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	<title>Comments on: Bucheon Hospital Body Clash</title>
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	<link>http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/04/04/bucheon-hospital-body-clash/</link>
	<description>Korea... in Blog Format</description>
	<pubDate>Mon,  1 Dec 2008 20:17:02 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: hamel</title>
		<link>http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/04/04/bucheon-hospital-body-clash/#comment-76861</link>
		<dc:creator>hamel</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 08 Apr 2007 11:25:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/04/04/bucheon-hospital-body-clash/#comment-76861</guid>
		<description>Thanks to H. Kim for pointing out the likelihood that it was 조폭 (jopok, or gangsters) who were (probably) hired by the hospital to come in and rough up the family. I know that this does occur in Korea - does anyone remember the incident at Sejong Hospital with striking workers busted up by jopok a year or so ago? 

I also witnessed jopok in my local market coming in to evict some stallholders who were obscuring the entrance to a newly opened Bada Iyagi (Sea Story) gambling palace. They put the stallholders stuff onto trucks and carted it away, putting container boxes down so that the stalls could not be set up again. (Last laugh: the gambling house closed, the container boxes are gone, and the stallholders are back.)

My Korean missus said it is sad that the police stand by and let the hired thugs do their dirty work, but it is not a rare occurrence. 

Anyway, for me it makes me think I'd not like to go back to that hospital again for treatment. Thinking about dropping a line to the administrator....

Oranckay, any comments about police/jopok collusion?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks to H. Kim for pointing out the likelihood that it was 조폭 (jopok, or gangsters) who were (probably) hired by the hospital to come in and rough up the family. I know that this does occur in Korea - does anyone remember the incident at Sejong Hospital with striking workers busted up by jopok a year or so ago? </p>
<p>I also witnessed jopok in my local market coming in to evict some stallholders who were obscuring the entrance to a newly opened Bada Iyagi (Sea Story) gambling palace. They put the stallholders stuff onto trucks and carted it away, putting container boxes down so that the stalls could not be set up again. (Last laugh: the gambling house closed, the container boxes are gone, and the stallholders are back.)</p>
<p>My Korean missus said it is sad that the police stand by and let the hired thugs do their dirty work, but it is not a rare occurrence. </p>
<p>Anyway, for me it makes me think I&#8217;d not like to go back to that hospital again for treatment. Thinking about dropping a line to the administrator&#8230;.</p>
<p>Oranckay, any comments about police/jopok collusion?</p>
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		<title>By: dogbertt</title>
		<link>http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/04/04/bucheon-hospital-body-clash/#comment-76852</link>
		<dc:creator>dogbertt</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 08 Apr 2007 10:30:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/04/04/bucheon-hospital-body-clash/#comment-76852</guid>
		<description>[&lt;a href="http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/03/07/comment-moderation-policy-update-1/" rel="nofollow"&gt;DELETED. Reason: Response to off topic comment.&lt;/a&gt;]&lt;strike&gt;

&lt;blockquote&gt;just wondering where this purported “bad reputation” of the comments section resides.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Scene: U.N. Secretary General's Situation Room

 [Enter Gen. Sec. Ban Ki-moon]

Flunky: Sir, intelligence claims our comrades to the Nor^H^H^H the Norks are going to test a second nuclear bomb within 24 hrs.!!!

Ban:  Get a grip on yourself, Mr. Kim!  Let's just all be calm...

Kim:  What are we going to do?!??  It will start WWIII!!! Gaaaaaaah....

Ban:  I know!  Get your laptop plugged in and let's see what Koehler has to say ...

[Kim types www.rjkoehler.com on his laptop]

Ban:  Let's just take a looksee ... hmmm
Click on that one...WTF??!?!? He's got two naked Korean women taking a bath ??? I can't make out what they're saying ... they must be Norks!

Kim:  No, sir, those are just naked Filipinas, they're speaking Tagalog.

Ban:  Well, some Cholla farmer will be a happy man tonight!  Now, let's see what nulji has to say... ah feck him!  At times like this only baduk's sage advice will do!

"Kim is China's bitch!  Nuke him!"

Well, there's our answer right there!  Call Bushie, Kim ...&lt;/strike&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[<a href="http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/03/07/comment-moderation-policy-update-1/" rel="nofollow">DELETED. Reason: Response to off topic comment.</a>]<strike></p>
<blockquote><p>just wondering where this purported “bad reputation” of the comments section resides.</p></blockquote>
<p>Scene: U.N. Secretary General&#8217;s Situation Room</p>
<p> [Enter Gen. Sec. Ban Ki-moon]</p>
<p>Flunky: Sir, intelligence claims our comrades to the Nor^H^H^H the Norks are going to test a second nuclear bomb within 24 hrs.!!!</p>
<p>Ban:  Get a grip on yourself, Mr. Kim!  Let&#8217;s just all be calm&#8230;</p>
<p>Kim:  What are we going to do?!??  It will start WWIII!!! Gaaaaaaah&#8230;.</p>
<p>Ban:  I know!  Get your laptop plugged in and let&#8217;s see what Koehler has to say &#8230;</p>
<p>[Kim types <a href="http://www.rjkoehler.com" rel="nofollow">http://www.rjkoehler.com</a> on his laptop]</p>
<p>Ban:  Let&#8217;s just take a looksee &#8230; hmmm<br />
Click on that one&#8230;WTF??!?!? He&#8217;s got two naked Korean women taking a bath ??? I can&#8217;t make out what they&#8217;re saying &#8230; they must be Norks!</p>
<p>Kim:  No, sir, those are just naked Filipinas, they&#8217;re speaking Tagalog.</p>
<p>Ban:  Well, some Cholla farmer will be a happy man tonight!  Now, let&#8217;s see what nulji has to say&#8230; ah feck him!  At times like this only baduk&#8217;s sage advice will do!</p>
<p>&#8220;Kim is China&#8217;s bitch!  Nuke him!&#8221;</p>
<p>Well, there&#8217;s our answer right there!  Call Bushie, Kim &#8230;</strike></p>
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		<title>By: judge judy</title>
		<link>http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/04/04/bucheon-hospital-body-clash/#comment-76755</link>
		<dc:creator>judge judy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 07 Apr 2007 13:29:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/04/04/bucheon-hospital-body-clash/#comment-76755</guid>
		<description>[&lt;a href="http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/03/07/comment-moderation-policy-update-1/" rel="nofollow"&gt;DELETED. Reason: Off Topic.&lt;/a&gt;]&lt;strike&gt;
we need to get shelton in on this game.  i bet he'd be really good at it.&lt;/strike&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[<a href="http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/03/07/comment-moderation-policy-update-1/" rel="nofollow">DELETED. Reason: Off Topic.</a>]<strike><br />
we need to get shelton in on this game.  i bet he&#8217;d be really good at it.</strike></p>
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		<title>By: Sonagi</title>
		<link>http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/04/04/bucheon-hospital-body-clash/#comment-76745</link>
		<dc:creator>Sonagi</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 07 Apr 2007 11:55:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/04/04/bucheon-hospital-body-clash/#comment-76745</guid>
		<description>[&lt;a href="http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/03/07/comment-moderation-policy-update-1/" rel="nofollow"&gt;DELETED. Reason: Off Topic.&lt;/a&gt;]&lt;strike&gt;
Oranckay,
&lt;&gt;
Please grow some balls.  You don't need to write long explanations.  Just delete.&lt;/strike&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[<a href="http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/03/07/comment-moderation-policy-update-1/" rel="nofollow">DELETED. Reason: Off Topic.</a>]<strike><br />
Oranckay,<br />
<><br />
Please grow some balls.  You don&#8217;t need to write long explanations.  Just delete.</strike></p>
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		<title>By: shakuhachi</title>
		<link>http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/04/04/bucheon-hospital-body-clash/#comment-76736</link>
		<dc:creator>shakuhachi</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 07 Apr 2007 10:57:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/04/04/bucheon-hospital-body-clash/#comment-76736</guid>
		<description>[&lt;a href="http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/03/07/comment-moderation-policy-update-1/" rel="nofollow"&gt;DELETED. Reason: Off Topic.&lt;/a&gt;]
&lt;strike&gt;
&lt;blockquote&gt;Did oranckay delete himself in #69?&lt;/blockquote&gt;

He is harsh but fair.&lt;/strike&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[<a href="http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/03/07/comment-moderation-policy-update-1/" rel="nofollow">DELETED. Reason: Off Topic.</a>]<br />
<strike></p>
<blockquote><p>Did oranckay delete himself in #69?</p></blockquote>
<p>He is harsh but fair.</strike></p>
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		<title>By: gordsellar</title>
		<link>http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/04/04/bucheon-hospital-body-clash/#comment-76735</link>
		<dc:creator>gordsellar</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 07 Apr 2007 10:49:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/04/04/bucheon-hospital-body-clash/#comment-76735</guid>
		<description>H. Kim, 

Last comment, and I'm making it short and sweet. You're still trying to pretend this is not wacked out in Korea. Do you think this would have been in the news the way it was, if it &lt;i&gt;were&lt;/i&gt; normal? Wouldn't it be, I don't know, old hat if that were the case? 

I see you claim that outsiders, as shielded from this kind of conflict, cannot understand it. Buit being a foreigner in Korea is not a one-size-fits-all affair. Close friends of mine have had bad experiences on both sides of the medical desk, and frankly, in all kinds of walks of life. It might make more sense to can the dismissals and talk about context a little. Such as the Korean context, in which this outburst was very big and very weird. 

FWIW, though, if the Jopok were brought in my the hospital -- if they were indeed gangster thugs -- then that does reflect badly on the hospital. Is there evidence the hospital called them in, though?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>H. Kim, </p>
<p>Last comment, and I&#8217;m making it short and sweet. You&#8217;re still trying to pretend this is not wacked out in Korea. Do you think this would have been in the news the way it was, if it <i>were</i> normal? Wouldn&#8217;t it be, I don&#8217;t know, old hat if that were the case? </p>
<p>I see you claim that outsiders, as shielded from this kind of conflict, cannot understand it. Buit being a foreigner in Korea is not a one-size-fits-all affair. Close friends of mine have had bad experiences on both sides of the medical desk, and frankly, in all kinds of walks of life. It might make more sense to can the dismissals and talk about context a little. Such as the Korean context, in which this outburst was very big and very weird. </p>
<p>FWIW, though, if the Jopok were brought in my the hospital &#8212; if they were indeed gangster thugs &#8212; then that does reflect badly on the hospital. Is there evidence the hospital called them in, though?</p>
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		<title>By: dogbertt</title>
		<link>http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/04/04/bucheon-hospital-body-clash/#comment-76731</link>
		<dc:creator>dogbertt</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 07 Apr 2007 09:44:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/04/04/bucheon-hospital-body-clash/#comment-76731</guid>
		<description>[&lt;a href="http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/03/07/comment-moderation-policy-update-1/" rel="nofollow"&gt;DELETED. Reason: Off Topic.&lt;/a&gt;]&lt;strike&gt;
&lt;blockquote&gt;Did oranckay delete himself in #69?&lt;/blockquote&gt;

LOL&lt;/strike&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[<a href="http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/03/07/comment-moderation-policy-update-1/" rel="nofollow">DELETED. Reason: Off Topic.</a>]<strike></p>
<blockquote><p>Did oranckay delete himself in #69?</p></blockquote>
<p>LOL</strike></p>
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		<title>By: gbnhj</title>
		<link>http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/04/04/bucheon-hospital-body-clash/#comment-76730</link>
		<dc:creator>gbnhj</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 07 Apr 2007 09:07:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/04/04/bucheon-hospital-body-clash/#comment-76730</guid>
		<description>[&lt;a href="http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/03/07/comment-moderation-policy-update-1/" rel="nofollow"&gt;DELETED. Reason: Off Topic.&lt;/a&gt;]&lt;strike&gt;
Did oranckay delete &lt;i&gt;himself&lt;/i&gt; in #69?&lt;/strike&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[<a href="http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/03/07/comment-moderation-policy-update-1/" rel="nofollow">DELETED. Reason: Off Topic.</a>]<strike><br />
Did oranckay delete <i>himself</i> in #69?</strike></p>
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		<title>By: Brendon Carr</title>
		<link>http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/04/04/bucheon-hospital-body-clash/#comment-76725</link>
		<dc:creator>Brendon Carr</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 07 Apr 2007 08:21:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/04/04/bucheon-hospital-body-clash/#comment-76725</guid>
		<description>[&lt;a href="http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/03/07/comment-moderation-policy-update-1/" rel="nofollow"&gt;DELETED. Reason: Off Topic.&lt;/a&gt;]&lt;strike&gt;
Sure is fun under the Schroepfer regime.&lt;/strike&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[<a href="http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/03/07/comment-moderation-policy-update-1/" rel="nofollow">DELETED. Reason: Off Topic.</a>]<strike><br />
Sure is fun under the Schroepfer regime.</strike></p>
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		<title>By: oranckay</title>
		<link>http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/04/04/bucheon-hospital-body-clash/#comment-76700</link>
		<dc:creator>oranckay</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 07 Apr 2007 04:55:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/04/04/bucheon-hospital-body-clash/#comment-76700</guid>
		<description>[&lt;a href="http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/03/07/comment-moderation-policy-update-1/" rel="nofollow"&gt;DELETED. Reason: Off Topic.&lt;/a&gt;]
&lt;strike&gt;
&lt;blockquote&gt;I appreciate that the Marmot and Oranckay are busy and have to make some tough and/or quick decisions...&lt;/blockquote&gt;

:-) Like whether or not to delete 66 &#038; 67 for being off topic, for example. But since we're still in "testing period" about moderation here goes. 

globalvillageidiot, first of all, no one, including yourself, has reason to think there's a "pattern of bigotry" in your comments, or at least that there was in the comment I deleted. It might have been a very positive and helpful off topic response to an bigoted comment, for all I know. Since as a matter of principle we're not going to be explaining the rationale behind specific deletion decisions, it is nice and convenient for me to be able to honestly tell you I don't remember why I deleted you @44. It might have been collateral damage (as we said their might be in this process) after a rash and quick carpet bombing deletion campaign. I doubt it, but can't deny that possibility. FWIW, for at least the time being we're not going to edit comment content. If someone writes 20 helpful paragraphs but begins or ends with, for example, "anyone who thinks I've recieved special treatment for being a (whatever) is talking nonsense" - which would've been problematic in this case given the string of inappropriate comments at the time - the best way to encourage people to stay on topic and deliberately ignore inappropriate comments is to delete the whole 20 paragraphs so as to emphasize a policy of zero tolerance (and editing comments is far more work and requires even more "judgement" of specific statements by others). I really, truly don't remember what happened with yours so this is only a "general, for example" example, so please don't let it bother you, at least as much as it might if you could be sure I/we decided you were being bigoted. I'm quite sure that if anyone went through the comments I've made here over the years plenty of comments would be deleted. I'm sorry, really, and should we ever meet in Seoul please let me buy you a beer.&lt;/strike&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[<a href="http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/03/07/comment-moderation-policy-update-1/" rel="nofollow">DELETED. Reason: Off Topic.</a>]<br />
<strike></p>
<blockquote><p>I appreciate that the Marmot and Oranckay are busy and have to make some tough and/or quick decisions&#8230;</p></blockquote>
<p> <img src='http://www.rjkoehler.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':-)' class='wp-smiley' /> Like whether or not to delete 66 &#038; 67 for being off topic, for example. But since we&#8217;re still in &#8220;testing period&#8221; about moderation here goes. </p>
<p>globalvillageidiot, first of all, no one, including yourself, has reason to think there&#8217;s a &#8220;pattern of bigotry&#8221; in your comments, or at least that there was in the comment I deleted. It might have been a very positive and helpful off topic response to an bigoted comment, for all I know. Since as a matter of principle we&#8217;re not going to be explaining the rationale behind specific deletion decisions, it is nice and convenient for me to be able to honestly tell you I don&#8217;t remember why I deleted you @44. It might have been collateral damage (as we said their might be in this process) after a rash and quick carpet bombing deletion campaign. I doubt it, but can&#8217;t deny that possibility. FWIW, for at least the time being we&#8217;re not going to edit comment content. If someone writes 20 helpful paragraphs but begins or ends with, for example, &#8220;anyone who thinks I&#8217;ve recieved special treatment for being a (whatever) is talking nonsense&#8221; - which would&#8217;ve been problematic in this case given the string of inappropriate comments at the time - the best way to encourage people to stay on topic and deliberately ignore inappropriate comments is to delete the whole 20 paragraphs so as to emphasize a policy of zero tolerance (and editing comments is far more work and requires even more &#8220;judgement&#8221; of specific statements by others). I really, truly don&#8217;t remember what happened with yours so this is only a &#8220;general, for example&#8221; example, so please don&#8217;t let it bother you, at least as much as it might if you could be sure I/we decided you were being bigoted. I&#8217;m quite sure that if anyone went through the comments I&#8217;ve made here over the years plenty of comments would be deleted. I&#8217;m sorry, really, and should we ever meet in Seoul please let me buy you a beer.</strike></p>
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