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	<title>Comments on: Something I Heard Today</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/11/06/something-i-heard-today/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/11/06/something-i-heard-today/</link>
	<description>Korea... in Blog Format</description>
	<pubDate>Fri,  9 Jan 2009 05:54:20 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: luweiqd</title>
		<link>http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/11/06/something-i-heard-today/comment-page-1/#comment-116880</link>
		<dc:creator>luweiqd</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 08 Nov 2007 15:04:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/11/06/something-i-heard-today/#comment-116880</guid>
		<description>#35 "International banks may, of their own volition, act in accord with the sanctions"... but the US is really coming down with a hammer on any bank doing anything with Iran. So what this means is that, sure, banks can still do Iran business, but the cost of doing this is that they won't be able to make payments in US dollars for any of their customers (USD payments all clear through the US). A big ask.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>#35 &#8220;International banks may, of their own volition, act in accord with the sanctions&#8221;&#8230; but the US is really coming down with a hammer on any bank doing anything with Iran. So what this means is that, sure, banks can still do Iran business, but the cost of doing this is that they won&#8217;t be able to make payments in US dollars for any of their customers (USD payments all clear through the US). A big ask.</p>
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		<title>By: luweiqd</title>
		<link>http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/11/06/something-i-heard-today/comment-page-1/#comment-116879</link>
		<dc:creator>luweiqd</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 08 Nov 2007 15:02:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/11/06/something-i-heard-today/#comment-116879</guid>
		<description>For what it's worth, I think it makes more sense if we are talking about bid bonds here (e.g. a performance guarantee) and not the kind of bonds which pay you a fixed return until maturity. 

So the Iranian company ask their Iranian bank (Melli etc) to provide a guarantee to the Korean company that essentially means the bank pays if the Iranian company doesn't. There are (were) banks in Korea who would take Iranian bank risk (indeed Melli Bank have (had?) a branch in Seoul). 

So, as the sales rep rightly points out, if the company defaults, even if the Iranian bank wanted to make good on its guarantee, the effective lock-out of Iranian banks from the global financial system (just like for the Norks) makes it damn difficult for them to actually pay up. So the guarantees (bonds) are worth pretty much nothing.

And there's no interest involved so it's Islamic (although I think Islamic finance is more a Sunni thing than a Shia thing).

Makes more sense than there being some kind of liquid debt markets in Tehran...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>For what it&#8217;s worth, I think it makes more sense if we are talking about bid bonds here (e.g. a performance guarantee) and not the kind of bonds which pay you a fixed return until maturity. </p>
<p>So the Iranian company ask their Iranian bank (Melli etc) to provide a guarantee to the Korean company that essentially means the bank pays if the Iranian company doesn&#8217;t. There are (were) banks in Korea who would take Iranian bank risk (indeed Melli Bank have (had?) a branch in Seoul). </p>
<p>So, as the sales rep rightly points out, if the company defaults, even if the Iranian bank wanted to make good on its guarantee, the effective lock-out of Iranian banks from the global financial system (just like for the Norks) makes it damn difficult for them to actually pay up. So the guarantees (bonds) are worth pretty much nothing.</p>
<p>And there&#8217;s no interest involved so it&#8217;s Islamic (although I think Islamic finance is more a Sunni thing than a Shia thing).</p>
<p>Makes more sense than there being some kind of liquid debt markets in Tehran&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: cinemagauche</title>
		<link>http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/11/06/something-i-heard-today/comment-page-1/#comment-116726</link>
		<dc:creator>cinemagauche</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 08 Nov 2007 02:38:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/11/06/something-i-heard-today/#comment-116726</guid>
		<description>In any case, I believe the Koreans at said company have over-reacted.  Washington doesn't govern the world yet, and US sanctions on Iranian banks are limited in effect to business with US citizens and assets under US jurisdiction.  International banks may, of their own volition, act in accord with the sanctions.  But without knowing the details of the Korean-Iranian transaction, it looks on the surface like the sanctions wouldn't have any impact on bonds held by Korean companies, since I'm sure the Iranian banks would wish to honor their agreements.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In any case, I believe the Koreans at said company have over-reacted.  Washington doesn&#8217;t govern the world yet, and US sanctions on Iranian banks are limited in effect to business with US citizens and assets under US jurisdiction.  International banks may, of their own volition, act in accord with the sanctions.  But without knowing the details of the Korean-Iranian transaction, it looks on the surface like the sanctions wouldn&#8217;t have any impact on bonds held by Korean companies, since I&#8217;m sure the Iranian banks would wish to honor their agreements.</p>
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		<title>By: Paul H.</title>
		<link>http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/11/06/something-i-heard-today/comment-page-1/#comment-116651</link>
		<dc:creator>Paul H.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 07 Nov 2007 23:50:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/11/06/something-i-heard-today/#comment-116651</guid>
		<description>#31: "I respect the Koreans for their high-risk economic partnerships with Iran..."

Well, in the cinema verite that constitutes today's "international community", respect is what it's all about, baby.  You've got to get right in the face of those rogue empires with hand-held cameras (&#38; maybe a few RPG's) &#38; let 'em know what's what.

So let's hope the ROK's take heed of what you say and send those f-ing Americans packing.  To do otherwise would be most gauche.  A triad of the ROK-DPRK-Islamic Republic of Iran Presidents, posed together arm in arm, would be the thing -- wherein to catch the conscience of the world.  

Not to mention the helpful effect it would likely have on the likelilhood of the Iranians paying off their own bonds.  No reason why doing good shouldn't also mean doing well.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>#31: &#8220;I respect the Koreans for their high-risk economic partnerships with Iran&#8230;&#8221;</p>
<p>Well, in the cinema verite that constitutes today&#8217;s &#8220;international community&#8221;, respect is what it&#8217;s all about, baby.  You&#8217;ve got to get right in the face of those rogue empires with hand-held cameras (&amp; maybe a few RPG&#8217;s) &amp; let &#8216;em know what&#8217;s what.</p>
<p>So let&#8217;s hope the ROK&#8217;s take heed of what you say and send those f-ing Americans packing.  To do otherwise would be most gauche.  A triad of the ROK-DPRK-Islamic Republic of Iran Presidents, posed together arm in arm, would be the thing &#8212; wherein to catch the conscience of the world.  </p>
<p>Not to mention the helpful effect it would likely have on the likelilhood of the Iranians paying off their own bonds.  No reason why doing good shouldn&#8217;t also mean doing well.</p>
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		<title>By: Breaktrack</title>
		<link>http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/11/06/something-i-heard-today/comment-page-1/#comment-116646</link>
		<dc:creator>Breaktrack</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 07 Nov 2007 22:15:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/11/06/something-i-heard-today/#comment-116646</guid>
		<description>#28 Although I don't share your rabid anti-American stance, I also believe S Korea has the right to do business in Iran. However, as I said, "ya takes yer chances" in such a volatile situation. Considering the US and Iran have had a less than cordial relationship since 1979, I'm not surprised at what happened. Koreans have benefited more from their relationship with the F'ing US than with Iran, but you'd never know it. Of course, Korean nationals will never agree with me on this point.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>#28 Although I don&#8217;t share your rabid anti-American stance, I also believe S Korea has the right to do business in Iran. However, as I said, &#8220;ya takes yer chances&#8221; in such a volatile situation. Considering the US and Iran have had a less than cordial relationship since 1979, I&#8217;m not surprised at what happened. Koreans have benefited more from their relationship with the F&#8217;ing US than with Iran, but you&#8217;d never know it. Of course, Korean nationals will never agree with me on this point.</p>
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		<title>By: Linkd</title>
		<link>http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/11/06/something-i-heard-today/comment-page-1/#comment-116643</link>
		<dc:creator>Linkd</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 07 Nov 2007 20:49:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/11/06/something-i-heard-today/#comment-116643</guid>
		<description>...and modelling the latest line of iconic Che Guevara armchair revolutionary wear...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8230;and modelling the latest line of iconic Che Guevara armchair revolutionary wear&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: cinemagauche</title>
		<link>http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/11/06/something-i-heard-today/comment-page-1/#comment-116630</link>
		<dc:creator>cinemagauche</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 07 Nov 2007 16:32:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/11/06/something-i-heard-today/#comment-116630</guid>
		<description>Well the US has been head-butting Iran for over 20 years and longer.   That's no reason why other countries shouldn't do business with the enemies of a rogue empire.  I respect the Koreans for their high-risk economic partnerships with Iran.  The risk has little to do with Iran itself, depending much more on the unpredictable moves of the lunatic rogue empire. So the Koreans are correct in their analysis and quite right to heave expletives and general disgust at the "fucking Americans" for its new outrages against the international community.  

"WASHINGTON, Oct. 28 (Xinhua) -- There is no evidence that Iran is actively building nuclear weapons, said Mohamed ElBaradei, head of the International Atomic Energy Agency (IAEA), in an interview with CNN on Sunday."</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well the US has been head-butting Iran for over 20 years and longer.   That&#8217;s no reason why other countries shouldn&#8217;t do business with the enemies of a rogue empire.  I respect the Koreans for their high-risk economic partnerships with Iran.  The risk has little to do with Iran itself, depending much more on the unpredictable moves of the lunatic rogue empire. So the Koreans are correct in their analysis and quite right to heave expletives and general disgust at the &#8220;fucking Americans&#8221; for its new outrages against the international community.  </p>
<p>&#8220;WASHINGTON, Oct. 28 (Xinhua) &#8212; There is no evidence that Iran is actively building nuclear weapons, said Mohamed ElBaradei, head of the International Atomic Energy Agency (IAEA), in an interview with CNN on Sunday.&#8221;</p>
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		<title>By: hornuts</title>
		<link>http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/11/06/something-i-heard-today/comment-page-1/#comment-116626</link>
		<dc:creator>hornuts</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 07 Nov 2007 14:05:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/11/06/something-i-heard-today/#comment-116626</guid>
		<description>One of the benefits of investing somewhere nobody else will touch is that you get a virtual monopoly.  Go to Uzbekistan, most of the cars you see on the road are Daewoos (they've built a factory in the Ferghana Valley, where Andijan is located).  Hyundai's planning to follow suit.  In Turkmenistan, drive down the highway in Ashgabat, and you'll see LG and Samsung billboards interspersed with portraits of the leader (Niyazov when I was there, not sure if it's the new guy's portrait now).  More on this here:
http://www.ethicalcorp.com/content.asp?ContentID=3788 
So for every story of getting burned in Iran or Burma, there's "success" stories too.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>One of the benefits of investing somewhere nobody else will touch is that you get a virtual monopoly.  Go to Uzbekistan, most of the cars you see on the road are Daewoos (they&#8217;ve built a factory in the Ferghana Valley, where Andijan is located).  Hyundai&#8217;s planning to follow suit.  In Turkmenistan, drive down the highway in Ashgabat, and you&#8217;ll see LG and Samsung billboards interspersed with portraits of the leader (Niyazov when I was there, not sure if it&#8217;s the new guy&#8217;s portrait now).  More on this here:<br />
<a href="http://www.ethicalcorp.com/content.asp?ContentID=3788" rel="nofollow">http://www.ethicalcorp.com/con.....entID=3788</a><br />
So for every story of getting burned in Iran or Burma, there&#8217;s &#8220;success&#8221; stories too.</p>
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		<title>By: Breaktrack</title>
		<link>http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/11/06/something-i-heard-today/comment-page-1/#comment-116586</link>
		<dc:creator>Breaktrack</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 07 Nov 2007 02:50:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/11/06/something-i-heard-today/#comment-116586</guid>
		<description>It's quite shocking that they didn't consider the risks of doing business with the Iranians. If the average Korean doesn't or won't get paid because of this, my heart goes out to them. However, ya takes your chances in this kind of situation. It's no secret that the US and Iran have been butting heads for over twenty years. The Koreans have no one to blame but themselves, but of course they will never accept responsibilty for their actions.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It&#8217;s quite shocking that they didn&#8217;t consider the risks of doing business with the Iranians. If the average Korean doesn&#8217;t or won&#8217;t get paid because of this, my heart goes out to them. However, ya takes your chances in this kind of situation. It&#8217;s no secret that the US and Iran have been butting heads for over twenty years. The Koreans have no one to blame but themselves, but of course they will never accept responsibilty for their actions.</p>
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		<title>By: Linkd</title>
		<link>http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/11/06/something-i-heard-today/comment-page-1/#comment-116568</link>
		<dc:creator>Linkd</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 07 Nov 2007 02:09:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/11/06/something-i-heard-today/#comment-116568</guid>
		<description>Just a loan in an accounting sense. Let's say part of the deal is that the K company agrees to employ 1000 Iranian workers at $100 per day for 2 years, and buy $100m worth of concrete from an Iranian supplier. It would be aggressive, but not necessarily unethical, for the Iranians to ask that that amount of money be 'deposited' in Iran, in the form of a bond purchase, prior to work commencing. It's effectively a loan, but not called a loan. And if the K company fails to complete the project, of course they won't collect the principal.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Just a loan in an accounting sense. Let&#8217;s say part of the deal is that the K company agrees to employ 1000 Iranian workers at $100 per day for 2 years, and buy $100m worth of concrete from an Iranian supplier. It would be aggressive, but not necessarily unethical, for the Iranians to ask that that amount of money be &#8216;deposited&#8217; in Iran, in the form of a bond purchase, prior to work commencing. It&#8217;s effectively a loan, but not called a loan. And if the K company fails to complete the project, of course they won&#8217;t collect the principal.</p>
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