the Japanese stole or destroyed most of their relics and masterpieces, the world may never know…
We’re also responsible, in a real sense, for the modern world. So we can, do, and will continue to dish what we want, when we want, and to who we want, and there is nothing you can do about it.
“Actually the French probably don’t even care, and are no better at placing Vietnam on the map than Americans are.”
On the contrary, when it comes to promoting their role on the world stage, I think the French can be as nationalistic and sensitive as anyone. This article suggests that paranoia about “losing” a Francophone country to the wicked English-speaking cultural imperialists led to French government support for the perpetrators of the Rwandan genocide.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/fran.....97,00.html
Why don\’t you write \”Hi, I\’m an idiot!\” instead? The Lobbyist isn\’t racist. Why anyone with sufficient education could be prone to such shallow analysis of such a stupid, simple thing as a K drama is beyond me.
Any time you feel like bashing “the west” or “white people” or whatever label you put onto the countries that spearheaded the industrial revolution, just take a look around you. What do you see? Some concrete buildings, with electrical power lines running to them? Some cars parked near them, with rubber tires and lights? Are you using a computer hooked up to a free worldwide network? Do you type with your fingers on a keyboard modeled after a typewriter? Have you read a printed book lately?
I usually try not to flaunt my culture’s contributions to the world, but if I ever went on a rant about my country’s greatness the way a Korean does, I’d need probably half a week to finish.
So, my point is, don’t hate us, we made you.
We own you.
Is it just me, or a people taking this to a ridiculous level? If the movie portays Korea, it is wrong. However, I wouldn’t issue a “call to arms” type article like the author, coming from a media industry that trys to bash its closest allies and portray them in a negative light in every opportunity. Bottom line: their shit stinks, so does yours, stop whinning.
and by “own” I mean in the online gaming sense, as in thoroughly beaten to the point of logging off and not playing anymore. Not in the slavery sense.
mateomiguel got scared and unconsciously followed wjk’s law
#1.
Ha ha. Was that a reflex?
Dogbertt is more blatant and quite unapologetic for it.
you do realize that there are basically a myriad of ways to say that the basic premises of everything noted above was found in its primitive forms in the Middle East, Far East, etc, right?
Talk to a middle eastern guy lately? They claim they had street lights fueled by petrol, when white men were “painting each other blue”, and had practiced surgery and used medicine before the white man.
Anyways, I’m more amused you tried to apologize for your actions asap, more or less.
Dogbertt, you’re a racist.
Now if you follow rule #1, you can’t really say it back to me. On the internet, you may.
In the real world, there’s the ACLU, NAACP, etc.
You’ll lose your shirt faster than me.
take it for what it’s worth, but what was the difference between white men and the rest of the world?
Coincidentally, Jesus seems to have been involved.
I know, I know. The same Jesus you white guys of present day claim that held you back at least a 1000 years in what you call the “dark ages”.
take it for what it’s worth.
because history records that white man did “enslave” the world.
truth be told, you guys began eating pasta after Marco Polo, and call the Far East version noodles.
and there is some who assert that, white man saw the light, when he walked away from Jesus, and towards reason, science, etc.
but, is that really the case?
as far as I know, God’s name was used to mobilize the masses of Europe in both World War I and II.
next thing wjk is going to do is fake a picture of him with Bush and claim he is destined to get married to a major political figure.
wjk, you’re a racist.
What’s the difference between Koreans and the rest of the world?
Wait….don’t answer that.
As #25 pointed out, the Korean work week is nearly twice as long as the French one. That scene may have been just as much a statement about the French as it was about the Koreans.
Besides, in my experience, French people usually seem to have a positive attitude towards Koreans (and the word Coree has a certain romantic connotation to it because it is a feminine noun).
I’ve met a stranger in France who pulled out a Korean textbook when I mentioned that I lived in Korea.
There are Korean authors and artists who are very well respected in France, too.
Ethiopia was Christian long, long before, say, England, Finland, Germany, France, or most of Europe, and look how well things turned out for them. And goodness knows how much the Mongolian and Khitan Christians did for the advancement of humanity way back in the Dark Ages…
this thread has become pure, unintentional comedy.
LMAO
Wow, another desperate journalist is trying to milk their job as much as possible (just reading a little way into the article and I swear the person is laughing while baiting all the knee-jerk kiddies), and out come pouring all of Marmot’s arm-chair historians and social science experts.
Anyway, for those insecure Koreans, fear not, Taxi wasn’t even well liked in France (I’d go so far as to say the serious cinema connoisseur thinks quite badly of Luc Besson, despite his cult status) and they seem to have quite a positive image of Korean art and movies. I actually was surprised how many seemed to have been more familiar with k-movies, and so sgik’s response does not shock me at all now.
So no need to go bashing the French pawi, though this is one of the few times I suspect that American influence may be the true cause (amazes me to this day what is said about them when one of the most recognizable icons of America was French-built).
Everybody shut up and go back to Africa for Science sake.
Gawd.
Homo Sapiens and fighting amongst each other
Priceless.
The first to find Kimchi in the garden of Eden wins.
And now for something a little bit different.
On France, Rwanda:
Above Criticism (#50) thanks for the link. Yes, the French government’s irresponsible behavior in Rwanda was disgusting, criminal, and should always be remembered. Absolutely horrific. Humanitarianism was yet again trumped by perceived self-interest. The people of France were sold on the deployment of French troops for humanitarian reasons, but narrower interests won out as old relationships between French officers and the Rwandan gov’t were viewed as more important than the lives of strangers. The French attitude was that people in that part of the world are different, they think of death differently, it’s just another ethnic conflict. People, even people who are close to me, hear the word “humanitarian” or “human rights” and shrug, thinking they’re just some pansy terms. And 800,000 are left to die. The Catholic Church was also complicit in the Rwandan genocide, the USA was criminally absent (in fact removed troops) along with the UK, Germany, Japan, anyone who could have helped. Criminal negligence. But the French deserve special criticism here, I agree. Also Kofi Annan. They say that with 5,000 troops we could have saved 400,000 lives. It’s possible that everything could have been stopped with diplomatic pressure alone. Ultimately nobody gives a shit about some black people in Africa unless they already know them. The French gov’t had friends, so they were biased toward their friends’ side in Rwanda and only learned too late that their “friends” were murderers. It’s nauseating. The good thing is that Bernard Kouchner, founder of Doctors Without Borders, is the new Foreign Affairs minister under Sarkozy. He’s a humanitarian, and just went to Rwanda to repair ties. A book to read is “Shaking Hands with the Devil” by Gen Romeo Dellair, head of the UN observation force there.
But yes, French nationalism blinded officials from the right course of action. I think this happens all the time. It’s why when I see such virulent nationalism, like in Korea, that a creepy feeling comes over me.
Beginnings of a theory about Korean (and other) nationalism:
To borrow a religious vocabulary, we’re all sinners, we’re all capable of evil, we all contain darkness. Therefore we need penitence, to ask for the creator’s forgiveness and to proclaim our first love for the creation as a whole, for universal goodness. This provides a counter-balance to our selfish, immediate biological and survivalistic view in which we give automatic preference to ourselves and our families, and then prefer our friends, then our high schools, then our regions, then our countries. Korean (and other) nationalism precludes penitence when it refuses to admit its own sin. What’s there to forgive? In this sense original sin is a great gift, because it’s in humbly begging for forgiveness that one relinquishes the specific in exchange for the universal. Koreans have a tough case because they’ve been too small and poor to have been aggressors against anyone but other Koreans. Their only international sin is that they weren’t successful enough in the past. So Korean nationalists become drunk on their specific successes and victimizations. Without recognizing any sins for which to beg forgiveness, the act through which one transcends the specific and ascends to universal love is lost. Without penitence (whether religious or secular), nationalism, specificism, me-ism, grows in a feedback loop to the displeasure of all, not least its “Host.” It can’t be comfortable to be a hypocrite in denial — we all feel this discomfort to some degree — and nationalism can be thought of as a form of hypocrisy.
So the doctrine of original sin may be the way out, the escape. We’re all part evil by default. Because if you didn’t commit evil, it might just be that the conditions weren’t right, not that you’re incapable of sinning. This where I find wisdom in the doctrine of not judging others, because they also were simply the recipients of themselves and their environments, not the designers. In this sense, even if free will exists, we are like cooks given ingredients entirely at random.
Also (dogbert, wjk), you or I are not any more or less responsible for any civilization’s past triumphs or tragedies than anyone else is. I’m white but I didn’t invent the automobile and I can’t take credit for it. We’re all born by luck, or fate, as you wish to call it. Smart, slow, tall, short, Korean, Japanese, Italian or born to Taliban parents, it’s all a roll of the dice or else one word in a master plan, but you didn’t choose it. You can hope to exercise free will, but you cannot know what would have been. Therefore I must assume that under different circumstances, maybe I too would be a criminal, a Hutu killer of Tutsis, a Nazi.
So the doctrine of original sin, non-judgment of others, and above all asking for forgiveness. Maybe these can fit into Korean Christianity and free Korean nationalists from their cages by allowing then to experience a universal love as strong as their specific, selfish love. I guess it’s true for all of us.
Umm, whoa, excuse me for taking up so much space there…
day4night, I can recognize that you are one of them who are called “saved.”
Good words.
Zonath, good point, but I still believe what I believe.
Korean peninsula was powerful and captured territory in Japan and China, prior to Shilla of Kyong Sang Do adopting the policy of serving China proper as its superior.
There is pretty much no record of Korean atrocities against either the Chinese or the Japanese or the North Far Eastern tribes to mention.
However, it must be mentioned that any history of Goguryo and Baekjae is extremely flimsy, because
1/ China would rather not recognize it.
2/ Japan would rather not recognize it.
3/ Kyong Sang Do, and Korea itself would rather minimize both Goguryo and Baekjae to legitimize 1400 years of Korea being what it has been. A hermit kingdom licking China’s butt hole. Serving up women, rice, and money to China. Yeah, it must have been the best way to preserve the Korean peninsula, for we know that Park who was born from a bak, and Kim who was born out of golden turtle eggs must have been born that way, and only such people would guide human beings to do jang-ryuh nong-sa and such. What I truly wonder is how the third Shilla royal blood family, the Suks, somehow got screwed over in popularity, power, and reign.
but my mainpoint is, no one accuses Goguryo or Baekjae as oppressors, from what flimsy history there is available about Korea’s true might that allowed it to “influence” other nations. If anything, Japan is positive about Baekjae.
a popular Shilla defense is that Goguryo as a nation didn’t have a clue of
1/ culture, agriculture, or anything involving writing.
2/ Goguryo people were just fighting nomads.
Such utter bull shit.
but we must accept that current day Koreans are dominated with original Shilla families and innumerable slave families who are fake Parks, Kims, and Lees.
For this, I must blame Japan.
And Long Duck Dong was just comic relief in a teen movie.
WJK: That line about about how “you guys” (and i’m figuring you’re talking about westerners) “began eating pasta after Marco Polo”truth be told, you guys began eating pasta after Marco Polo”? Bullshit. The Romans were eating pasta several centuries BC. Look it up.
Oops, sorry about that, i made a mess of things.
Thanks wjk. But actually, no, I’m not saved, I personally am secular or at least non-denominational (lapsed Episcopalian). But I’m supportive of much of the Christian tradition. I used Christian terms because they seem to fit the Korean context, but I think we could use secular humanistic terms as well. Peace!
PUHAHAHA! I need to make some time and read this crap more often…
THEY STARTED IT!!!
What goes around comes around!!!
We made it!!!
Nuh-uh! WE made it first!!!!
All this over a French film! lol. No offense to ya Frechies.. I can’t help it. I’m from a country that wanted to change the name of french fries to FREEDOM FRIES… LOL.
But seriously, I got love for the French. I love it when French chics start talking that boo-lay-boo-coo stuff to me.LOL
I hope some of you guys are over the age of erm… let’s say 18, because if you weren’t it wouldn’t be that funny.