Comments on: Africa and the Two Koreas http://www.rjkoehler.com/2006/09/13/africa-and-the-two-koreas/ Korea... in Blog Format Sun, 7 Sep 2008 04:37:41 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.6.1 By: snow http://www.rjkoehler.com/2006/09/13/africa-and-the-two-koreas/#comment-49226 snow Wed, 13 Sep 2006 14:22:51 +0000 http://www.rjkoehler.com/2006/09/13/africa-and-the-two-koreas/#comment-49226 "Soviet aid was effective" Aye, there's the rub. Without it, would any of these countries have gotten anywhere in the first place? “Soviet aid was effective”

Aye, there’s the rub. Without it, would any of these countries have gotten anywhere in the first place?

]]> By: sewing http://www.rjkoehler.com/2006/09/13/africa-and-the-two-koreas/#comment-49223 sewing Wed, 13 Sep 2006 14:01:08 +0000 http://www.rjkoehler.com/2006/09/13/africa-and-the-two-koreas/#comment-49223 I didn't get into an analysis of <i>why</i> Ghana's or South or Korea's economies have ended up the way they have, but seouldout's comment reminds us that emulating South Korea might require more than the blandishments of simply starting with export subsitution, moving into heavy industry, etc. In this regard, Mr. Agyekum comes across as having been somewhat naive (though in his defense, I'm sure his hosts conveniently glossed over or omitted inconvenient details like the fact that it took the drive (positive) and coercion (negative) of the Park Chung Hee regime to make the South's current state of affairs a reality). A couple of his commentors, however, did delve into details like that, and one really needs to read the comments to balance out the original article. I didn’t get into an analysis of why Ghana’s or South or Korea’s economies have ended up the way they have, but seouldout’s comment reminds us that emulating South Korea might require more than the blandishments of simply starting with export subsitution, moving into heavy industry, etc. In this regard, Mr. Agyekum comes across as having been somewhat naive (though in his defense, I’m sure his hosts conveniently glossed over or omitted inconvenient details like the fact that it took the drive (positive) and coercion (negative) of the Park Chung Hee regime to make the South’s current state of affairs a reality). A couple of his commentors, however, did delve into details like that, and one really needs to read the comments to balance out the original article.

]]> By: luke drift http://www.rjkoehler.com/2006/09/13/africa-and-the-two-koreas/#comment-49221 luke drift Wed, 13 Sep 2006 13:56:03 +0000 http://www.rjkoehler.com/2006/09/13/africa-and-the-two-koreas/#comment-49221 to add to sanshinseon's point - It's easy to forget that up until the mid-70s, at least, there existed a very real sense, amongst '2d World'/non-aligned countries, that it was possible to industrialize and raise standards of living through mutual cooperation, not on the terms set forth by the global financial institutions. N. Korea and Cuba for instance were sending civil engineers and doctors to help develop certain African countries, and N. Korea was also, for a period, in a position to offer interest-free loans to such nations as Ethiopia. to add to sanshinseon’s point - It’s easy to forget that up until the mid-70s, at least, there existed a very real sense, amongst ‘2d World’/non-aligned countries, that it was possible to industrialize and raise standards of living through mutual cooperation, not on the terms set forth by the global financial institutions. N. Korea and Cuba for instance were sending civil engineers and doctors to help develop certain African countries, and N. Korea was also, for a period, in a position to offer interest-free loans to such nations as Ethiopia.

]]> By: sanshinseon http://www.rjkoehler.com/2006/09/13/africa-and-the-two-koreas/#comment-49202 sanshinseon Wed, 13 Sep 2006 05:44:22 +0000 http://www.rjkoehler.com/2006/09/13/africa-and-the-two-koreas/#comment-49202 Re #2 shakuhachi: Keep in mind that right through the 1960s was richer per-capita in the South; they were well-industrialized and Soviet aid was effective; education, health care and other social-welfare-indicators were better. In most Communist countries (not including Southeast Asia), the first decade was usually pretty good, actually -- average standard of living climbed very well, most people lived better than they ever had, and the benefits spread quite fairly. It's what happens after the first decade or so that gives communism the bad reputation it now has... Re #2 shakuhachi:
Keep in mind that right through the 1960s was richer per-capita in the South; they were well-industrialized and Soviet aid was effective; education, health care and other social-welfare-indicators were better. In most Communist countries (not including Southeast Asia), the first decade was usually pretty good, actually — average standard of living climbed very well, most people lived better than they ever had, and the benefits spread quite fairly. It’s what happens after the first decade or so that gives communism the bad reputation it now has…

]]> By: michael http://www.rjkoehler.com/2006/09/13/africa-and-the-two-koreas/#comment-49197 michael Wed, 13 Sep 2006 04:54:03 +0000 http://www.rjkoehler.com/2006/09/13/africa-and-the-two-koreas/#comment-49197 seouldout, I thought you were talking about NORTH Korea until I got to No. 9. That's spot on man. seouldout, I thought you were talking about NORTH Korea until I got to No. 9. That’s spot on man.

]]> By: shakuhachi http://www.rjkoehler.com/2006/09/13/africa-and-the-two-koreas/#comment-49195 shakuhachi Wed, 13 Sep 2006 04:23:19 +0000 http://www.rjkoehler.com/2006/09/13/africa-and-the-two-koreas/#comment-49195 I am surprised that any African country could consider North Korea as a model for anything except on people control. I am surprised that any African country could consider North Korea as a model for anything except on people control.

]]> By: seouldout http://www.rjkoehler.com/2006/09/13/africa-and-the-two-koreas/#comment-49180 seouldout Wed, 13 Sep 2006 00:00:35 +0000 http://www.rjkoehler.com/2006/09/13/africa-and-the-two-koreas/#comment-49180 Mr. Agyekum, here's crib sheet. 1) Have a repressive regime with a legal system that forbids everything unless the very thin law book says otherwise. And crack skulls frequently. 2) Cultivate "we wuz victimized". The sacrifices the people will make to rights wrongs are immeasurable. 3) Get your women folk in the factories and keep them there 14 hours a day. 4) Beg, borrow and steal any technology you can get you hands on. 5) School up the kiddies with rote memorization and obedience. 6) Find a deep-pocketed benefactor who will defend you, pour in economic aid, and buy the stuff you manufacture. Even better if the benefactor looks the other way when the warehouses are emptied and the goods enter the black market. 7) Send your troops overseas for big money. But don't let anyone else go overseas because it's just a waste of money. 8) Limit population growth. Penalize those who have more than 2 kids. And export your surplus population. 9) On the weekends fly in Japanese engineers to consult on advanced manufacturing processes. Pay them a lot, but have a sex industry in place so that they don't take all that money back to Japan with them. 10) Place loudspeakers throughout the country to wake everyone up at 5AM. No more of this morning calm nonsense; there's work to be done. Mr. Agyekum, here’s crib sheet.
1) Have a repressive regime with a legal system that forbids everything unless the very thin law book says otherwise. And crack skulls frequently.
2) Cultivate “we wuz victimized”. The sacrifices the people will make to rights wrongs are immeasurable.
3) Get your women folk in the factories and keep them there 14 hours a day.
4) Beg, borrow and steal any technology you can get you hands on.
5) School up the kiddies with rote memorization and obedience.
6) Find a deep-pocketed benefactor who will defend you, pour in economic aid, and buy the stuff you manufacture. Even better if the benefactor looks the other way when the warehouses are emptied and the goods enter the black market.
7) Send your troops overseas for big money. But don’t let anyone else go overseas because it’s just a waste of money.
8) Limit population growth. Penalize those who have more than 2 kids. And export your surplus population.
9) On the weekends fly in Japanese engineers to consult on advanced manufacturing processes. Pay them a lot, but have a sex industry in place so that they don’t take all that money back to Japan with them.
10) Place loudspeakers throughout the country to wake everyone up at 5AM. No more of this morning calm nonsense; there’s work to be done.

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