Finally, is that any different from Vietnam? The Americans provided the Koreans most of their supplies, aerial intel, helicopter transport and weapons AND Dai Han still made Charlie piss in his pants. As a matter of fact most of what was written / observed on the Korean troops in Vietnam were by American forward observers, communications officers and helicopter pilots. Ever read “Vietnam Above the Treetops” by John Flanagan? He was a forward observer that helped call-up air cover and he was attached to Korean troops (I think Tiger Division). Interesting read worth checking out.

Hey, that was kinda funny, but… pointless.

1) I don’t play Starcraft.

2) I generally know what the f*ck I’m talking about so I’m not one of those “FOB” types molds you like to cast people in. Oh, how convenient. If there is someone you can’t effectively argue against you decide to slap the “FOB” moniker on ‘em then pat yourself on the back and convince yourself how smart you are and how dumb the guy you talked to just was.

3) I never said Korean SF would not need U.S. logistical and intelligence support. So… STOP PUTTING WORDS IN MY MOUTH.

You remind me of one of those little “ADD” kids in kindergarten that an ex-gf had to deal with. You know, the ones that can’t effectively communicate so they do so by being the class asshole; pulling the pigtails of the girl who sits behind ‘em and bitting the teacher’s legs while she’s sitting at her desk.

KSF leader: Sir, KSF cannot reach the target.

WangKon936: Do not worry, we obtained tickets through Cathay Pacific and got you seats going to India and from there we chartered a flight to Afghan.

KSF leader: Sir, KSF cannot find the target.

WangKon936: Hang tight young man. As you know I went to an American college and with my perfect English I am going to contact American intel for updated pics and have it emailed to your PDA. There done.

KSF leader: Target sighted, engage target?

WangKon936: Whoa, just hang on a minute. Remember, there is policy to consider. One sec . . . no, yes, well no, well maybe. OK guys, here is the word down the pipeline. We are going to pass on engagement but don’t worry we are extremely proud of you guys. You are not the USF but still you are very good at what you do. And the best part is the perspective you bring to the table. Maybe one day we will have orders to actually engage in real combat. Mission totally successful!

“…Possibly millions of civilians have been killed directly or as an indirect result of US bombing since WWII, if you consider the Korean War, Vietnam War, and to a lesser extent, Panama, Yugoslavia, Iraq and Afghanistan….”

Ah, the “globalvillage” fearlessly speaks truth to power. The voice of the citizens of the world! Gotta stay in the face of the arrogant American superpower, especially since the worldcitizen is utterly confident that the simultaneously-evil-but-nevertheless-ominiscient Americans will always be there for him if/when the chips are really down.

How I wish I had the power to begin “winding down” that particular stance for all you fearless ones.

I liked the way you included the modifiers “possibly” and “indirect”, as that gives you substantial “wiggle room” when it comes to the burden of actually having to provide some documentation for these assertions of endless millions of deaths at the hand of the Americans.

My recollection of all these particular post-WWII conflictss you cite is that there were brutal invasions or attacks by tyrants and dictators prior to US involvement. Especially in the case of the ROK, where the US ended its occupation of the ROK in 1949, turned the government over to Korean citizens, and withdrew all its combat forces in the spring of that year.

And for that matter why did you make it a point to specifically exempt WWII? Millions of Japanese and German dead would have lent some credibility to your assertion
(though the Russians and British accounted for their fair share).

And we probably wouldn’t have been in any of these places you mention if we had just done what the Japanese expected us to do after Pearl Harbor — open negotiations for a peace, with the consequence of leaving the Republic of China and colonial Korea to whatever happy destiny awaited them in the late 40’s and 50’s at the hands of the Japanese empire.

Too bad we didn’t, as then all those unhappy “millions” of Chinese and Koreans, dead at the hands of the insane American cowboys, would no doubt have lived to a ripe old age and been able to smile down at their grandchildren.

Well, I reckon there’s still a chance for we Americans to learn from our previous sins. Let’s get out of the ROK before we become responsible for the deaths of more “millions” of innocent Koreans.

“Genocidal”, of course. Need coffee!

As far as murderous intent and remarkable ineptitude are concerned, all three of these tyrants deserve mention. Pol Pot, due to Cambodia’s much smaller population and his mere four years in power, didn’t kill nearly as many people as Stalin or Mao managed, but he may have caused the deaths of 15% or 20% of the country’s total population. (Kind of makes him the Division 3 scoring champion of genodical maniacs.)

Possibly millions of civilians have been killed directly or as an indirect result of US bombing since WWII, if you consider the Korean War, Vietnam War, and to a lesser extent, Panama, Yugoslavia, Iraq and Afghanistan. These days I genuinely believe a great deal of care is taken to avoid this, but when one is fighting guerillas/terrorists who using unconventional/illegal tactics, some civilian casualties - “collateral damage” is the sanitized term - cannot be avoided. Plus, mistakes happen. (Though I supposed this matters very little to an Iraqi or Afghani who loses his or her family in an airstrike.)

Sonagi, I thought it was because the U.S. had the only intact industrial/military complex after WWII?

Btw… not trying to debunk U.S. SF capabilities anywhere. Have a lot of respect for U.S. SF capabilities.