You’ll be relieved to know that according to her dad, Michelle Wie is completely Korean:
Michelle Wie’s father Wie Byung-wook, a professor of transportation at the University of Hawaii, agreed to a telephone interview with the Chosun Ilbo on Thursday.
“I’m well aware there that some say, since Michelle Wie is an American why is she making such a fuss. But you know what, the only thing about her that’s American is her passport, she is “definitely” Korean.” The golfer’s favorite dish is “rice with pork Kimchi soup with extra tofu and toasted seaweed on the side.” Her mouth waters when she hears about Bossam (boiled pork) or steamed codfish, and Soondae (Korean sausage) and Deokbokki (broiled rice pasta with Korean chilli paste sauce). She may have been born in America but her first words were Korean, and she did not start learning English until after she was attending school.
But perhaps this is just the way of the future:
Wie cannot forget the time when she played golf with former president Bill Clinton at the end of October of last year. Clinton reportedly told Wie that she would be a leader for minorities in America in the future, and in the near future the U.S. will be a country where the minorities become majority.
187 Comments
Nice to see immigrants integrate so well into their foster country. Maybe uscis could do something about her passport?
And in a “completely Korean” household, the father always speaks for the womenfolk.
That’s how older first generation Korean immigrants think. Why is this news? But I bet you Michelle Wie doesn’t think the same way.
Well said, slim. Almost wonder if M feels embarassed at what father is saying.
Here he is:
http://www.tim.hawaii.edu/abou.....file=bjwie
I saw her on Letterman a while back, and she had impressive poise for any 15-year-old, and arguably more than I would expect from an ROK college co-ed.
So what?
Why should Michelle Wie deny the Korean side of her heritage?
Is there something wrong with this?
If he had said, “She is Hawaiian” it would have made more sense.
I don’t follow her much, or the stuff about her father, but this is the first thing I’ve read that made me give him a big thumbs down.
From what little I’ve heard from Tiger Woods and his parents, he seems to have a better handle on things when it comes to race or ethnic identity.
But, who really cares?
They play golf well.
They need to do some things spectacular off the grass to warrant something more than a lot of kudos for being great at golf.
If this were Jackie Robinson in the American culture of that era breaking into MLB, well, that’s different, isn’t it.
…but this is the first thing I’ve read that made me give him a big thumbs down.
Well, what’s wrong with it then? I’m genuinely curious.
I certainly had no doubt she would be proud of her Korean heritage and have no complaints whatsoever with that.
But I wonder why the Chosun needs reassuring on this (or feel the Korean nation needs it). And why not talk to Michelle herself, instead of her father?
I guess if Korea had quality journalism or even unremarkably ordinary journalism, many blogs would almost be out of business.
@Bluejives: Did you read what Dad said? He didn’t simply acknowledge Michelle’s Korean heritage. He negated her entire life spent growing up in the US by saying, “The only thing about her that’s American is her passport.” Seems like Dad is appealing to the baser elements of Korean nationalism to make his daughter more attractive to advertisers in Korea.
Robert,
It would be interesting to know exactly what was said in Korean. I did a search at the Chosun Ilbo and couldn’t find a Korean version of the story. If there is a Korean version, could you provide a link?
“The only thing about Robert Kim that’s American is his passport” — and, one hopes, his prison rape ‘roids!
I like reading Slim’s comments. Always short and sweet.
It seems that gypos are often looked down on in Korea society until one of them is successful, and then he or she is welcomed back into the fold.
gbevers: I would disagree with that observation in part.
From what I’ve experienced, being a gyopo who lived in Korea for 5 years, gyopos are not looked down upon, but are very much envied, especially successful gyopos. Many Koreans would love to go overseas to become gyopos themselves (just look at the number of language hagwons on any given street). If there is any disdain for gyopos by domestic Koreans, it is rooted in envy, exacerbated by the gyopos who come back to Korea to flaunt their successes.
However, I’ve encountered very little animosity in Korea, personally. You’d have to come across as an arrogrant American prick to get people of your own ethnicity to hate you for being a gyopo. In spite of myself, the domestic Koreans were very forgiving of my cultural gaffes and were eager to educate me about Korean culture. And unlike with white foreigners, gyopos actually have a great chance at being accepted into the social “inner circle”. However, this is where I agree with you. Gyopos, especially English-speaking 2nd generation gyopos, are not immediately accepted and are viewed as outsiders. However, given time (success in the name of the fatherland definitely speeds things up), they are eventually accepted as one of their own.
The only time I’ve ever been berated in Korea for being a gyopo was by a taxi cab driver who lectured me throughout the trip that people who look Korean should be able to speak Korean, no matter where they lived. He wasn’t being mean, but as I was a middle schooler at the time, so his age superiority gave him some leeway in being so forward.
errr. I meant “looked down upon” not “looked upon”.
Two words: Hines Ward. Two more: Christina Kim. Final two words: Ed Bradley.
BJ Wie saw Hines Ward’s trip to Korea, and all the adulation, endorsements, presidential meetings, endorsements, first pitches, endorsements, media throng, endorsements, and also endorsements…and he decided that the easiest way to suck money out of Korean companies and guarantee another revenue stream is to play to Korean nationalism and “oneness” like a fiddle…laughing all the way to the bank.
The easiest way to do that is to rattle off a list of Korean foods, tv shows, and music….”Oh, Michelle likes soondae! She’s just like me! You mean she enjoys kimchi chiggye and hates pizza and hamburgers! Wie likes watching talent get beat with rubber hammers on X-Men? Me too! Where do I purchase the products she endorses!?!?! DAE HAN MINGUK!!!”
BJ Wie is not only fully in control, but you can bet that he’s dealt with the Korean press long enough to know which buttons to push to keep the suckers fawning and throwing cash at his family.
When Wie is in Japan, he’ll be telling the Japanese press about how much she loves Japanese food and studies Japanese because it’s her “favorite.” In fact, if you watched the 60 minutes piece on her a few weeks ago, Ed Bradley talked more about Wie’s love of Japan and her study of the Japanese language than they did about anything Korean.
And when he’s speaking to a gaggle of American reporters, he’ll tell them how proud Michelle is to be American and that there’s nothing in the world she values more than her American passport, American friends, American education, American food, and all things American. Ask Ed Bradley. When the bit about Michelle loving Japan was over, they went through a full segment about Michelle being a “typical American teenager,” hanging out at the mall, getting her drivers license, gossiping with friends, eating fast food, going to high school dances.
His daughter is a virtual ATM, spitting out money wherever she goes, and you can be damn sure that he’ll tug the heart strings of whoever the nationality of the day is to keep the money flowing. It just so happens that tugging the Korean strings is easier and produces Pavlovian reactions much faster than any other.
I’m sure he also learned a valuable lessons from the beating that Christina Kim (Korean-American golfer) took from the Korean media when she dared to say that she was proud to play for the American team in the Solheim Cup and wore an American flag buff while she was playing. That poor woman was reduced to tears from the flood of criticism and shit she took from Korean reporters calling her a traitor because of her “American” behavior and her fashion choice of wearing the Stars and Stripes.
When Michelle plays for the USA in the Solheim Cup, BJ will be speaking out both sides of his mouth. On one side he’ll be telling Jim Lampley “what an honor it is for his daughter to play for America.” And out of the other side he’ll be telling the Chosun Ilbo that “Michelle is representing Koreans on an international scale and making them proud. And PS…she ate kimchi for breakfast and listened to Rain on her IRiver! Oh my!”
IRiver?
Oh, never mind.
I could not agree more, iheartblueballs.
Dad and Mom are going to have a hard time reining in their freespeaking American gal (re: Ed Bradley). I can just imagine the ire of the ajjushis when Michelle gloats about beating them silly on the golf courses.
Unfortunately, most “netizens” on naver don’t buy Mr. Wie’s claim. Just to get the record straight, Christina Kim was criticized not because of her American behavior, but because South Koreans thought that she (or her parents) was taking advantage of Koreans by playing the Korean card in Korea while being American. The same goes with Yoo Seungjoon, or Steve Yoo. Hines Ward, on the other hand, had no intention of making profits in South Korea by claiming to be (culturally) Korean, and there’s an enormous amount of sense of guilt attached to his case in the South Korean mindset..
“The only thing about Robert Kim that’s American is his passport” — and, one hopes, his prison rape ‘roids!
In the American correctional system they allow steroids to faciliate prison rape? That doesn’t seem particularly advisable.
Pretty stupid stuff, and pretty standard.
This guy’s slicker than “Slick Willy.”
Wouldn’t surprise me if this is all just a publicity stunt to suck up to Korean endorsement deals.
‘Enjoy watching her though. Great drama at Nabisco Championships, if anyone happened to catch it. I believe she’s going to be playing at a Korean Event, coming up. Fun to watch. She was featured on “60 Minutes” recently.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KhGPdVmbVYk
http://www.mylpga.com/forum/viewforum.php?f=15
“In the American correctional system they allow steroids to faciliate prison rape? That doesn’t seem particularly advisable.”
They do. Its horrible but probably acts as a deterrent to crime as well.
Replace any references to Ed Bradley above with Steve Kroft. I got the Tiger and Wie interviews cornfused.
At least Bluejives can brag about how similar he is to Wie now. You know…the only thing American about them both are their passports. I just wonder if Michelle sleeps with her passport under her pillow like ol jivesy does, and if she denigrates Americans as arrogant morons like bluej has been known to do.
No wonder jivesy likes her so much…he’s secretly hoping she’s part of the “Hate America but cling to the blue passport like a teddy bear” club that he’s so proud to be a part of.
Oops. Missed the bit about steriods. I mean regular homosexual rape.
Oh, crap. Only a bunch of prominent Korean Americans loudly and publicly expressing their undying devotion and unwavering loyalty to America could possibly counteract this idiotic, ethno-centric, patently racist blather (racist because he assumes, or at least exploits the assumption, that anyone of Korean or Asian descent can’t “really” be American). Of course, you can count the number of influential or famous Korean Americans on one hand, barely. Actually, Michelle Wie is probably just about it. Crap. How many people actually know that former high-ranking DOJ and State officials like John Yoo and Harold Koh just happen to be of Korean descent? Maybe five?
I have a dream, that one day an American of Korean descent will become a cultural icon in the U.S. and internationally. He will say things that will really piss off the Korean press and excitable Koreans in general. And in time, people will stop asking us where we “really come from”. I have a dream today. (Of course, if I’m dreaming about this, we’ve come a long way since the 60’s.)
My only consolation is that blogs like this and the Chosunilbo have a miniscule, neglibile readership (wishful thinking?). The MSM better not pick up on this. The Korean American “community”, however, needs to get medieval on Mr. Wie and anybody else like him. Thank you, Mr. Wie, for making life as an American minority just a bit more harrowing.
Words like his, and the words of others like him, will come back to bite everybody in the ass if Al Qaeda ever starts recruiting in S. Korea, if they’re not doing so already. But like Cassandra, my warnings remain unheeded…
If he had said, “She is Hawaiian” it would have made more sense.
I’m not sure how long he’s lived in Hawaii, but I’m sure his daughter would not have let him say that. In Hawaii, there are clear distinctions between “Hawaiians” (the ethnic natives) and people who grew up and live there. There’s also a big difference between Korean Americans in the mainland and a Korean American raised in Hawaii.
Why are some of you folks so harsh on her, anyway? If I was that young, could hit a ball with a stick real well AND get paid for it… I’d be all over that marketing cash. Real estate in Hawaii is expensive!
Direct quote from the 60 minutes piece:
(Steve Kroft): To her friends at Punaho High, she’s just another junior. (White American female friend):”She lives her life just like us. We all go to the movies, we all go shopping. Even if she’s halfway around the world, text messages. We text a lot.”
Funny, her friends didn’t say “We’re all Americans, but Michelle is definitely Korean. We eat pizza, and she eats soondae. We go to American movies, and she will only watch Korean dramas. We shop at the Gap, and she shops separately at Korean markets.”
Lesson #1 here: BJ Wie is a douchebag.
I guarantee if he gave Michelle a choice between…
(A) Living in an apartment in Kangnam, not being able to drive or have a car, going to a Korean high school and hakwons 16 hours a day, not dating, having her hair cut like a bowl by her Korean teacher, wearing school uniforms all day, looking forward to SNU, and hanging out at COEX with her green Korean passport…
or
(B) Living on a massive estate in a mansion in Hawaii, driving her convertible, going to an American high school, going to prom and dating, wearing hot-ass dresses on Letterman, hanging out at the beach, looking forward to Stanford, and hanging out in San Francisco with her blue American passport…
…not a solitary chance in hell she considers (A) for a nano-second.
She’ll be “definitely Korean” from the time she steps off the plane at Incheon, during the 4-5 days she’s in Korea collecting checks, and during her walk through the airport on her way home. The rest of her life, she’s an American, whether BJ likes it or not. Show her the life of the average “definitely Korean” teenage girl, and she’ll run back to her American high school, freedom, and friends in the blink of an eye.
Just like you’d never see Hines Ward wearing a hanbok in Pittsburgh, you’ll never see Michelle Wie wearing one in Honolulu. They’ll wear one in Seoul and play the returning son or daughter if, and only if, they get paid. They’re Koreans for hire only, and anyone that believes they’d take the full-time job with all it entails, is a fool.
I seem to remember baduk laying down quite a screed on another post about how patriotic and devoted Korean Americans are to America. I wonder how he and other KA’s (who have to defend themselves against the perception that Robert Kim was only speaking the unwritten rule of loyalty to the motherland and that a majority of KA’s really feel the same way) are going to react to BJ Wie promoting opportunistic passport nationalism.
When BJ made the “The only thing American about her is her passport” statement, a decent reporter for the Chosun Ilbo would have responded with “Well if her passport is the only thing standing in the way of her becoming Korean, why not trade blue for green?” But we all know that “decent” and “Korean reporter” go together like oil and water.
In fact I’ve asked ol jivesy the same question about the blue for green trade if his principles are so strong and us arrogant, moronic Americans are too much for him to handle, but he’s refused to answer that prickly conundrum, just as I’m sure BJ would refuse. BJ wouldn’t trade Honolulu for Seoul, not a chance. Actions, as jivesy well knows, speak louder than words.
Kushibo:
“The only thing about Robert Kim that’s American is his passport” — and, one hopes, his prison rape ‘roids!
In the American correctional system they allow steroids to faciliate prison rape? That doesn’t seem particularly advisable.”
Earth to Kushibo (and Shakuhachi): The ‘roids in question are the ones on which you apply a soothing ointment.
Who’s the bigger asshole? The father who insists his daughter is Korean or the anonymous expat who insists she isnt? It’s pretty much a mirror hypocrisy, no? Well, at least BJ Wie is her father after all and can vouch for his own flesh and blood. What the heck does a nobody like BlueBalls here feel the need to get his panties all in a twist for anyway? If BlueBalls is so patriotic and turning Red White and Blue in the face, what the heck is he doing in Korea in the first place? Am I the only one who sees the irony in all this?
iheartblueballs:
You are hilarious. Only reason why I come here. So what is your connection to Korea?
Anyway, I think there are some KA’s who definately have inferiority complex.
Personally, I have no hangups about being a Korean-American. I mean, If I had to choose between Korea and America, I’d have to choose America. I’m not an idiot.
OK at first this really made my blood boil until someone pointed out to me that:
a) Her father isn’t too well-liked in the world of golf in the first place.
b) He’s just taking the easy route when it comes to marketing his daughter for Korean endorsements
and
c) I’m sure he probably emphasizes how American she is when he’s fishing for endorsements with US companies.
Don’t get me wrong, what he said was wrong and insulting but if you look at the source it’s coming from, I guess we should just dismiss this as a worthless comment coming from a worthless human being.
If I were Michelle, I’d find myself a new spokesman and tell Daddy to stay on the sidelines.
Clarification: When I say “sidelines” I mean stay out of her golfing affairs and just be a supportive dad, not an obnoxious prick. I realize he is no longer her caddy and literally does watch from behind the ropes.
regarding kA’s definitely having “inferiority complex”
what makes you so uniquely qualified to make such an assertion ? If certain people have low self esteem, they have low self esteem.. And if they happen to be of a korean heritage, they have a complex ?.. then, you must have shit for brains complex.
Hey, I’ve lived in ny for almost thirty years. Having said that…I can honestly say..the only thing american about me, is my u.s passport.. I’ve shredded my u.s citizenship document..gleefuly. bunch of racist pigs.
and to some of you who makes those snide comments about trading a blue for a green… I say, who the flock are you ?
and my parting words to all of those who has passed judgement on b.j wie based on a heavily edited article written by a junior writer… get a life. bunch of friggin losers. Go and flock yourself why don’t you ?
The answer to that question will always be bluejives, unless the alternative is nulji.
No. BJ Wie gave up green for blue. He took an oath. If he didn’t believe the oath, he shouldn’t have taken it. If he doesn’t believe it now, go the fuck back to green. Everything he and his family have he owes to blue. If he thinks Michelle attains Tiger-like status and money growing up in Korea, he’s a fool. And if BJ doesn’t appreciate what kind of riches the land of opportunity brought he and his daughter, he ought to go the fuck back to green. And if, like jives, he insists on clinging to blue while simultaneously denigrating it and all it stands for, he should expect to be called to the carpet for being the ungrateful fuckwad that he is. Just like my pal jives.
Funny that Michelle and her friends don’t agree with that vouching. BJ knows where his daughter’s bread gets buttered, and it’s not anywhere near Korea.
Because the only thing worse than blueness of the balls is straightness of the panties.
Easy. I’m not in Korea in the first place. You’d think you’d have picked that fact up the first hundred times I said it. I don’t live there.
Seeing as how I don’t live in Korea and there’s no irony involved, the answer to your question is yes. You’re the only one dumb enough to see irony where none exists.
That offer of blue for green is still out there jivesy ol chap. Your motherland desperately needs you in its battle against the evil expat. Why do you insist on turning your back on your brothers and sisters in their time of need in favor of cavorting with arrogant morons in the land of the Big Mac? Tangun is crying in his soju as we speak at the thought of your betrayal.
Seems the old man may want to check with his daughter before he goes listing her Korean bonafides, because he’s looking more foolish by the minute.
BJ Wie, professional douchebag: “But you know what, the only thing about her that’s American is her passport, she is “definitely” Korean.”
Michelle Wie: “I’m very proud of who I am, being a Korean-American and being a (Hawai’i) citizen and American citizen. I’m very proud of that.”
http://the.honoluluadvertiser......60365.html
BJ Wie, professional douchebag: “She may have been born in America but her first words were Korean, and she did not start learning English until after she was attending school.”
Michelle Wie: “I learned most of the letters of the alphabet before I turned 1 and learned to read before I turned 2. My parents are so proud of that. My very first memory is going down by the pool in the apartment where we lived and reading the sign that said, “Warning: Don’t dive.” I didn’t know what it meant, but I could read it and knew it had something to do with danger.”
http://www.golfdigest.com/feat.....yshot.html
Funny that BJ thinks that Koreans will look more favorably on Michelle if they believe that she only learned English as a last resort for school. Unfortunately, it’s a lie. Or maybe Michelle’s brain has been implanted with false memories by an evil Japanese scientist.
Oh give me a break, you’re too much.
There is no celestial mandate which states that a Korean-American cannot profess affinity for the motherland. If that threatens you, that’s your problem.
If you’re so concerned about traitors, take a good look at the Benedict Arnold CEOs and the politicians, they’re doing a fine job of selling out America already!
This is better than Comedy Channel.
I think you’re off the mark here, bluejives, and sonagi nailed it with: “He didn’t simply acknowledge Michelle’s Korean heritage. He negated her entire life spent growing up in the US…”
Noone questioned her loyalties or her right to claim her heritage — it is the shameless pandering by aboji and (to me, at least) the Chosun’s shoddy reporting and onanistic nationalism that are the issues here. Michelle will no doubt do fine in her life, but I have to think that an ordinary Korean-American trying to make his/her way in society would be appalled by a blowhard father making those kind of remarks about the passport.
Robert and Oranckay I believe both translated for the Chosun in recent times. Aren’t there any overseers of the English website who can step in and say of these dubious stories: “This is shite!”?
And there’s also no celestial mandate which states that I can’t call you or BJ Wie ungrateful douchebags worthy of deportation for taking all the benefits of the passport and then trashing the country, people, and principles behind it while professing your “affinity for the motherland,” be it for profit in Wie’s case, or just for pure hatred of America and Americans in yours.
Just a reminder, because some of you obviously need it: “I hereby declare, on oath, that I absolutely and entirely renounce and abjure all allegiance and fidelity to any foreign prince, potentate, state, or sovereignty of whom or which I have heretofore been a subject or citizen; that I will support and defend the Constitution and laws of the United States of America against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; that I will bear arms on behalf of the United States when required by the law; that I will perform noncombatant service in the Armed Forces of the United States when required by the law; that I will perform work of national importance under civilian direction when required by the law; and that I take this obligation freely without any mental reservation or purpose of evasion; so help me God.”
iheartblueballs,
I agree with you. KAs are Americans and we have to and we will bear arms against Koreans.
I have said this a few posts back and some asked me how?
Well, whatever you and other Koreans may think, KoreanAmericans are not much different from ItalianAmericans, PolishAmericans or IrishAmericans.
When the WWII broke, ItalianAmericans enlist in the U.S. military and fought and killed Italian soldiers in Italy. When Poland became a satellite of USSR, PolishAmericans were loyal to America.
The same thing. We, KAs, have different skin colors but we are Americans. Our parents are here in Good Ol’ USA and our women and children live here. We are Americans, red,white and blue. Apple Pie and Baseball and all. We are not white, but within 20 years, the U.S. will not be white, either.
So, don’t bring up Wie’s father selling her daughter to Korean press or stupid acts of Robert Kim.
Think of about 20 Koreans dead in the 9/11 incident and KAs serving in Iraq. Yes, we are Americans!
Sperwer wrote:
Earth to Sperwer: I was making a joke, albeit an indiscernibly opaque one. Yes, ‘roids can refer to hemmorhoids, which someone might get if subjected to Ozian treatment in a correctional facility. But it also commonly refers to steroids, which someone in a correction facility probably should not be taking.
I, myself, have served in the U.S. Navy as an officer for four challenging years. I am grateful for the U.S. government for giving me the opportunity to serve the greatest nation on earth.
I am loyal to the U.S.A.
And, I will kill Koreans if they join up with China or Japan and attack America. I will be shouting as Japanese American soldier did at Pearl Harbor, “Praise the Lord and pass the ammunition”. He was shooting at Jap Zeroes.
I am an American, a KoreanAmerican with stress in the second part.
This is a funny thread. We need more people like iheartblueballs.
The great, unprecedented, dynamic melting pot that is America only exists because ethno-centric nationalists make up a tiny minority within a minority within a minority (or majority if you’re talking about Caucasians). Otherwise, in a hundred years, we’d end up looking like the Balkans. What the Wie article conveys has nothing to do with acknowledging or even respecting one’s ethnic heritage. This is all about playing the race/nationalist card for opportunistic gain, which is morally reprehensible.
Baduk–Amen to that. But, trust me, you’ll have to repeat yourself incessantly for the rest of your life and most of your efforts will be in vain. Even if you had access to a nation-wide press conference to air your views, it still wouldn’t matter. People find racial stereotypes comforting. Complex, nuanced thought is difficult for most people. Simplify, simplify. For any minority (ethnic and otherwise), the bad apples in the group always get far more attention than the vast majority of good ones. Things won’t change until there are so many Asian Americans that the stigma of being viewed as the “perpetual foreigner” begins to die away.
That said, it’s rather disturbing that we have to go to great lengths to convince some of our fellow Americans that we’re willing to kill the enemy, regardless of what he looks like, in order to defend the U.S. and U.S. interests. Talk about morbid, and sad. As if being white guaranteed loyalty to the U.S. Two words: Timothy McVeigh.
Assimilation/integration is a two-way street, so I wonder when people will stop making incredibly offensive assumptions about Americans with Korean or Asian faces. The only thing worse than getting your ass kicked or being called one of the many colorful racial epithets in our collective lexicon, is having your loyalty questioned just because you don’t “look” American.
It looks like Koreans tend to be proud about their blood more than the Japanese. Generally, we don’t know about Eric Shinseki, nor Norman Mineta because they are not reported
in the media (I’ve spent some years in the states, that’s why I happen to know).
In Japan, we have the same sort of problem about Korean immigrants especially who have a North Korean nationality; the “Chosen Soren” which is group connected with North Korean has cooperated in kidnapping Japanese citezens.
I really don’t care about peoples’ nationalities but I wish
them to be loyal to where they have moved and most Koreans in Japan are likely to be immigrants or refugees(of the Korean war). A good example is Sadaharu Oh, although he is still a Taiwanese but has let the Japanese teams win the WBC.
The police have been investigating “Chosen Soren” and cities are not giving favorable tax rates any more. Of course I don’t mean anyone who has a North Korean nationality should be kicked out from Japan; I just want them to love Japan because they came here by their own will.
Michelle Wie is hardly Robert Kim.
I read an article on naver news recently about Wie and many of the comments from “netizens” were quite vicious. I think it’s quite possible that her father is merely trying to defuse some of that sentiment that exists among some Koreans that Wie has not acknowledged her Korean heritage.
As long as she keeps playing well, who cares? More power to her.
Don’t be an idiot. Professor Yoo is certainly well known, and not just by Boalt graduates. A lot of us heard of Harold Koh years ago. For that matter, Ronald Moon is also a prominent figure.
Ah well, that’s still one hand. I have high hopes for nulji and bluejives to break through though.
I’m going to have to say this again.
McVeigh, horrible as his actions were, had as his goal the betterment of the U.S. He did not act in the interests of a foreign power.
Robert Kim’s loyalty was to a foreign nation, South Korea.
Baduk: “Koreans are smarter than you.”
Dogbert says:
“I read an article on naver news recently about Wie and many of the comments from “netizens” were quite vicious. I think it’s quite possible that her father is merely trying to defuse some of that sentiment that exists among some Koreans that Wie has not acknowledged her Korean heritage.”
Then shame on her old man for pandering to such people. If he were really smart, he’d blast the danilminjok crowd, while simply acknowledging both whatever he thinks worthwhile about his ethnic heritage and the opportunities afforded to both himself and his daughter by the States. In anything except the millimeter run, that would also serve his commercial interests better too.
The Korean language article on “sports and entertainment” pages of Chosun:
“I guess if Korea had quality journalism or even unremarkably ordinary journalism, many blogs would almost be out of business.”
Agreed. Perhaps the American government would pressure the Korean counterpart to open up the media market at the FTA talks, and then they may be able to lift the game gradually, benefiting both countries.
Dogbertt,
It is not right that you qoute me out of context, typical journalism trick to make someone look bad.
I still don’t understand your logic about Tim McVeigh. Do you know how many people died in Oklahoma bombing? Yet, you want to make him look better than Robert Kim who leaked some worthless information to Korean Navy.
So, in your logic, you will be happy if someone blows up your home and kill your family as long as he thinks he did for America? Let me introduce you to some Skinheads or Aryan Nation people. They “l-o-o-v-e” America, so much so that they will kill anyone who, they think, is not an American. Mainly people with different skin color. You seem to have the same attitude.
Why make a great deal about it? And why people here felt offended for such a thing? Doesn’t he have the right to say which nationality they are from or are you trying to steal their nationality?
don’t Italians or Irish who are US citizens tout much of their heritage as well? They seem to consider themselves more Italian or Irish than American, in my opinion. It’s an ethinic minority thing, not being part of the Anglo Saxon clan. Let it pass. No big deal.
@Earth to Kushibo, Shakuhachi, and Sperwer:
I got your pun the first time, Kushibo. Nice one!
@Antti:
Thanks for posting the original quote, which was translated accurately into English.
@Katz and Bluejives:
Michelle Wie and her dad have US citizenship, so their nationality is American. Dad, in fact, took an oath of loyalty in order to become an American. He can speak for himself, but he is wrong to speak for his daughter, and it is shameful that in his daughter’s name, he would spit on adopted country, the country where his daughter was born and raised. As evidence of his daughter’s Korean identity , he cites her early exposure to Korean and her love of Korean food. How trite that something as profound and complex as one’s national identity is reduced down to eating “bossam.” I love to express myself in the Korean language and eat Korean food, but that does not make me Korean.
His daughter is a highly successful golfer who can look forward to lucrative marketing contracts in North America. Dad didn’t need to sell out his wealthy daughter.
I didn’t make it through the last 1/3rd of the comments.
I can’t remember the person who wrote about society in Hawaii, but it is well worth reading.
Hawaii is a very unique place. I can’t speak for the other islands beyond Oahu and the Honolulu area, but growing up in Hawaii is very different from growing up anywhere else in the US.
That is why I said if he had said she thinks of herself as more Hawaiian than American it might make more sense, but still wouldn’t since they consider Hawaiians to be real ethnic Hawaiians rather than being born there.
Hawaii has such a big mix of all kinds of ethnic groups, and it has a somewhat typical beach and warm climate mentality, it is just unique in the US.
But from what I saw, the older generations of immigrants, especially those who came to the US, would be more likely to get pissed off if you told them they were not American than say they weren’t.
And with the 2nd and 3rd generations, many of the ones I knew treated their ethnicity not too much unlike an Italian or Irish guy born several generations into American society.
I actually can’t remember meeting a Blue Jives in Hawaii, and I met a lot of Koreans there. I did meet one, but he was from Texas and there for university —- [his email was "unification1"]……and I met a few of him while I was in Korea.
Re: dogbertt’s comments
1)
I sincerely doubt the general public is as familiar with John Yoo, et al., as it is with Michelle Wie. Most people, for that matter, probably wouldn’t know who sits on the Supreme Court or whatnot, because what news junkies may consider “common knowledge” is not so common for the average American.
2)
“McVeigh, horrible as his actions were, had as his goal the betterment of the U.S. He did not act in the interests of a foreign power.”
-And? What McVeigh did was still, by definition, treason. You can act in your own interest or in accordance with an ideology and still commit treason. Also, the “betterment of the U.S.” for whom? What exactly was his goal? What’s your view of his goal? (Really, as you’ve pointed out, I’m an idiot, so enlighten me.)
3)
Since you bring up Robert Kim (again), why are you so obsessed with this guy? Most people (even most Korean Americans), don’t even know who he is, and the majority of those who do surely have no sympathy for the guy.
dogbertt:”Ah well, that’s still one hand. I have high hopes for nulji and bluejives to break through though.”
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Actually, there are many Korean-American/Canadian Actors on TV these days.
http://img203.imageshack.us/my.....k2b3nt.jpg
iheartblueballs wrote:
As someone who was born and raised in the U.S., I could swear to this oath, subject to some slight personal interpretation. That is, I get to define who my foreign enemies are, and I get to define who my domestic enemies are.
I have to do a similar personal interpretation when I recite the Pledge of Allegiance weekly. (Don’t ask. You’ll find out when you join a Toastmasters club in the U.S.) All around me, people are pledging allegiance to a piece of cloth, but I’m pledging allegiance to my family, friends, and neighbors. Then again, maybe everyone reserves the right to do their own personal interpretations of oaths and pledges. For democracy’s sake, I hope so.
Later,
kpmsprtd
Reposting because of lost quote. (I used some apparently illegal characters.)
iheartblueballs wrote:
“Just a reminder, because some of you obviously need it: “I hereby declare, on oath, that I absolutely and entirely renounce and abjure all allegiance and fidelity to any foreign prince, potentate, state, or sovereignty of whom or which I have heretofore been a subject or citizen; that I will support and defend the Constitution and laws of the United States of America against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; that I will bear arms on behalf of the United States when required by the law; that I will perform noncombatant service in the Armed Forces of the United States when required by the law; that I will perform work of national importance under civilian direction when required by the law; and that I take this obligation freely without any mental reservation or purpose of evasion; so help me God.””
As someone who was born and raised in the U.S., I could swear to this oath, subject to some slight personal interpretation. That is, I get to define who my foreign enemies are, and I get to define who my domestic enemies are.
I have to do a similar personal interpretation when I recite the Pledge of Allegiance weekly. (Don’t ask. You’ll find out when you join a Toastmasters club in the U.S.) All around me, people are pledging allegiance to a piece of cloth, but I’m pledging allegiance to my family, friends, and neighbors. Then again, maybe everyone reserves the right to do their own personal interpretations of oaths and pledges. For democracy’s sake, I hope so.
Later,
kpmsprtd
USA reminds me of the French Soccer Team. All the white people are missing.
http://www.stormfront.org/foru.....ost2907871
2000 years ago, the Apostle Paul identified himself first and foremost a Jew and a Pharisee. When he spoke to fellow Jews, he spoke in Aramaic; when he spoke to Roman officials, he spoke Greek. His Roman citizenship became relevant only after he was arrested. It meant that he was entitled to a trial. It was just a legal status.
Whether in the Roman Empire of the past or the American Empire of today, citizenship is just a legal document. A passport is just a legal document. As long as you pay your tax and obey the law, Caesar or the Feddle Gummint, doesnt give a crap.
How one choose how to identify himself is entirely a matter of free will. That’s all I have to say about that.
This seems like such a simple concept that it seems strange that I have to be the one who says it.
If some immigrants take an oath of loyalty to a country and accept the benefits of citzenship but are not prepared to accept the responsibilities of being a citizen, then it puts a sour feeling in a lot of people’s mouths.
An expat in a foreign country does not qualify in the same way. Sure an ex-pat is living somewhere and making a living, but he or she never claimed that he would give his loyalty to that host country. As a counsequence he or she does not have the full rights of a citizen and can more or less be arbitraily expelled by the officials. He or she is not obligated to do military service but he or she also cannot participate in shaping the laws that he or she lives under through the practice of voting and will face all sorts of legal discrimination.
If Michelle’s Wie’s father spoke in Korean at home, and wanted to keep his daughter constantly exposed to Korean culture, in society that claims to be open and liberal that should be fine. But if his claims are true and has no intention of even trying to integrate, then it would seem he has lied and used the system to make his family rich. All he is doing is bragging that he rejects integrating with any part of American society. No that he cannot be expelled from the country why should anyone be happy with that?
Are you saying that Korea should accept as citzens people who only want the passport so that it is easier to make money? Should Korea accept as citizens with full rights, people who reject everything about your society and culture. Should they be happy when prominant immigrants who have obtained citizenship now basically say that they lied and tricked you?
Well, Blueballs, you’re wrong again, but why should that come as a surprise?
This sort of thing is precisely why we Koreans will never be popular internationally and have no right to demand anything of the legal process in the US. If you don’t participate in the society you have no right to demand anything of it - that is the basic process of democracy.
Yet we Koreans have really made out like bandits in American society. We live in our own communities and take our driver’s license tests in Korean and the parents of our wealthiy enterpreneurs collect welfare and are covered by medicaid.
I was watching a program this morning featuring a Korean “supermodel” and was struck by the pretentious misappropriation of the term. She must be internationally famous, earning a 7-figure salary and sought after by the world’s most lucrative corporations. In other words, there are basic standards for a supermodel that no Korean model has every met. This is why there are virtually no known Korean celebrities abroad although there are numerous ones of Chinese, Japanese and other origins.
Michelle’s father is just another racist Korean reactionary with pretentions of rarified purity who disdains mixing with the dirty outside races. Kind of like Blueballs.
Kushibo wrote:
Earth to Sperwer: I was making a joke, albeit an indiscernibly opaque one.
Kushibo:
Don’t give up your day job chasing the gig at the Comedy Club.
By the way, Blueballs refers to the appropriately named Bluejives, famous for his self-important Korean suprecism -not the satirist with a similar name.
Baduk, your quote was a simple declaration. It stands on its own. If you think context would help, provide it.
Look at it like this.
Kim Il-sung was directly responsible for the deaths of far more Koreans than Lee Wan-yong.
Yet ask Koreans who was the worse traitor and 9 out of 10 will answer: “Lee Wan-yong”.
Wrap your head around that one, since you are “smarter than us”.
That’s a very sad attitude.
It is certainly not one that was espoused by our Founding Fathers or the succeeding generations who made our nation great.
But bluejives’ sentiment is typical of the all-too-common modern opportunists of any race.
By the way, you obviously have not studied history if your concept of Roman citizenship is so facile and fallacious.
Nice try halfwit. So anyone criticizing BJ Wie for pandering to Korean nationalist supremacists and simultaneously denigrating American culture by distancing his daughter from any influence of the country he pledged his loyalty to whatsoever, gains automatic entrance into the KKK, according to Mizar. A clear correlation, obvious to dumbasses worldwide. If you’re not intelligent enough to see the difference, perhaps you should stick to spewing fantasies on the Fighting 44s with jives.
Your feeble attempt to lump legitimate criticism of an opportunistic, two-faced douchebag in with ignorant racial purists is laughable, at best. I’ve got nothing but respect and admiration for legal (and illegal for that matter)immigrants that come to this country, work hard to intergrate themselves, and become loyal, contributing citizens. America was built by immigrants and continues to be fueled by them. And acknowledging that fact doesn’t preclude me from exposing and criticizing the opportunistic, ungrateful leeches among them, of which BJ fits the bill perfectly.
I’ve never said a word in here or in any other forum that could possibly be construed as supporting or agreeing with the horseshit racial purity ideology that, until Hines Ward caught a touchdown pass, was the unchallenged law of the land in Korea. In fact, if you look at my track record in several Hines Ward threads, you’ll see that I’ve probably been the harshest critic of that very mindset and the damage its wrought on Korea and its people. It’s a fucking disgrace and has done more to hamper the development of Korean society than just about any other factor with the exception of graft. So unless you’re willing to back up your bullshit charge, go ahead and shove it up back up your ass from whence it came. I realize it’s crowded up there with the rest of your half-cocked theories, but try and make room.
BJ Wie deserves every bit of disdain I and others have thrown his way. Regardless of whether his comments were for Korean domestic consumption — intending to profit from negation of his daughter’s American upbringing — or whether he truly believes it, is irrelevant. He’s a slimeball either way and deseves to be criticized. Comments from several KA’s in this thread prove I’m not alone in that assessment. Funny, I didn’t hear you calling them racists. Just the white guy. Only a coincidence I’m sure. Hypocrite.
Keep up the self-delusion and projection if it helps you sleep at night though. I realize it’s easier to write off every critic, sorry…every white critic…as David Duke than it is to deal with painful realities. It’s worked wonders for turning jives into a laughinstock. Who says it can’t do the same for you?
Stealing Michelle Wie, that’s what foreigners here a trying to say?
OK, I haven’t read every single comment here but can anyone answer for me how good Michelle’s spoken Korean is? I get the impression she can understand it, but how about actually speaking, reading and writing? If her speaking skills are poor, I hope Koreans can see through her father’s ridiculous comments about how truly Korean she is.
Not to say that speaking the language means you are Korean but it would certainly severely damage his claim that the only thing American about her is her passport–I mean, to a nationalistic Korean audience it would, would it not?
Any thoughts?
Just because a Korean can’t speak his/her own language well doesn’t mean he/she is not Korean. I myself can’t speak Korean thoroughly though I was born there. But that doesn’t mean my heart isn’t there.
If a Jew is born in any other country, he/she isn’t Jew? I don’t think so.
What foreigners here are forcefully trying to change? I think they want to boast for little things like they boast about ipods, one of the few achievements in electronics.
No one has any right in other personal rights.
Hey, iheartblueballs, I think you missed mizar5’s other post:
“By the way, Blueballs refers to the appropriately named Bluejives, famous for his self-important Korean suprecism -not the satirist with a similar name.”
So he wasn’t talking about you at all. In fact, if you reread his post, you’ll see that he seems to agree with you completely. His post would make absolutely no sense if he were directing his ire against you. But why he didn’t just write “Bluejives” in the first place is beyond me.
Jodi:”OK, I haven’t read every single comment here but can anyone answer for me how good Michelle’s spoken Korean is? I get the impression she can understand it, but how about actually speaking, reading and writing? If her speaking skills are poor, I hope Koreans can see through her father’s ridiculous comments about how truly Korean she is.”
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These posts are getting kind of ridiculous, but, her Korean is actually pretty good.
http://tvnews.media.daum.net/p.....38495.html
You have to use IE to open the video.
These posts remind me of David Chappelle’s sketch where people are arguing over celebrities with mixed heritage and and the audience has to decide who’s race they belong to.
Never even saw the second post. If all his comments were directed towards jives, then disregard my diatribe with apologies. I didn’t think it was possible to confuse jives with balls.
Katz, I was referring to a nationalistic Korean audience who I would think would define a true Korean as one would can speak the language well. It was by no means my personal opinion.
But then again, when it comes to nationalism and Korea, it seems to me that the nationalists will pick and choose what they like and leave the rest alone. Anyway, I was just curious.
Thanks for answering that Origami!
Dogbertt wrote:
“Look at it like this.
Kim Il-sung was directly responsible for the deaths of far more Koreans than Lee Wan-yong.
Yet ask Koreans who was the worse traitor and 9 out of 10 will answer: “Lee Wan-yong”.”
I don’t think we have to worry about S. Korea annexing the U.S. and 35-40 years of colonization as a result of Robert Kim’s treason. I suspect the American communists who gave our nuclear secrets to the Soviets in the 40’s and 50’s will be remembered by future generations (not to mention Robert Hanssen and others who spied for the USSR/Russia for years or even decades), but not an insignificant little traitor like Robert Kim.
Besides, S. Korea has been an ally since its inception, although it hasn’t been very reliable in recent years. Don’t you think numerous Americans over decades selling nuclear or state secrets to a sworn enemy, a superpower intent on “crushing” us, is a lot worse than one guy selling secrets to what is, essentially, an occasionally irritating, and militarily inferior, ally?
You also haven’t answered my earlier question (not that I expect anyone to care about or read anything I write). Is there a reason why you want to keep Robert Kim’s memory alive?
Bluejives wrote:
“Whether in the Roman Empire of the past or the American Empire of today, citizenship is just a legal document. A passport is just a legal document. As long as you pay your tax and obey the law, Caesar or the Feddle Gummint, doesnt give a crap.”
Um, no. Where do I start? Let’s just say you have no idea what you’re talking about. America is a nation-state and a federal republic. The social fabric would unravel if American citizens only felt obligated to pay taxes and obey the law. If we ceased to share common American principles, values, and aspirations, why would we even bother to defend them or the country? How could our military possibly function? The absence of cultural, national unity in a sovereign state as incredibly diverse as the U.S. would render it impotent and vulnerable. E pluribus unum is one of our national mottos for a reason. The Pax Americana, and America itself, only exists because generations of immigrants from every inch of the globe and their descendants pooled together their collective talents, innovations, and industry to turn a bunch of erstwhile colonies into the only remaining superpower in the world. You can be sure citizenship was a helluva lot more than just a “legal document” to them as it continues to be for Americans today.
In fact, many naturalized American citizens understand this even better than those of us who were born here, because it’s easy to take for granted all of the tangible and intangible benefits or privileges of being an American and the blessings we enjoy. Food for thought.
One final note–perhaps we should only grant citizenship to the children of legal permanent residents. This could decrease the number of people who take advantage of our generosity and encourage newcomers to settle their roots firmly in the U.S.
John Yoo and Harold Koh are not Koreans. They are neocons, just like Michelle Malkin.
It’s pretty sad when apologists like Baduk and Mizar have to abase themselves, overcompensate, and turn their back on their Korean identity just to prove their “Americanness”. Baduk goes even far to state that he would kill other Koreans, if it came to that. Kinda reminds me of black cops. Yes, black cops are even harsher on black criminals because they have to prove something to their fellow white cops.
What this all proves is that America is not really a free nation. When minorities feel compelled to turn into neocons with facist ideas and resort to persecuting fellow minorities in order to prove something, that is not freedom.
Adinfinitum,
The freedom to choose one’s cultural identity is a basic human right just like freedom of religion or sexual orientation. There is no “right” or “wrong” in this.
This concept we call America is still an experiment in progress. And it is being stress-tested like its never been before. Can all these different pockets of different cultural identities respect each other and exist side by side without causing friction is a question THAT STILL REMAINS TO BE SEEN. Once you start having an imperative to reduce everyone to some generic brand of “American”, whatever the hell that is, then that is the seed of intolerance.