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	<title>Comments on: Sea of Peace?</title>
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	<link>http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/01/08/sea-of-peace/</link>
	<description>Korea... in Blog Format</description>
	<pubDate>Fri,  5 Dec 2008 03:39:49 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: The Marmot&#8217;s Hole &#187; Let the Sino-Korean netizen war begin!</title>
		<link>http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/01/08/sea-of-peace/#comment-67572</link>
		<dc:creator>The Marmot&#8217;s Hole &#187; Let the Sino-Korean netizen war begin!</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 04 Feb 2007 10:08:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/01/08/sea-of-peace/#comment-67572</guid>
		<description>[...] &#8220;make your own caption&#8221; section (nice idea, BTW), one reader&#8212;alluding to this&#8212;wrote, &#8220;Mu-hyeon, you need to call Goguryeo the Country of Peace and Baekdusan the [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] &#8220;make your own caption&#8221; section (nice idea, BTW), one reader&#8212;alluding to this&#8212;wrote, &#8220;Mu-hyeon, you need to call Goguryeo the Country of Peace and Baekdusan the [...]</p>
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		<title>By: How about &#8220;Peace Sea&#8221;? at Asia-Watch</title>
		<link>http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/01/08/sea-of-peace/#comment-62782</link>
		<dc:creator>How about &#8220;Peace Sea&#8221;? at Asia-Watch</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 14 Jan 2007 06:35:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/01/08/sea-of-peace/#comment-62782</guid>
		<description>[...] According to the Marmot&#8217;s Hole, South Korean President Roh Moo-hyun reportedly requested that Japanese PM Shinzo Abe support the use of the name &#8220;Peace Sea&#8221; for the body of water between their countries, rather than &#8220;Sea of Japan,&#8221; which is the current internationally accepted name for the sea. Previously Korean ultranationalists had been pushing for names such as &#8220;East Sea&#8221; or &#8220;Korea Sea&#8221; be adopted instead, but I guess that Roh and his goons realized that their arguments were not working. While it might sound reasonable, this new &#8220;Peace Sea&#8221; proposal is just another pathetic attempt by Korean ultranationalists to remove the word &#8220;Japan&#8221; from international maps. Just like their previous attempts to change the name, it is motivated by hatred of Japan, a country that bears no responsibilty for the international use of the name &#8220;Sea of Japan.&#8221; [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] According to the Marmot&#8217;s Hole, South Korean President Roh Moo-hyun reportedly requested that Japanese PM Shinzo Abe support the use of the name &#8220;Peace Sea&#8221; for the body of water between their countries, rather than &#8220;Sea of Japan,&#8221; which is the current internationally accepted name for the sea. Previously Korean ultranationalists had been pushing for names such as &#8220;East Sea&#8221; or &#8220;Korea Sea&#8221; be adopted instead, but I guess that Roh and his goons realized that their arguments were not working. While it might sound reasonable, this new &#8220;Peace Sea&#8221; proposal is just another pathetic attempt by Korean ultranationalists to remove the word &#8220;Japan&#8221; from international maps. Just like their previous attempts to change the name, it is motivated by hatred of Japan, a country that bears no responsibilty for the international use of the name &#8220;Sea of Japan.&#8221; [...]</p>
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		<title>By: pawikirogi</title>
		<link>http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/01/08/sea-of-peace/#comment-62609</link>
		<dc:creator>pawikirogi</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 12 Jan 2007 08:40:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/01/08/sea-of-peace/#comment-62609</guid>
		<description>'Notice how nulji has managed to throw us off the trail by switching his flag to Saudi Arabia! Guess he’s slightly smarter than we thought.'

well, the sad part to all of this is that becoming a member here almost requires you to hide yourself. if ain't the marmot giving away information about you to those who have access but should't, it's the dogs of marmotville who'll do just about anything to silence those whose criticism they cannot tolerate. these creeps are more totalitarian than they realize. just ask our #1 snoop, dda, who thought it was his right to publish private information about me. i thought it was interesting how the expat whined about the k posse going after a public gerry but said nothing about dda's own little expose on a private netizen. 

you may think that the fair minded don't notice your hypocrisy, but they most certainly do. 

btw, doggit, i am an american and they ain't shit you can do about it. :-)


'Better yet, remember your comment that America should remain a Western country, recognize that you and your family are preventing that, and leave.' dogbert

someguyinkorea, does that count as racist? perhaps you should change your name to 'somebigmouthinkorea'. wouldn' that be better and more in line with your faux huffy puffy stance on racism?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8216;Notice how nulji has managed to throw us off the trail by switching his flag to Saudi Arabia! Guess he’s slightly smarter than we thought.&#8217;</p>
<p>well, the sad part to all of this is that becoming a member here almost requires you to hide yourself. if ain&#8217;t the marmot giving away information about you to those who have access but should&#8217;t, it&#8217;s the dogs of marmotville who&#8217;ll do just about anything to silence those whose criticism they cannot tolerate. these creeps are more totalitarian than they realize. just ask our #1 snoop, dda, who thought it was his right to publish private information about me. i thought it was interesting how the expat whined about the k posse going after a public gerry but said nothing about dda&#8217;s own little expose on a private netizen. </p>
<p>you may think that the fair minded don&#8217;t notice your hypocrisy, but they most certainly do. </p>
<p>btw, doggit, i am an american and they ain&#8217;t shit you can do about it. <img src='http://www.rjkoehler.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':-)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
<p>&#8216;Better yet, remember your comment that America should remain a Western country, recognize that you and your family are preventing that, and leave.&#8217; dogbert</p>
<p>someguyinkorea, does that count as racist? perhaps you should change your name to &#8217;somebigmouthinkorea&#8217;. wouldn&#8217; that be better and more in line with your faux huffy puffy stance on racism?</p>
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		<title>By: dogbertt</title>
		<link>http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/01/08/sea-of-peace/#comment-62527</link>
		<dc:creator>dogbertt</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 12 Jan 2007 00:25:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/01/08/sea-of-peace/#comment-62527</guid>
		<description>Notice how nulji has managed to throw us off the trail by switching his flag to Saudi Arabia!  Guess he's slightly smarter than we thought.

Notice too how he loudly protests he's an "American", but when it suits him he starts referring to "Westerners" to give himself an out.  He should ask, "Why would any American care about this issue?", but he cleverly asks "Why would any Westerner care about this issue?"  In other words, it's natural for dual-loyalty kyopos to loudly advocate for the Korean position on any issue, but white people should shut up.  More typical hypocrisy.

Anyhoo, Westerners (like the About.com guy) care because we care about truth and accuracy.  We care because "The rest of the world have no reason to be forced to change the Sea of Japan to the East Sea or the sea of Korea or whatever name the Koreans prefer."

And nulji, you genius, Koreans _want_ Westerners to care, which is why they conduct these e-mail campaigns targeted at Westerners.  So, shut up.

Better yet, remember your comment that America should remain a Western country, recognize that you and your family are preventing that, and leave.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Notice how nulji has managed to throw us off the trail by switching his flag to Saudi Arabia!  Guess he&#8217;s slightly smarter than we thought.</p>
<p>Notice too how he loudly protests he&#8217;s an &#8220;American&#8221;, but when it suits him he starts referring to &#8220;Westerners&#8221; to give himself an out.  He should ask, &#8220;Why would any American care about this issue?&#8221;, but he cleverly asks &#8220;Why would any Westerner care about this issue?&#8221;  In other words, it&#8217;s natural for dual-loyalty kyopos to loudly advocate for the Korean position on any issue, but white people should shut up.  More typical hypocrisy.</p>
<p>Anyhoo, Westerners (like the About.com guy) care because we care about truth and accuracy.  We care because &#8220;The rest of the world have no reason to be forced to change the Sea of Japan to the East Sea or the sea of Korea or whatever name the Koreans prefer.&#8221;</p>
<p>And nulji, you genius, Koreans _want_ Westerners to care, which is why they conduct these e-mail campaigns targeted at Westerners.  So, shut up.</p>
<p>Better yet, remember your comment that America should remain a Western country, recognize that you and your family are preventing that, and leave.</p>
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		<title>By: pawikirogi</title>
		<link>http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/01/08/sea-of-peace/#comment-62502</link>
		<dc:creator>pawikirogi</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Jan 2007 20:44:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/01/08/sea-of-peace/#comment-62502</guid>
		<description>of course, this whole thread was yet another opportunity for the expat to slam the people he claims to love. one must wonder:

why any westerner would care about this issue? 

and

why can't koreans go after a name change if that is what they want? since it's no big deal, i'm sure the japanese won't mind. btw, can you tell me why it's imperative to keep 'sea of japan'? nope, just looking for something to whine about. 

the name will be changed. korea shares this body of water and the current name is an issue with them. 

lastly, here is the only example i have of westerners being caught in the middle of the samurai and yangban:

remember how the koreans and japanese had to share the world cup? well, i read a few articles about why both countries were chosen to host the games. 

you see, the non-korean/japanese judges were appalled the behavior of both sides. they were shocked at how one side badmouthed the other. that couldn't believe the level of animosity. that's why they made them share the games.

did you notice i said both sides? you think that people will see the japanese as more mature but what you miss is japan's level of maturity is only SLIGHTLY higher than korea's. you never get it, do you, expat? 

'your comment was racist.'

why was it racist? because i used the word 'white'? you mean, you and your brothers can run around all day telling us what koreans do but ain't nobody can talk about you? the other person in that conversation was white. she didn't seem to think my comment was racist. 




'there ain't much difference between four day old bread and five day old bread.' sage pawi</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>of course, this whole thread was yet another opportunity for the expat to slam the people he claims to love. one must wonder:</p>
<p>why any westerner would care about this issue? </p>
<p>and</p>
<p>why can&#8217;t koreans go after a name change if that is what they want? since it&#8217;s no big deal, i&#8217;m sure the japanese won&#8217;t mind. btw, can you tell me why it&#8217;s imperative to keep &#8217;sea of japan&#8217;? nope, just looking for something to whine about. </p>
<p>the name will be changed. korea shares this body of water and the current name is an issue with them. </p>
<p>lastly, here is the only example i have of westerners being caught in the middle of the samurai and yangban:</p>
<p>remember how the koreans and japanese had to share the world cup? well, i read a few articles about why both countries were chosen to host the games. </p>
<p>you see, the non-korean/japanese judges were appalled the behavior of both sides. they were shocked at how one side badmouthed the other. that couldn&#8217;t believe the level of animosity. that&#8217;s why they made them share the games.</p>
<p>did you notice i said both sides? you think that people will see the japanese as more mature but what you miss is japan&#8217;s level of maturity is only SLIGHTLY higher than korea&#8217;s. you never get it, do you, expat? </p>
<p>&#8216;your comment was racist.&#8217;</p>
<p>why was it racist? because i used the word &#8216;white&#8217;? you mean, you and your brothers can run around all day telling us what koreans do but ain&#8217;t nobody can talk about you? the other person in that conversation was white. she didn&#8217;t seem to think my comment was racist. </p>
<p>&#8216;there ain&#8217;t much difference between four day old bread and five day old bread.&#8217; sage pawi</p>
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		<title>By: genie201</title>
		<link>http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/01/08/sea-of-peace/#comment-62473</link>
		<dc:creator>genie201</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Jan 2007 12:10:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/01/08/sea-of-peace/#comment-62473</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;The sea has long been known internationally as the Sea of Japan, but in recent years South Korea has succeeded in persuading map companies to include "East Sea" as an alternative name.&lt;/blockquote&gt;
That's because Koreans and their organizations such as VANK have sent lots of spam mail to foreign media(National Geographic, Graphic maps and Lycos etc)to change "Sea of Japan" into "East Sea". Matt Rosenberg, a professional geographer at About.com revealed that he had been getting complaint letters from VANK about the map on his webpage for over a year.
http://geography.about.com/library/weekly/aa022402a.htm
I think they are like a spoiled child who sees themselves and their need as more important than anything else and bothers people until they get what they want. The rest of the world have no reason to be forced to change the Sea of Japan to the East Sea or the sea of Korea or whatever name the Koreans prefer.

Korea often insists that the name "Sea of Japan" is the legacy of Japanese imperialism of the 20th century. However, the insistence on this is a malignant propaganda to try to gain some sympathy vote. Sea of Japan was already established internationally in the 19th century before Japan opened the country to the world. Also they call East China Sea "South Sea". However, they do not demand that other countries should use this name. What's up with this double standard? I definitely think their activities like this changing the name of the sea of Japan are mainly based on an inferiority complex.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>The sea has long been known internationally as the Sea of Japan, but in recent years South Korea has succeeded in persuading map companies to include &#8220;East Sea&#8221; as an alternative name.</p></blockquote>
<p>That&#8217;s because Koreans and their organizations such as VANK have sent lots of spam mail to foreign media(National Geographic, Graphic maps and Lycos etc)to change &#8220;Sea of Japan&#8221; into &#8220;East Sea&#8221;. Matt Rosenberg, a professional geographer at About.com revealed that he had been getting complaint letters from VANK about the map on his webpage for over a year.<br />
<a href="http://geography.about.com/library/weekly/aa022402a.htm" rel="nofollow">http://geography.about.com/lib.....22402a.htm</a><br />
I think they are like a spoiled child who sees themselves and their need as more important than anything else and bothers people until they get what they want. The rest of the world have no reason to be forced to change the Sea of Japan to the East Sea or the sea of Korea or whatever name the Koreans prefer.</p>
<p>Korea often insists that the name &#8220;Sea of Japan&#8221; is the legacy of Japanese imperialism of the 20th century. However, the insistence on this is a malignant propaganda to try to gain some sympathy vote. Sea of Japan was already established internationally in the 19th century before Japan opened the country to the world. Also they call East China Sea &#8220;South Sea&#8221;. However, they do not demand that other countries should use this name. What&#8217;s up with this double standard? I definitely think their activities like this changing the name of the sea of Japan are mainly based on an inferiority complex.</p>
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		<title>By: railwaycharm</title>
		<link>http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/01/08/sea-of-peace/#comment-62400</link>
		<dc:creator>railwaycharm</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Jan 2007 02:13:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/01/08/sea-of-peace/#comment-62400</guid>
		<description>pawikirogi,

We would never throw your women out of bed for calling us cracker. Or kick them in the stomach to cause a miscarriage.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>pawikirogi,</p>
<p>We would never throw your women out of bed for calling us cracker. Or kick them in the stomach to cause a miscarriage.</p>
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		<title>By: Bryce</title>
		<link>http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/01/08/sea-of-peace/#comment-62394</link>
		<dc:creator>Bryce</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Jan 2007 01:44:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/01/08/sea-of-peace/#comment-62394</guid>
		<description>Apologies, I meant of course the 'Korea Strait' and was referring to its usage in English. I don't care what the Koreas call either the strait or the sea in their own language, as per the comments above.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Apologies, I meant of course the &#8216;Korea Strait&#8217; and was referring to its usage in English. I don&#8217;t care what the Koreas call either the strait or the sea in their own language, as per the comments above.</p>
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		<title>By: Bryce</title>
		<link>http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/01/08/sea-of-peace/#comment-62392</link>
		<dc:creator>Bryce</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Jan 2007 01:41:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/01/08/sea-of-peace/#comment-62392</guid>
		<description>*Sigh* I'm sure this has been discussed before, but here goes.

'Sea of Peace' is doublespeak. The problem with naming things after emotions or abstract political concepts is that irony slips in when the geography does not live up to its name. It may also cause some degree of confusion considering that the name of ocean on the other side of Japan is already a latinisation of the word 'peace'. 

'East Sea' is even more culturally biased than 'Sea of Japan'. It is obvious that for most Japanese, what we're talking about here is not in the East.

So what about 'Sea of Japan'? Well, as unpalatable as it my be to most Koreans, the only thing separating the East Sea from the Pacific is indeed the Japanese Archipelego. If Koreans have no problem with the bit of water that flows between Japan and Korea being called the Korea Straight, and I assume they don't, then they really should accept geographical reality.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>*Sigh* I&#8217;m sure this has been discussed before, but here goes.</p>
<p>&#8216;Sea of Peace&#8217; is doublespeak. The problem with naming things after emotions or abstract political concepts is that irony slips in when the geography does not live up to its name. It may also cause some degree of confusion considering that the name of ocean on the other side of Japan is already a latinisation of the word &#8216;peace&#8217;. </p>
<p>&#8216;East Sea&#8217; is even more culturally biased than &#8216;Sea of Japan&#8217;. It is obvious that for most Japanese, what we&#8217;re talking about here is not in the East.</p>
<p>So what about &#8216;Sea of Japan&#8217;? Well, as unpalatable as it my be to most Koreans, the only thing separating the East Sea from the Pacific is indeed the Japanese Archipelego. If Koreans have no problem with the bit of water that flows between Japan and Korea being called the Korea Straight, and I assume they don&#8217;t, then they really should accept geographical reality.</p>
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		<title>By: SomeguyinKorea</title>
		<link>http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/01/08/sea-of-peace/#comment-62389</link>
		<dc:creator>SomeguyinKorea</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Jan 2007 01:20:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rjkoehler.com/2007/01/08/sea-of-peace/#comment-62389</guid>
		<description>Pawi,

You need to learn to differentiate between personal attacks and racist comments.  Brendon's was a personal attack.  I really don't have to defend you, especially if you get out of your way to provoke it.  Racist comments are a different matter, especially if they are devoid of sarcasm or humour, such as yours.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Pawi,</p>
<p>You need to learn to differentiate between personal attacks and racist comments.  Brendon&#8217;s was a personal attack.  I really don&#8217;t have to defend you, especially if you get out of your way to provoke it.  Racist comments are a different matter, especially if they are devoid of sarcasm or humour, such as yours.</p>
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