EFL Geek takes another look at the new visa rules for English teachers. BTW, does anyone else suspect we’ll see a good deal of “policy creep” with this — that it’s only a matter time before all foreigners residing in Korea must submit a criminal report? And is that such a bad thing?
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63 Comments
This might very well make it worth my while to stay with the English teaching gig.
Since I am one of the MIGHTY F-VISA GODS (smoke, strobes), those rules don’t apply to me. With the inevitable drying up of available teachers as the poor E-visa folks decide that teaching in Korea is not worth the hassle, those of us still around are going to find ourselves in a real seller’s market.
First Japan and now America is to require all foreigners to have their fingerprints scanned electronically, which is not a great idea due to cost and bureaucracy. It ultimately is a burden upon the taxpayer which does not guarantee security though it might allow governments to keep parking meter scofflaws out of their country. As technology improves, it will more likely than not make it easier for governments to implement bad policy decisions, leading to yet more red-tape, bigger government, more impetus towards testing everyone regardless — your tax dollars, free at last.
My last walk through American immigration (I am American) leads me to think this will get worse for everyone and not better and for no good reason.
how about for other kinds of visas? E-7? Man, I’m rethinking my invitation to all my friends now.
What a serious pain in the ass. Does anyone know for sure if these are the new regulations?
thanks…
“First Japan and now America is to require all foreigners to have their fingerprints scanned electronically, which is not a great idea due to cost and bureaucracy.”
Which brings me to this:
Forcing the E2 applicants to fly home and get the background check done there when it can be easily done here is a pathetic attempt at saving a few thousand dollars in cost by the Korean government.
“Since I am one of the MIGHTY F-VISA GODS (smoke, strobes), those rules don’t apply to me.”
If I ever open another hagwon, maybe I should call it ‘Olympian English Academy’. I could have the sign and interior design done to look like that of a kitschy Greek restaurant…or of a frat house (all depends if my target demographics would be housewives or university students).
No doubt that the new regulations are being implemented extremely poorly. That being said, I don’t think it’s unreasonable that immigration authorities insist that those seeking entry into Korea submit a criminal background check before allowing them into the country. Now, of course, if immigration were really serious about keeping out the foreign criminal element, they’d have either the KNP or NIS running background checks on every Tom, Wang and Ahmed applying for entry into Korea. Then again, perhaps this is asking too much, seeing how even the FBI and CIA can’t keep illegal immigrants/terrorist moles off their payroll, let alone out of the country:
http://abcnews.go.com/WN/FedCr.....038;page=1
#5, Apparently it isn’t very easy to get a background check done here. Both the US and Canadian Embassies have already said they will not provide the service.
In my opinion, these new regulations simply penalize people who have actually gone through a lengthy process and make teaching on a tourist visa that much more appealing.
The new policies address no real issue, and don’t encourage an industry already having problems attracting ‘high quality’ candidates.
What pisses me off, is that there doesn’t seem to be any attempt by the Korean government to create an f-2 visa database. Because of this, schools are going to have a tough time retaining faculty, as the cost and hassle to re-sign a contract will outweigh the benefits.
It really is quite baffling.
“What pisses me off, is that there doesn’t seem to be any attempt by the Korean government to create an f-2 visa database.”
There is no need to screen F-2 visa holders since we have already been through the most rigorous screening system on the face of the Earth; our mothers-in-law.
According to this, if you have a felony on your record in California, then you could simply go to Arizona where you will be issued to clean background check. I also like how they require overseas annual renewal, just like the old days.
If they go through with this shite, two things will happen: 1) legit teachers who have jumped through the requisite hoops (or are on an F-2-1 or F-5) will be able to increase their income substantially; and 2) tourist visa teaching will go up a lot.
“Apparently it isn’t very easy to get a background check done here. Both the US and Canadian Embassies have already said they will not provide the service.”
Actually, it’s not that hard. All you need is to go to the police station and have the Korean police fingerprint you, fill out a few forms, and mail it in. The info on how it can be easily found only online.
“According to this, if you have a felony on your record in California, then you could simply go to Arizona where you will be issued to clean background check. I also like how they require overseas annual renewal, just like the old days.”
They’ll require an FBI check for Americans, that’s all.
“If they go through with this shite, two things will happen: 1) legit teachers who have jumped through the requisite hoops (or are on an F-2-1 or F-5) will be able to increase their income substantially; and 2) tourist visa teaching will go up a lot.”
Probably.
#8, Dammit, i meant to type E-2 database.
Andy,
The seller’s market is already here, F visa or not. Just move to the provinces and shake your booty in the direction of a needy haggie boss. Others will come crawling soon. Anecdotally, I happened to mention across a pub table full of academy directors here (Cheongju) one night that I had a friend who was considering coming to teach. My phone rang hot for a month after, even though I told them it was becoming increasingly unlikely.
This certainly makes me wonder about the motives behind the application of these new requirements:
“…the new requirements will force English teachers to return to their home country to get the criminal record check…”
“…any teacher hired by the Education Ministry who is already employed can skip the criminal record check…”
aaronm:
Haven’t I seen you in Bangkok?
I am a long-term EFL teacher and - until reading this article - had been seriously considering applying for jobs in South Korea next year. Why would any prospective hagwon drone go to all that trouble and expense? Surely there is going to be a huge drop in the number of applicants.
Ho ho. Not me.
I think he hangs out in Pattaya.
What about people changing status from E2 to F2?
Will the rules change for this after December 15th?
Andy Jackson,
I’m going with the wife to apply for an F2-1 visa next week. How long did it take you to get yours. They told me over the phone that it could be 4 months..and they hold my visa the whole time. Curious. Thanks!
#19. The wife called immigration an hour ago. As long as you apply for F2 from E2 before your current visa expires then you will be ok.
I envy you bastards. Don’t be shy now, go out there and get your Xmas presents: 30% raises for all in 2008. Minimum. Demand it. You took 20 an hour when you had to. Payback time.
aaronm, that is one seriously disturbing photo.
Foflappy:
It took me a week, but then I wasn’t an English teacher.:))
Sperwer….what is your line of work? E5 business?
Sperwer..and when did you do it? The visa I mean.
I agree with Andy…the mother-in-law is surely the toughest check on the earth:)
Seriously though, The hoggies are worried I think but the uni-gwons don’t seem to be too worried yet that I have seen…of course they still try to pass off their unigwon jobs as “visiting professor” jobs which is Horsehockey….so there are always those who will take the jobs because they don’t know any better. The university ‘department’ jobs, which are usually much better in terms of conditions are few and far enough between to continue to keep them low paying…i have an F2 (soon to be F5) but I don’t expect it to give me any benefit unless i switch over to 30hour a week hoggie work or 20 hour a week unigwon work and start teaching kids on the vacations. I like my 12 hour a weeks, 4.5 months of vacation and private office. For all practical purposes, everyone elses kids but mine are devils…i have no desire to teach kids.
I don’t know which is more disturbing — the avatar or the fact that I actually know which website the photo’s from.
#26
I disagree. I think that universities will have problems and end up shifting over to hiring more Fvisa people and having the wages go up. Losing E2 teachers to these rules will probably help wages but will result in many quality teachers being lost due to unnecessary red tape. A real shame as several of the best teachers I know and work with are on the E2. An F visa does not make one a better teacher.
This I agree with 100% - though I get 5 months rather than 4.5. Teaching kids bites big time.
I like my uni job, too. Fortunately, my university does not have the restriction as to years of work like many uni’s have changed to.
I’ll be buggered if I can identify the man in that avatar.
He’s a certain gent that likes to ‘inhabit’ south east asian ladies on the internet. Like Marmot, I knew where it came from. “Hey! I know that guy!” er…
Um, that was a pun.
right
foflappy,
I think it took a week or two, can’t remember exactly.
Andy,
Thanks.
foflappy:
I used to have an investor’s visa - D8, I think. F2 actually is more convenient and less restrictive. Changed over about three years ago.
Sperwer
Thanks.
“aaronm, that is one seriously disturbing photo.
I don’t know which is more disturbing — the avatar or the fact that I actually know which website the photo’s from.”
Let me answer a question earlier in the thread as to where the character in the avatar is based: While, the gentleman in question - and I use the term “gentleman” rather loosely - may have created some of his finer masterpieces in Pattaya, he actually resides in Bangkok. Lives in an apartment upstairs from my friend’s place. This may come as no surprise to those familiar with his work, but supposedly he isn’t too big on being approached by fans in public. (Oddly enough, there are people out there who apparently want to get their picture with the guy, his autograph, or worse…)
As for the E-2 regulations, it remains to be seen if they last. I don’t think a relaxation of the policy would come about to make things more convenient for teachers; however, if institutes or colleges/universities complain enough about how they can’t operate properly, start the semester with the number of staff they require, etc. maybe there will be some adjustments. Who knows? Anyway, in the meantime it probably bodes well for F visa holders and tourist visa types.
Teaching kids in a hagwon bites big time. I had an outstanding experience teaching Korean kids in a K-12 international school in China and enjoy my work at my present school.
Not only are the legit visa holders gonna be given a hell of a time, so will the haggies. That will instigate more under-the-table, black-bag tricks of getting newhires to come to Korea to teach. Heh, and you think the government is doing its best to solve this problem, only to create another.
#39
Teaching kids bites no matter where.
Kids = evil
It would make sense if, in applying these regulations, they would keep everything on file so that one wouldn’t have to get a new criminal record check, transcripts, health check, etc every time, but that may be asking too much of immigration.
This may be useful to those wanting to extend an E2 which expires soon after December 15. Last week that person apparently got a renewal 2.5 months early, and avoided the new regulations.
Won’t someone think of the children! Nah mine aren’t too bad, considering they just got me out of having to get a police check done. Not that I don’t raise an eyebrow…Why don’t you need a police check if you work in a public school?
Just as well I’m a Kiwi though - the NZ Ministry of Justice will send you a copy of your criminal record free of charge upon request where ever you are in the world. (And if they’re even half as good as the tax dept. / Student Loan dept. They should be able to find me with no worries!
Still One can’t think that all this smacks of double standards. What about all the dodgy Chinese people making LCD screens in Chonan? (Not that I’m implying that Chinese people are dodgy - rather the immigration status of some individuals is.)
I am eagerly awaiting my pay rise come this time next year when there are no teachers to be found and I’m one of a handful that are willing to slug through the elementary school system here in Seoul. God bless the 40 minutes English per child per week theory I say!
@ 42.
Indeed I got renewal for another year in October about the same 2.5 months before my contract was about to end in December.
clusterfuck indeed. i’ll eat crow if the if the regulations don’t fall apart or get sidestepped within the new year.
It’s amazing how no one who’s married to a Korean, or has Korean blood, or works outside of the EFL industry would NEVER smoke a joint or have some sort of STD.
Yet at the same time, every E2 holder is a AIDS-filled, drug-selling grenade just waiting to go off and demean the fine reputation of the Wonder Girls.
These series of coincidences are so amazing as to make one think someone somewhere in the MOJ is pulling all of this out of their asses.
Get a haircut, William.
I’d like to, but my E2 visa has made me into a meth-selling, pot-smoking, AIDS-infected, long-haired hippy.
Oh, if only I was married to a Korean, then all of these problems would magically disappear with the power of the F2! I could finally get that smart-looking “short back and sides” haircut all the ajoshis are sporting these days!
No, all those traits would (have to) disappear prior to your marrying the Korean, a prerequisite to obtaining the F2.
Fencerider, you must be rollin in the dough.
Doesn’t an F-5 visa require an F-2 to invest more than US$500,000 in Korean firms? That’s what I read at the Seoul Help Center.
“Fencerider, you must be rollin in the dough.
Doesn’t an F-5 visa require an F-2 to invest more than US$500,000 in Korean firms? That’s what I read at the Seoul Help Center.”
No longer the case, assuming it once was. I think it might be possible for high rollin’ investors to get permanent residency without marriage, but only with a fat investment or some other superhuman accomplishment that benefits the country.
One now needs to have an F-2 for two years and show some proof of being able to live in Korea. (A little vague, I know.) I spoke to the folks at the Incheon Immigration Dept. in Korean - which considering my language skills, might have been good or bad - but there was no test. My wife has a small business, but we don’t own our place. I’d been teaching in Korean universities for about nine years straight, which supposedly was a plus. They did contact my mother-in-law and sister-in-law, which probably helped. We have a son, and I think they liked that. The whole process took around four months. I have no idea if there was a criminal record check (or if my in-laws testimonials were sufficient!)
William, you neglected to add private teaching to your list of social defects attributable to persons on E-2’s.
I’ve worked with quite a few Korean teachers/citizens who have taught private classes illegally.
These lessons were illegal because tehy didn’t pay income TAX on their earnings.
I guess since they are Koreans though, that’s not illegal…my mistake.
I guess only expats break Korean laws.
Well, you could learn Korean and get an E-7. Worked for me!
foflappy,
Thanks for the information.
What’s an E-7?
Isn’t that guy painted onto the overpass mural in front of Yonsei University?
E-7 is like a catch-all visa for foreign professionals who aren’t E-2’s and haven’t married into the gene pool. It still requires a sponsoring company, annual renewal, and there is essentially no way that a small (or often mid-sized) company can get one for a foreigner, as Immigration’s baseline response to E-7 applications is “No.” It’s mainly for chaebol use, and existing foreign-owned firms that need to send an overseas staff member here.
Dokdoforever, from your lips (or in this case fingers) to God’s Ears!! Unfortunately, I could only be condidered rolling in the dough if my wife dumped a bag of flour on the bed! I have been in Korea for 11 years, married for 8 and on an F2 for 2+ years now…so I should be able to get the F5 this year.
EFLGeek, The 4.5 is the FULL vacation since it does take time to administer tests and post grades and deal with ne’er-do-well 2nd year students who think that getting a job entitles them to do nothing and receive a “D” for the semester. I usually finish the red tape by the 2nd week after final exams and submit my grades, then i’m free.
as for teaching kids, i have done it and I hate it…the money has to be REALLY good to convince me (I have been convinced for 50,000 per 45min class before). Personally, i don’t really consider myself qualified to teach children…I think other than having some kind of training in the TEYL field you have to actually like kids and I don’t (except my own). The “not qualified to teach children” argument has worked whenever I have been asked to teach before.
I didn’t have time. I had to run out and price-gouge some private students for the pleasure of sitting in Starbucks and drinking coffee with me.
At first I thought that charging them 70,000 won /hr was kind of slimy. But then I saw what the F2 holders were charging for the same thing and figured I was giving them a bargain.
All sarcasm aside, these rules have finally motivated me to leave after all of these years. I long ago stopped finding Korea sparkling enough to want to put in that sort of effort. Basically, I can’t keep hitting snooze on the alarm clock anymore. I have no hard feelings about it.
The election-time “getting tough on the dirty foreigners least able to give us shit over it” nature of it is what’s annoying me.
But maybe that’s my AIDS acting up. It vibrates when the weather gets cold…
just a note:
came from canadian embassy today; they are saying we will have a 3-month grace period for criminal record checks, and that provincial (local?) checks will be ok, as the RCMP checks are currently 6 months.
just wanted to add to the random tidbits already piling up.
proof of kimchi consumption can also waive the health check portion.
Aye, William, well I be knowin’ that when a young man’s heart tells him it’s time t’be goin’, then it’s best to be gettin’ with the goin’.
Ye may be back, tho, as many are. Her embrace is cold, t’be sure, but her teat, yay, her teat is always warm.
You can come and join me, William. I got out just before the fan really started to spray this around.
I’m curious to see, when they finally start getting these screenings, how many E-2 applicants REALLY DO have AIDS or something on their criminal record. Maybe I’m wrong, but I’m thinking the proportion will be minuscule.