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	<title>Comments on: Sick</title>
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	<link>http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/06/06/sick/</link>
	<description>Korea... in Blog Format</description>
	<pubDate>Sun,  7 Sep 2008 07:31:52 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: bumfromkorea</title>
		<link>http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/06/06/sick/#comment-84020</link>
		<dc:creator>bumfromkorea</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 07 Jun 2007 17:20:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/06/06/sick/#comment-84020</guid>
		<description>1) Conceded.  No doubt that the article is deemed racist, but perhaps this is mitigated by my fourth point.

2) You're right; no matter how successful they were with this article, the existence of the article itself would be a problem.  (on that account, we both agree, as we have in 5 ^^)

3) I didn't intend to say that you held the belief (apologies if there was a confusion), but rather that previous comments have been blurring the line between the two.

4) I personally believe that a newspaper cannot redeem or condemn an entire population (as you believe).  And yes, racism exists no matter the cognition by the population, but I was merely suggesting that for Koreans, it is not a matter of character flaw (or inherent flaw, as some have suggested in the past in this blog) but a matter of inexperience.  

5) Definitely :-).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>1) Conceded.  No doubt that the article is deemed racist, but perhaps this is mitigated by my fourth point.</p>
<p>2) You&#8217;re right; no matter how successful they were with this article, the existence of the article itself would be a problem.  (on that account, we both agree, as we have in 5 ^^)</p>
<p>3) I didn&#8217;t intend to say that you held the belief (apologies if there was a confusion), but rather that previous comments have been blurring the line between the two.</p>
<p>4) I personally believe that a newspaper cannot redeem or condemn an entire population (as you believe).  And yes, racism exists no matter the cognition by the population, but I was merely suggesting that for Koreans, it is not a matter of character flaw (or inherent flaw, as some have suggested in the past in this blog) but a matter of inexperience.  </p>
<p>5) Definitely :-).</p>
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		<title>By: gbnhj</title>
		<link>http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/06/06/sick/#comment-83960</link>
		<dc:creator>gbnhj</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 07 Jun 2007 04:28:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/06/06/sick/#comment-83960</guid>
		<description>bumfromkorea,

I'll take your points in turn:

1) Yes, no doubt it was more inflamatory. Then again, considering the 800-fold increase in the number of people involved, the greater magnitude of the assailants and the pain they caused ought to be expressed. Perhaps someone else could write a more apt title - one which would necessarily include 'Yellow', of course, in order to provide fair comparison with the other title.

2) I never claimed that the Chosun were successful in its efforts, only that they had made them. I do not criticise the paper because I believe that they are successful, I criticise them because I believe they are wrong.

3) I have not criticised Koreans in general regarding this, nor have I criticised Koreans as holding the same views as does that paper. I agree with you that to do so would be wrong. However, I haven't, so there's not much to say.

4) Again, I haven't made that connection. Since &lt;i&gt;you&lt;/i&gt; would like to entertain this idea, perhaps you can tell us if any culpability exists in what the paper wrote. I would add, however, that simply because people do not recognize something as racist does not mean that it is not, in fact, racist. It only means that they have not recognised it as such.

5) Yes, I agree that it is a rag.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>bumfromkorea,</p>
<p>I&#8217;ll take your points in turn:</p>
<p>1) Yes, no doubt it was more inflamatory. Then again, considering the 800-fold increase in the number of people involved, the greater magnitude of the assailants and the pain they caused ought to be expressed. Perhaps someone else could write a more apt title - one which would necessarily include &#8216;Yellow&#8217;, of course, in order to provide fair comparison with the other title.</p>
<p>2) I never claimed that the Chosun were successful in its efforts, only that they had made them. I do not criticise the paper because I believe that they are successful, I criticise them because I believe they are wrong.</p>
<p>3) I have not criticised Koreans in general regarding this, nor have I criticised Koreans as holding the same views as does that paper. I agree with you that to do so would be wrong. However, I haven&#8217;t, so there&#8217;s not much to say.</p>
<p>4) Again, I haven&#8217;t made that connection. Since <i>you</i> would like to entertain this idea, perhaps you can tell us if any culpability exists in what the paper wrote. I would add, however, that simply because people do not recognize something as racist does not mean that it is not, in fact, racist. It only means that they have not recognised it as such.</p>
<p>5) Yes, I agree that it is a rag.</p>
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		<title>By: bumfromkorea</title>
		<link>http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/06/06/sick/#comment-83952</link>
		<dc:creator>bumfromkorea</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 07 Jun 2007 02:14:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/06/06/sick/#comment-83952</guid>
		<description>#36
I suppose there are couple of things I can say about the article.   

1. Though no doubt that the article was not friendly to the "white" population residing in South Korea, I also doubt that the article nor the title had the same level of hostility and racial hatred as  "Middle School Girl Brutalised by Korean Yellow Peril".

2. Considering the short length of the article, little to no duplication in other news source, lack of netizen activity, and so on, the article seems to have made little to no societal impact, so Choson's "racial baiting" didn't quite work anyway.

3. There's no doubt that South Korean media lacks a certain quality of integrity, but a lot of comments here seems to equate Choson-Ilbo to Koreans in general.  Wouldn't this be a false logic?

4. Supposing that somehow Choson-Ilbo reflects the Korean sentiments in general (and ignoring the fallibility of assuming there's only one sentiment among a population), isn't it possible that, having only recently opened up to non-natives and had very little time to adjust to the change (even counting the minuscule non-native population in 1950~1990 it is a mere fraction compared to other liberal modern countries), articles such as "White English Teacher Threatens Korean Woman with AIDS" does not strike South Koreans as racist? (As in, South Koreans does not recognize the article as racist?)

5. Even among South Koreans, Choson Ilbo is considered a questionable source of news with credibility among public similar to Fox News Channel in United States - that is, though there are people who follow it religiously, many also believe it to be a useless rag of a newspaper.

#37
I'd rather prefer looking closer into the claims made by others before making any decisions.  If I accept what others write on face, wouldn't that be horrendously irresponsible of me?

Also, it would be very strange for a group of people to observe a crime and comment "this happened because we are inherently flawed".  Aside from one distasteful comments left on the article, there's no implication in the article that the alleged perpetrator being "white" led to the crime.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>#36<br />
I suppose there are couple of things I can say about the article.   </p>
<p>1. Though no doubt that the article was not friendly to the &#8220;white&#8221; population residing in South Korea, I also doubt that the article nor the title had the same level of hostility and racial hatred as  &#8220;Middle School Girl Brutalised by Korean Yellow Peril&#8221;.</p>
<p>2. Considering the short length of the article, little to no duplication in other news source, lack of netizen activity, and so on, the article seems to have made little to no societal impact, so Choson&#8217;s &#8220;racial baiting&#8221; didn&#8217;t quite work anyway.</p>
<p>3. There&#8217;s no doubt that South Korean media lacks a certain quality of integrity, but a lot of comments here seems to equate Choson-Ilbo to Koreans in general.  Wouldn&#8217;t this be a false logic?</p>
<p>4. Supposing that somehow Choson-Ilbo reflects the Korean sentiments in general (and ignoring the fallibility of assuming there&#8217;s only one sentiment among a population), isn&#8217;t it possible that, having only recently opened up to non-natives and had very little time to adjust to the change (even counting the minuscule non-native population in 1950~1990 it is a mere fraction compared to other liberal modern countries), articles such as &#8220;White English Teacher Threatens Korean Woman with AIDS&#8221; does not strike South Koreans as racist? (As in, South Koreans does not recognize the article as racist?)</p>
<p>5. Even among South Koreans, Choson Ilbo is considered a questionable source of news with credibility among public similar to Fox News Channel in United States - that is, though there are people who follow it religiously, many also believe it to be a useless rag of a newspaper.</p>
<p>#37<br />
I&#8217;d rather prefer looking closer into the claims made by others before making any decisions.  If I accept what others write on face, wouldn&#8217;t that be horrendously irresponsible of me?</p>
<p>Also, it would be very strange for a group of people to observe a crime and comment &#8220;this happened because we are inherently flawed&#8221;.  Aside from one distasteful comments left on the article, there&#8217;s no implication in the article that the alleged perpetrator being &#8220;white&#8221; led to the crime.</p>
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		<title>By: michael</title>
		<link>http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/06/06/sick/#comment-83946</link>
		<dc:creator>michael</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 07 Jun 2007 01:13:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/06/06/sick/#comment-83946</guid>
		<description>Things like this make me sick of humanity--bring on the asteroid. All these people are shits.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Things like this make me sick of humanity&#8211;bring on the asteroid. All these people are shits.</p>
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		<title>By: dogbertt</title>
		<link>http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/06/06/sick/#comment-83942</link>
		<dc:creator>dogbertt</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 07 Jun 2007 00:31:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/06/06/sick/#comment-83942</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;It does seem that, at least on the Korean version of the article, the general sentiments of the comments left by the readers were that the kidnappers as well as the 800 clients were despicable men and deserved the harshest punishment possible.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

But do those readers associate the crimes with the "Koreanness" of their perpetrators?  No.

Why is it so hard for you to see the hypocrisy?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>It does seem that, at least on the Korean version of the article, the general sentiments of the comments left by the readers were that the kidnappers as well as the 800 clients were despicable men and deserved the harshest punishment possible.</p></blockquote>
<p>But do those readers associate the crimes with the &#8220;Koreanness&#8221; of their perpetrators?  No.</p>
<p>Why is it so hard for you to see the hypocrisy?</p>
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		<title>By: gbnhj</title>
		<link>http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/06/06/sick/#comment-83937</link>
		<dc:creator>gbnhj</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 07 Jun 2007 00:00:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/06/06/sick/#comment-83937</guid>
		<description>bumfromkorea, yes it's an act well worth all condemnation, and understandably, readers of the Korean-language articles have posted about how abhorant they think it is.

Yet why is it that, when one man &lt;i&gt;alledgedly&lt;/i&gt; sends an email to an ex-girlfriend, the Koran-language media labels it &lt;a href="http://news.chosun.com/site/data/html_dir/2007/05/28/2007052800060.html" rel="nofollow"&gt;'White English Teacher Threatens Korean Woman with AIDS'&lt;/a&gt;? In other words, following the logic of the &lt;i&gt;Chosun Ilbo&lt;/i&gt; with respect to allegations and the racial makeup of those involved, should not the headline of this latest article read something like 'Middle School Girl Brutalised by Korean Yellow Peril'?

I don't think so. But by the same token, nor do I think that an entire racial group, or even an entire profession, should be held to account for the alledged actions of one person. For that alone, the Chosun Ilbo is a race-baiting rag.

French Quarter,
What, no response? By your logic, we've got a 'string' of criminality here with this rape-abduction case, and your input would be appreciated.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>bumfromkorea, yes it&#8217;s an act well worth all condemnation, and understandably, readers of the Korean-language articles have posted about how abhorant they think it is.</p>
<p>Yet why is it that, when one man <i>alledgedly</i> sends an email to an ex-girlfriend, the Koran-language media labels it <a href="http://news.chosun.com/site/data/html_dir/2007/05/28/2007052800060.html" rel="nofollow">&#8216;White English Teacher Threatens Korean Woman with AIDS&#8217;</a>? In other words, following the logic of the <i>Chosun Ilbo</i> with respect to allegations and the racial makeup of those involved, should not the headline of this latest article read something like &#8216;Middle School Girl Brutalised by Korean Yellow Peril&#8217;?</p>
<p>I don&#8217;t think so. But by the same token, nor do I think that an entire racial group, or even an entire profession, should be held to account for the alledged actions of one person. For that alone, the Chosun Ilbo is a race-baiting rag.</p>
<p>French Quarter,<br />
What, no response? By your logic, we&#8217;ve got a &#8217;string&#8217; of criminality here with this rape-abduction case, and your input would be appreciated.</p>
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		<title>By: seouldout</title>
		<link>http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/06/06/sick/#comment-83932</link>
		<dc:creator>seouldout</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 06 Jun 2007 22:57:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/06/06/sick/#comment-83932</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;This so-called “Korean moral superiority” is a quite recent phenomenon.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

No, it ain't.  That card has been played for a very long while.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>This so-called “Korean moral superiority” is a quite recent phenomenon.</p></blockquote>
<p>No, it ain&#8217;t.  That card has been played for a very long while.</p>
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		<title>By: bumfromkorea</title>
		<link>http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/06/06/sick/#comment-83930</link>
		<dc:creator>bumfromkorea</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 06 Jun 2007 22:50:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/06/06/sick/#comment-83930</guid>
		<description>#33:
Hmm... is that 1) Overall sentiments of the South Korean people (and if so, how would I find out if it is true?) 2) the attitude of the South Korean media (which I agree can be unreliable and obnoxious at times) or 3) sentiments of the Korean bloggers and netizens?

It does seem that, at least on the Korean version of the article, the general sentiments of the comments left by the readers were that the kidnappers as well as the 800 clients were despicable men and deserved the harshest punishment possible.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>#33:<br />
Hmm&#8230; is that 1) Overall sentiments of the South Korean people (and if so, how would I find out if it is true?) 2) the attitude of the South Korean media (which I agree can be unreliable and obnoxious at times) or 3) sentiments of the Korean bloggers and netizens?</p>
<p>It does seem that, at least on the Korean version of the article, the general sentiments of the comments left by the readers were that the kidnappers as well as the 800 clients were despicable men and deserved the harshest punishment possible.</p>
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		<title>By: Breaktrack</title>
		<link>http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/06/06/sick/#comment-83929</link>
		<dc:creator>Breaktrack</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 06 Jun 2007 22:30:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/06/06/sick/#comment-83929</guid>
		<description>#29:
The article doesn't mention white expats. You see Koreans are morally superior to all foreigners and a Korean would never do anything like what the article mentioned. However, occassionally a Korean does veer off the path of moral superiority and this is really because of the immoral influence foreigners (white people)have on Korean society.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>#29:<br />
The article doesn&#8217;t mention white expats. You see Koreans are morally superior to all foreigners and a Korean would never do anything like what the article mentioned. However, occassionally a Korean does veer off the path of moral superiority and this is really because of the immoral influence foreigners (white people)have on Korean society.</p>
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		<title>By: bulgasari</title>
		<link>http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/06/06/sick/#comment-83927</link>
		<dc:creator>bulgasari</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 06 Jun 2007 20:14:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/06/06/sick/#comment-83927</guid>
		<description>If anyone actually cares about the topic of the post, there's a video &lt;a href="http://news.naver.com/news/read.php?mode=LSD&#38;office_id=214&#38;article_id=0000041017&#38;section_id=102&#38;menu_id=102" rel="nofollow"&gt;here&lt;/a&gt; where, inexplicably, the victim joins an mbc news crew and returns to one of the motels she was held in, displaying her wounds and showing some of the chatting sites where her captors found customers.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If anyone actually cares about the topic of the post, there&#8217;s a video <a href="http://news.naver.com/news/read.php?mode=LSD&amp;office_id=214&amp;article_id=0000041017&amp;section_id=102&amp;menu_id=102" rel="nofollow">here</a> where, inexplicably, the victim joins an mbc news crew and returns to one of the motels she was held in, displaying her wounds and showing some of the chatting sites where her captors found customers.</p>
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