UPDATE: I’m getting a ton of hits from this Japanese-language blog and Naver Japan’s BBS. Looks like these photos really are getting noticed across the East Sea.
ORIGINAL POST:
Didn’t post about it, but now that it has made Media Daum, might as well. Apparently, this subway station display (second set of photos here — the captions are hilarious) of “Hate Japan” pictures drawn by Korean school children is causing something of a stir on both sides of the East Sea.
I’m wondering who the stupid civil servant was who thought it would be a good idea to display those drawings in a public place. Although, I guess in a way it was a good thing he did — at least the issue is out in the open now.
BTW, the “Gord” in question wouldn’t be the blogger, would it?
72 Comments
I hope this doesn’t turn into another Japan/Korea/America/Slaves history debate, which is irrelevant in this case.
The bottom line is this: Korean schools teaching and condoning hatred based on nationalism. Last year, over 20,000 Korean marriages, or about 10% of all marriages in Korea were international marriages. Between 2001 and 2004, there were over 60,000 international marriages. The number is exponentially going up every year. The myopic Korea for Koreans vision of the country will no longer wash as the ideal of homogeneous Korea is no longer. International scrutiny and standards of behaviour will rise, and will force Korea to change for the better.
Oh my God.
There are so many things wrong with this I don’t know where to begin.
Young children are a product of their environment. Is Korea really filled with that much hate for Japan?
Is it that acceptable in Korea to teach such hate to children?
How could teachers or someone in authority tell students to draw things like this?
How could teachers or people in authority not tell the children who drew the more extreme pictures that it is wrong?
How could teachers or people in authority put this kind of stuff in a public place? Condoning such activity- even encouraging such drawings.
How can these same people have a beef with Japan’s education system?
I’m sure this has happened in many classrooms in Korea. I doubt this is an isolated incident.
Don’t get me wrong, a majority of these pictures are only ultra nationalistic, and well….to be expected. Many countries, if not all countries do this stuff sometimes. But there are some pictures that should have been torn up and the teacher should have had a long talk with the kid and the parents.
Thankfully there is some what of a backlash about stuff like this, but I think we’ve seen it enough to say it is one of the more ugly trends in Korean society, and the backlash needs to be more prolonged to turn the tide.
Sending whole classes of middle school girls and boys to anti-US/USFK rallies was the vogue in 2002. You had the article on the teacher proudly displaying a blood-written message against USFK/US where they pricked their fingers to write out anti-US messages. And street performances on stage by kids at anti-US rallies were also a neat thing back then.
Then there was that neat kiddy song with pro-bin laden lyrics and bash Bushie lyrics that was a huge hit with school kids down south towards Pusan and a popular download.
Again, it is good to see some Koreans and some in the press speaking out against this shit, but it is not enough.
And the 2nd thing I think about when I see these gross displays is this —- I’ve heard personally and read a good bit more about Koreans taking the US to task for an “upswing” in anti-foreigner pressure in the US after 9/11. I’ve read a couple of “special reports” about this in the Korean media.
This is what I call a black pearl —- it has some truth to it, and it is worth discussing, but not with these people.
Because when you scratch below the surface, you see how much it is a tool of convience.
What I mean is, look at these gross displays of naked hate taught to children in Korea, and tell me what would have happened if Arab terrorist had flown a couple of Korean Airliners into the 63 Building?
…
Pathetic and quite sad. I guess that it happens in any elementary school classroom in Korea. When I was a kid, I used to draw Fuck NK! Many schoolteachers were idiots. What did you expect kids to learn? But I am sort of glad to see some netizens?€™ reaction toward it. Some people actually wrote that it wasn?€™t the right thing to hate people like that. I agree.
I also wonder whether “Gord” is the blogger Gord. Does anybody know?
Yep, Gord’s the same Gord from Dave’s ESL Cafe. That link goes to his board, which was used mostly to communicate with friends back home and apparently was pretty quiet until this happened. That’s when I found out about the board myself.
??°??´?¹?
MichaelMichael has brought this to attention in a previous thread, and kushibo noted that he just might go down there and give them (folks running the subway station) a good talk-to.
(”ya, imma, what the hell were you guys thinking?! …”)
I’m interested to know what their response would be. Kushibo, do update us if you do go down there for the chat.
I was thinking about this a little bit today, and it seems to be just the growing pains involved in becoming a more recognized country on the world stage. Time was when S. Korea could say whatever it wanted and nobody would pay attention, because few people lived here and they had just emerged from a war so they could be forgiven for being a little bitter. If we saw the same thing in a N. Korean school I assume there would be just a few chuckles and rolling of eyes, because we don’t expect much of them considering the society they live in. I assume the person who decided it would be a good idea to put these up didn’t give much thought to the possibility that it would actually be noticed, and you can see on the home page for the school as well that they thought so (just a simple comment saying “hey parents, come see the drawings”). In a way the fact that this has become such a big deal shows that we expect more from the S. Koreans, which is a good thing in a way. Let’s hope that they get taken down.
By the way, here’s the site for the school that put them up: http://www.gyeyang.ms.kr/
You can see a small ad about them over there too. ??…????™¸?¹??¸°, “scream for Dokdo”.
Tomorrow’s Monday and we’ll see what happens. The thread on Gord’s page has already gotten over 120,000 hits and it’s only been a few days so I assume this will just get bigger.
Mithridates wrote:
I was thinking about this a little bit today, and it seems to be just the growing pains involved in becoming a more recognized country on the world stage. Time was when S. Korea could say whatever it wanted and nobody would pay attention, because few people lived here and they had just emerged from a war so they could be forgiven for being a little bitter. If we saw the same thing in a N. Korean school I assume there would be just a few chuckles and rolling of eyes, because we don?€™t expect much of them considering the society they live in. I assume the person who decided it would be a good idea to put these up didn?€™t give much thought to the possibility that it would actually be noticed, and you can see on the home page for the school as well that they thought so (just a simple comment saying ?€œhey parents, come see the drawings?€?). In a way the fact that this has become such a big deal shows that we expect more from the S. Koreans, which is a good thing in a way. Let?€™s hope that they get taken down.
By the way, here?€™s the site for the school that put them up: http://www.gyeyang.ms.kr/
You can see a small ad about them over there too. ??…????™¸?¹??¸°, ?€œscream for Dokdo?€?.
Tomorrow?€™s Monday and we?€™ll see what happens. The thread on Gord?€™s page has already gotten over 120,000 hits and it?€™s only been a few days so I assume this will just get bigger.
You expect more from Koreans? Sounds like you are talking to a borg! I understand and hear you on your explainations, but you can’t discount the KTU in all of this. They haven’t seen non Korean DNA they have liked! Get a grip dear boy! Children being used in this way isn’t what education is about!
I’m not sure what to do with mithridates tone. I’m not sure how he means it to sound or what implications of it are? It makes a legitimate point, but it could go any number of ways as far as implications go.
I think it boils down to what we consider the more basic nature of Korean society today. Is the reaction against the display a sign of a majority feeling and trend? Or, is the cultivation and desire to diplay such hate more the norm? Or, is it evenly split?
But, for some reason, those questions seem to skew mithridates’ general diraction in tone.
It’s tough to describe, but I’ll try it like this — in the book The Heart of Darkness, there is a scene that describes a painting (I think done by the Kurtz main character) of a person carrying a torch into the heart of darkness —- bringing in the light —- which represents enlightenment and so on…..
That is the feeling I get from his description of the situation in Korea in regard to the reacation to this display of trained hatred.
However, the image I get as a general conclusion to this event, and reaction to mithridates’ point, is this —- uncovering a rock and watching cochroaches scurry.
I’m glad to see Koreans react against such a display, but there is a long way to go and not enough emphasis on it.
Like when the Hitler bar popped up. Or that video by, what was that female groups name??, with each of the three singers doing away with the arrogant American. Or, one of my personal favorites, the television ad I got to see just about everyday in the subway of the terrorist plane failing to crash into the world trade center because they didn’t have Korean technology….
It seems to me the positive negative reaction to such displays has yet to make it to sufficient strength to take much joy from…..
And I don’t give South Korea kudos for the rest of the world just not paying attention to to it yet.
South Korea and North Korea are light years apart from each other. (Even with such gross displays of hate.) But, it needs to take some giant steps away from where it is right now in areas like this event shows.
And I’m not just on my high horse either. As I’m writing this, I have images of black and white tv shows in the US with white men painting black faces on themsevles and singing “mamie”….
I haven’t heard of a nation yet that doesn’t have some things to be ashamed of……
“what was that female groups name??”
That would be the “Bubbles (or Bubba?) Sisters”. I heard that they’re going legit now, and taking off the masks.
Is S.Korea a free democracy? Sometimes I wonder seeing stuff like this that would only happen in violent totalitarian states.
What’s appalling in the case of the subway pictures is that this wasn’t done by some private citizens like in the case of Nazi Bars, or the Bubbles Sisters. This was the government of Korea, specifically the North Korean mouth piece (the KTU), teaching young children that dropping nuclear bombs on Japan is a fantastic ideal. This was the government of Korea, specifically the Seoul subway authorities who decided it would be a good ideal to put up these crap pictures. The government should know better.
I think Koreans have been allowed to get away with many stuff like this because nobody really pays attention to Korea. Just imagine the international reactions if pictures like this are put up in subways of Tokyo, London, or New York. That would be unthinkable.
Shameful.
In a way the fact that this has become such a big deal shows that we expect more from the S. Koreans, which is a good thing in a way. Let?€™s hope that they get taken down.
The sad thing is, the Koreans don’t expect better from themselves. When one of these things gets the indignant attention it deserves, the response is that “the foreigners” have once again “misunderstood” Korea, and an effort is made either to mollify us (clarifications) or to remove us from the equation (barring us from attending, like the various Hitler Hofs over the years).
at the risk of stating the obvious, koreans hate japanese. simple as that. and you can substitute korea hates japan if you want to get into those semantics but the bottom line is the same. hate.
if you’ve lived here for any length of time, you’ll find nothing surprising about these drawings.
I seem to remember in 1998 foreign books being burned at the behest of school officials and it was implied that the vandalism of foreign made cars was considered patriotic during the financial crisis (aka IMF era). It was just as egregious then as the pictures that the students were obviously encouraged to draw are now. I know of no group that has a monopoly on virtue when it comes to not hating or disliking another group of people but it is generally not officially encouraged like this.
Koreans speak of wanting to take on more of a leadership role in world or at least North East Asian affairs but that idea is laughable unless they can rise above this type of activity. Remeber, in this case the attitudes expressed by the students were explicitly endorsed twice by public service officials-once when the teachers encouraged the pictures to be drawn and then again when they were publicly displayed in the subway station.
It is good that there are some Koreans that have voiced concern over this, I can only hope that more people will at least seriously consider why this is offensive.
Yeah, Kushibo and I thrashed this out on the BoA post, and I give him (and Troll) props for letting me clarify my initial disgust…. I’m with some others here in that I just wish some of these people could step out of their frog-in-the-well mentality and see how others perceive this. I purposely posted Gord’s link not to bash Koreans, but to use Mr. Marmot’s blog (hope that was OK) to bring it to wider attention. I was also tempted to say “that’s just the way Koreans are” and let it pass, but it isn’t the way many Koreans I know think, and they would be as offended as I was to see children manipulated like this. So it merits a wider audience, because frankly this is a hate crime, and these people (the teachers, the subway authority) deserve criticism and ridicule.
at the risk of stating the obvious, koreans hate japanese. simple as that. and you can substitute korea hates japan if you want to get into those semantics but the bottom line is the same. hate.
fucking brilliant, buddy.
yeah, koreans hate japanese for no reason whatsoever. cut your bogus righteous indignation, would ya. find a different way to boost your puny ego, instead of insulting other peoples wholesale.
more art projects
Robert at the Marmot points to a second set of photos of anti-Japan artwork from South Korean students. This one struck me as curious.: The teacher should really be reprimanded for letting this one go. The exhibition was supposed to
classic.
“koreans hate japanese. simple as that”
Not simple as that, at least not like the Arabs hating Jews (and vice versa, not wanting to do anything with each other than to kill and kill). I don’t know how to describe it, but I guess the best way to describe Koreans’ attitude toward Japan is “love and hate relationship”.
I’ve had many many Korean and Japanese student boarders in my house over the years, and I can honestly say I’ve seen many budding friendships with each other than any other nationalities. I never noticed any tensions based on hatred or resentment. For the most part, they seem to get along very well. Then again I notice that my students mostly refrain from discussing politics in front of Japanese and Koreans.
Politics and historical differences is the root of hatred of Japan in Korea, not race, culture, or religion.
?€œwhat was that female groups name???€?
That would be the ?€œBubbles (or Bubba?) Sisters?€?. I heard that they?€™re going legit now, and taking off the masks.
Wasn’t there an S.E.S. video that had the same type of theme? I mean, loads of white guys acting boorishly (no Korean guys in sight), and then getting put in their place by the girls in the group?
Regarding Koreans’ feelings for Japan and the Japanese: many young Koreans I know will happily say that they hate Japanese, yet feel no animosity to the Japanese people whom they know.
Similarly, people have told me that they hate Americans, and when I explain that I’m an American citizen, they say that they didn’t mean me! But it seems that the hatred exemplified here is sometimes simplistic - it seems to be a parroting of what’s expected, rather than a true feeling.
Perhaps that’s what’s sad about it. I’ve been assaulted here before, simply for my race, and it was easy to see the hatred - and so, easy to cast it off as ignorance and stupidity. But when the people whom I work with or live near smilingly tell me about their hatred of others, it’s just sad.
SES was the group I was thinking about.
“Regarding Koreans?€™ feelings for Japan and the Japanese: many young Koreans I know will happily say that they hate Japanese, yet feel no animosity to the Japanese people whom they know.”
I’ve heard white people in the US say the same thing about blacks when I was in high school and early in college. It made no sense to me, and with a few of them that were closer friends, I’d point it out to them. — that it didn’t make sense when they would say something like “Blacks this or blacks that” when they had 3 or 4 good friends we hung around who were black.
Just as with much of the anti-Americanism in South Korea, I can’t say my pointing this obvious thing out did much good.
It doesn’t run on logic
I?€™ve heard white people in the US say the same thing about blacks when I was in high school and early in college. It made no sense to me, and with a few of them that were closer friends, I?€™d point it out to them. ?€” that it didn?€™t make sense when they would say something like ?€œBlacks this or blacks that?€? when they had 3 or 4 good friends we hung around who were black.
have a sense of context. did black americans ruled over white americans and made whites the second-class citizens, and took white women off for sex slaves?
i think you’re missing the point troll. usinkorea is emphasizing how easy it is to stereotype a race yet consider friends of that race to be exclusive of the stereotype.
to continue with your line of reasoning (?), did black americans sell and manage the sale of their women to whites as did the koreans to the japanese? sure. they’re called pimps and still do it-in most all countries. however, it is often easier to place all blame on another ethnic group, country, “oppressor”, than to look at your own people’s role in it. of course the japanese subjugated women to sexual slavery, yet there were a lot of koreans managing and selling the korean women.
i think you?€™re missing the point troll. usinkorea is emphasizing how easy it is to stereotype a race yet consider friends of that race to be exclusive of the stereotype.
true, that may be the main gist of usinkorea’s post, but using the black/white american relation for comparison with that of koreans/japanese, ignoring their respective contexts, is misleading, which was *MY* point.
to continue with your line of reasoning (?), did black americans sell and manage the sale of their women to whites as did the koreans to the japanese? sure. they?€™re called pimps and still do it-in most all countries. however, it is often easier to place all blame on another ethnic group, country, ?€œoppressor?€?, than to look at your own people?€™s role in it. of course the japanese subjugated women to sexual slavery, yet there were a lot of koreans managing and selling the korean women.
you misread.
two different points here. the first is commentary on how people can stereotype a race at the exclusion of specific idividuals from that race who have a positive, close relationship with the person doing the stereotyping. in this context, the black/white, korean/japanese analogy works.
the second point for discussion is historical context of japanesekorean relationship and it’s analagous possibility to black/white relationship in the US. i can’t find any discussion of that in the postings. please let me know where you see this analogy other than in your own postings (and my “misreading” of your comments).
Looks like there’s going to be another “exhibition” of kids drawings of Dokdo and whatnot in Kwanghwamun:
http://kids.hankooki.com/lpage.....427700.htm (in Korean). If they resemble the ones in the Incheon subway…there are more frogs in the well than I thought.
I don’t get nationalistic pride–I mean, it’s no kind of achievement that you happened to be born in a particular country or that accomplishments by total strangers from the same country somehow are yours as well…but whatever, knock yourself out if you think that. But when children are taught in school to hate people in another country, not matter what, politics or history aside, it’s bigotry, it’s regressive and of course it ends up hurting the children by stunting their emotional development. That’s what is offensive about all this.
I agree with Kimbob, generally. While I stand by everything I wrote, I’d also say that changing demographics will naturally force changes in society, and these will ultimately benefit us all. To be clear, I think that problems exist, but that things are better than in the past. However, I also think that the process Kimbob refers to will not happen without difficulty.
For example, the overwhelming majority of those marriages last year were between older (?€?marriageably?€™ speaking) lower-income Koreans and poor younger women from countries like China, Vietnam and Philippines. In such cases, it is easy for Koreans to label the relationships as being ‘low-class’, since neither individual enjoys much social status here. Likewise their children will be schooled with ethnically-Korean children, who have a demonstrated tendency for asserting their status over ??¼??? children, and will do so even more with economically disadvantaged mixed-race kids.
Therefore, I?€™d say that the initial response will be one of dislike and frustration, since that?€™s been the historical pattern. How long that will take to change, or how difficult the process of change will be, I?€™ve no idea, but I doubt that it will be smooth. However, I do believe that it will be positive, ultimately, and that the society having to struggle with this issue is a good thing.
wow…. thanks, troll. that was a bit harsh but, gee, i’ll guess i’ll take it because, oh, you can say whatever you want here. i also won’t get too offended because, judging from other posts, it seems you have some reading comprehension issues. i guess you misread me as well. let me elaborate for you, then leave you to do some fingerpainting of your own.
first of all, i don’t need to establish my credentials for you so i won’t. suffice to say that i’ve lived here long enough to have encountered koreans from up and down the income spectrum. hatred of japanese is a very ingrained thing across those lines. there are enlightened people here but, when pressed, even they will side with anti-japanese sentiment.
my observation remains the same. there is a deep well-spring of hatred towards japan here. many of the posts try to see this through different lenses (Jews-arabs, black-white, etc..) but there’s no need to. not because the hatred is unique or incomparable, but because it is what it is.
we also see that koreans know they can parlay their hatred into enhanced popularity. witness the soccer player who scores a goal on national TV, pulls up his shirt, and exposes the message “dokto is our land, get out japan” (or some derivative) and witness heads around the country nodding in unison. Witness the president, low low low in the approval ratings, suddenly bash japan and get a big boost.
the hatred is real. it drives people to do stupid things. end of story.
good luck with that fingerpainting, troll. when you’re done, trying learning how to read.
Kimbob,
of course you’re right. it is not as simple as that. i’ve seen the interplay on an interpersonal level so i know exactly what you mean. especially among those people who take part in cultural exchange, there is a real desire to change minds and stamp out that hatred.
unfortunately, those people are already predisposed to better relations and, again unfortunately, they remain in a very small minority.
one significant problem, as i mentioned above, is the fact that leaders will not step up and be good role models for better relations. for political leaders, to do so would represent simple opportunity cost, at best, and political suicide at worst.
just testing this blockquote thigny - a good passage anyways.
two different points here. the first is commentary on how people can stereotype a race at the exclusion of specific idividuals from that race who have a positive, close relationship with the person doing the stereotyping. in this context, the black/white, korean/japanese analogy works.
the second point for discussion is historical context of japanesekorean relationship and it?€™s analagous possibility to black/white relationship in the US. i can?€™t find any discussion of that in the postings. please let me know where you see this analogy other than in your own postings (and my ?€œmisreading?€? of your comments).
analogy inevitably drags in their contexts, thus the danger of analogy and the need to clarify - i’m sure your freshman writing seminar covered that. this may not have been the intention of the usinkorea’s post, but making comparison of white american bigotry against black americans and korean bigotry against japanese makes it sound like they are the same - no they are not. you may find both repulsive (or not), but they are different.
my bad that the tone of my response to usinkorea’s post came out the way it did.
to continue with your line of reasoning (?), did black americans sell and manage the sale of their women to whites as did the koreans to the japanese? sure. they?€™re called pimps and still do it-in most all countries. however, it is often easier to place all blame on another ethnic group, country, ?€œoppressor?€?, than to look at your own people?€™s role in it. of course the japanese subjugated women to sexual slavery, yet there were a lot of koreans managing and selling the korean women.
you misread my comment because i was pointing out that the analogy is skewed, but instead you run away with it, and it’s not even the same analogy and calling that it’s *my* reasoning. your rambling on korean collaborators strenthens the analogy how?
I hope this doesn?€™t turn into another Japan/Korea/America/Slaves history debate, which is irrelevant in this case.
True, and i guess i didn’t help that aim - my response to usinkorea’s post was pretty incendiary.
But when children are taught in school to hate people in another country, not matter what, politics or history aside, it?€™s bigotry, it?€™s regressive and of course it ends up hurting the children by stunting their emotional development. That?€™s what is offensive about all this.
Indeed.
seeing… wrote
…
first of all, i don?€™t need to establish my credentials for you so i won?€™t. suffice to say that i?€™ve lived here long enough
…
yep, i can see that.
…
good luck with that fingerpainting, troll. when you?€™re done, trying learning how to read.
…
I have to admit some of the drawings were well done, in a sort of Henry Darger way:
http://www.hammergallery.com/A.....Darger.htm
I just read on Gord’s board that the display has been removed.
??°??´?¹?
Looks like there?€™s going to be another ?€œexhibition?€? of kids drawings of Dokdo and whatnot in Kwanghwamun:
http://kids.hankooki.com/lpage.....427700.htm
I cruised past the exhibit in Kwanghwamoon during my lunch hour today. Very patriotic, with Korean flags and ??…?????” ??œ????…s a’plenty (some had Dokdo fauna and flora) but without the bitter anti-Japanese aftertaste. Only one of about 50 pictures had a Japanese flag, but it was flying rather than being spat or shat upon. I didn’t have time to read any of the poems (also about 50) but the artwork would suggest that the theme was “Dokdo is beautiful and it’s totally ours” rather than “Imperialist Japanese monkeys must die”. Note that the Seoul Post Office is sponsoring the event.
The utter lack of malicious content in this one suggests that the teacher in charge of the other one must have offered significant “guidance”.
If anyone goes to check it out, you can find the artwork lining the west wall south of the ticket booth and north of the Kyobo Bookstore.
“I have to admit some of the drawings were well done, in a sort of Henry Darger way:”
Hahahaha, yeah, I could swear one of the children used a white underpainting before applying the crayon! Hahaha! Henry Dadger! That is hilarous! What a pitiful attempt to name-drop an obscure artist! That is the best! Yeah, I see what you mean! Henry Darger! Hahahaha
The assignment given may have been as simple as; Draw what “What do you think of Japan?”. It’s possible the teachers did not encourage the results and most of the hatred is coming from the children’s home/ government environment and not the school’s environment? Maybe this is a display of what is wrong with Korea’s children, and a way of showing the public what needs to be changed. “Here is what our children think - we need to change our ways! Look at this nonsense!” This is a good thing for Korean education.
?BTW, the ?€œGord?€? in question wouldn?€™t be the blogger, would it?”
I think they are different Gords. Gord Sellar and the Gord of this post. Could be wrong, just guessing.
The whole thing is spiteful and childish. The educator and displayer really lacks sense in creating and showcasing that stuff.
I like reading the replies that come under the news portals of Korea. Its totally unfiltered sewage of raw emotion and in your face posts. Many critize these “replies” (known as ????”Œ) but to me it seems like the best way to feel the subconcious of Korea. Yep its almost always filled with garbage, and makes one feel totally filthy after mucking through it. But, reading through ‘em is like putting your hands on the pulse of what Koreans really think (not hiding behind the masks).
Why am I saying these?
Well there was a demonstration (quite physical) at the Japanese Cultural Center in Korea by Korean students today. They were protesting against the Japanese prime minister’s visit to Korea and wanted their voices heard in a rather forceful way. The police put them down in an equally forceful way and the photographs from “Oh My News” made the students look like the victims of overeager police work. I was expecting more foul hatred spouting for the Japanese and Cops from the repliers but I was in for a surprise. Yep, most of the repliers replied along this line. ‘The students overreached. Demonstrating is their right but they should have done it in a peaceful manner. I’m not going to take this kind of photo shit from OMN anymore. I don’t like Japan but this is just too much!’
I must admit I was pleasently surprisd.
(if you can read Korean check out the replies: http://news.naver.com/photo/re.....=allpage=2 )
Anyway just wanted to bring another slice of reality in Korea. I hope we just remember that each news or trend we see is just a slice of the reality and its not the whole thing. (Though I admit some slices are so big, they just cant be ignored
)
troll-
from my read blanket bigotry wasn’t the important issue in usinkorea’s post. it was lack of logic in someone who stereotypes a group of people-except the ones who he decides don’t fit into because he personally knows them.
this is analagous to many koreans who “hate” japanese or americans except their japanese or american friends.
have a sense of context. did black americans ruled over white americans and made whites the second-class citizens, and took white women off for sex slaves?
i assumed that you were pointing out that the japanese ruled the koreans, made them second-class citizens and took koreans for sex slaves. however, your reaction seemed more like an axe to grind than a relevant comment. my poor attempt at continuing what i believed was your axe grinding was to try and point out that not even that is not as clear cut as you make it out to be. in fact, a lot of that is again an inability for korean’s to look at their own hands in the dirty dealings during their colonization. unfortunately, i tried to stuff too many thoughts into my post and should have just forgone it. i’m sure we’ll return to these issue at a more appropriate and relevant time.
It looks like South Korean teachers have borrowed another chapter out of the North Korean teachers’ handbook. The teachers and officials responsible for the pictures should disciplined.
Actually, I feel like going into one of the classrooms, grabbing one of teachers by the back of the neck, sticking their nose in one of pictures, and saying, “Bad teacher! Bad teacher!”
I’m a Japanese.
Those pictures gave me sad.
I have been abhorred by children ;-(
I never NOT used violence to that children, in my life..
I do not understand what I should have said. I just say “sad”.
having been educated in the rok as a child (although it was quite a while ago), i know from personal experience that this sort of thing is common, and even encouraged by the adults. shameful, really.
Ahh, it just never ends. It’s just a bunch of kids that never played with the other kids.
Funny, Muslim children draw the same pictures of Israel and the United States.
Public schools ensure that a generation’s progeny will inherit worldviews favorable to the adult public in that society. Has anyone seen “All Quiet on the Western Front?”
“What a pitiful attempt to name-drop an obscure artist!” Hey Hardy, I’m an artist, so the name’s not obscure to me
Anyway, I know it ain’t as “stimulating” as Japanese actresses with big tits, but a little kulcha now and then doesn’t hurt….
Daily linklets 21st June
The I got to Manila airport 2 hours early edition: Harry cracks me up. How and why Wanchai’s sex trade remains strong. Hong Kong’s property addiciton and the lies told in its name. ESWN discusses income inequality in China. He echoes my point: The tr…
Eli, shut up.
(Alright, sorry from a korean guy, for what little that’s worth.)
judge judy: i get your drift and i made a half-assed apology for my tone to usinkorea. like you wrote, the other stuff is for another day.
BTW, the ?€œGord?€? in question wouldn?€™t be the blogger, would it??€?
I think they are different Gords. Gord Sellar and the Gord of this post. Could be wrong, just guessing.
They are different
Nice to meet you, angry troll.
?²???Œ ??™?²?????????¤.??¹?????€ ?™œ ?²??…¸????³? ??????????¹Œ?
Why do you hate me?
??¹?????€ ??¹?????…?????¤. ?³¼?±°?™€ ????????? ?¶??????´ ??¼??¸??”. ??¹?????€ ??¤??œ?¡œ??” ???????¼ ?²´???????§€ ????????¤.
I don’t understand what you said me “shut up”.
Eli, maybe he was being sarcastic, which may not be the best way to welcome someone.
VP1, I’ve been thinking about Koreans’ xenophobia for years, and frankly I’m getting tired of having to think about it. What’s your definition of “big deal”? I’d say it’s a very big deal.
MM,
Wanna explain this Korean xenophobia? I know of two countries that many Koreans rant about:
1. Japan, for the occupation, which is relatively recent history.
2. The U.S. This is rather complicated and not so clear cut as with Japan, and, I think, true only since the ’90s, after the Soviets collapsed and the Germanies were united, which got South Koreans to think united Korea (and not with NK “sea of fire) is something more than a distant mirage. Many factors here, but a part of the problem lies in the lop-sided relation where South Korea depends so heavily on the US for security as well as economically - good chunk of the rant is out of frustration. Japan is arguably in a similar situation, but she doesn’t have half her country run by a jackass with “million man army” and a prestigious memebership in the Axis of Evil granted by the US. At least when I was growing up in South Korea (’80s), the US was seen as a great and powerful friend, unambiguously.
Regardless of the merits of their justifications, these are the two. What other countries/peoples Koreans have cow about?
Eli,
The “shut up” was a dumb joke to dissipate my embarrassment for those teachers that guided and promoted the nasty drawings. I wish I can extend you the same courtesy by replying in Japanese but I am ignorant in that langauge.
eli
i’m a japanese living in seoul for a couple of years now.
many korean friends of mine express their shame on these drawings. on the other hand, you should know the socio-historical background in korean society behind this as a japanese. just being naive doesnt help you go anywhere.
and regarding the comment from troll, just re-read his remarks after “shut up”.
I think Gord is stacking the deck to suit his agenda…
Let me explain. By NOT revealing where this pictures and which school is responsible, he is pusposefully indicting ALL Koreans and Korean schools, not the responsible party.
As we know, not ALL Koreans hate or teach their children or students to hate, to imply the opposite is ridiculous.
One last thing, Dok Do is a serious issue for Koreans- I don’t fully understand it but, since I live here, have a Korean wife, and countless Korean friends, I am sympathetic and will try to understand.
However, there is no excuse for the horribly misguided public display of those pictures.
VP1, the name of the station was mentioned above. Also, the drawings were produced at a public school, obviously guided by the teachers, so it is institutionalized bigotry condoned by the S.K. government. I’m sympathetic about people worrying about S.K.’s territorial sovereignity, but teaching kids to hate is inexcusable, and I doubt it’s isolated to one school in Incheon.
It’s probably the pro-North Korea Teacher’s Union that’s behind it. They are masters of the dark side, and they get their power from hatred of Japan and America.
vp1
it is understandable koreans become serious about the territorial issue particularly when japan is involved. nevertheless, there should be some other issue they should be more serious about.
just look at the fact. korea has been practically occupied these rocks for more than 50 years, and japan has never made any military attempt to claim these 2 rocks. please tell your friends just a resolution by a poor local government would hardly lead japan being militaristic as in the past.
and during these 50years how many s.koreans were killed or abducted by the north? and it seems to me s.koreans as an institution dont take it seriously recently.
and i fully agree with michaelmichael on #57.
MichaelMichael,
Thanks, I did see the name of the station mentioned above but I was talking about the fact that Gord never mentioned it on his site (as of 2 days ago, when I read it). It would have been more productive to have done so and he should have done it right off the bat.
I stand by my original comment and further add that suggesting that all school do this, all teachers teach hate, and all students would draw ppictures like that is irresponsible and ignorant. It’s no better behavior than the people who approved the drawing activity.
If the purpose is to draw attention to a bigger problem, then other concrete examples should be given.
mae,
Thanks. I have had long discussions about Dok Do (among other things). My friends can’t seem to have difficuly disconnecting from all the other Japan issues.
All due respect VP1, but it’s probably a bigger endemic problem than you make it out to be–it’s hard to think of a country where schoolteachers would encourage children to hate another nationality, except maybe Cuba or North Korea. You seem to be saying, don’t call attention to this, it’s no big deal, but the majority of posters here disagree.
it?€™s hard to think of a country where schoolteachers would encourage children to hate another nationality, except maybe Cuba or North Korea.
It’s not that hard.
oops.. should read ‘My friends have difficulty…
vp1
while i know many koreans who can discuss rationaly even over the issue of the past with japan, some people just emotionally react whatever related to japan and anything japan is evil.
and i fear this exhibition thing symbolize how those people in the latter group have been produced through the educational system in recent years here.
and irony is we have a perfect match here; pro-north teachers’ union in korea teach kids to hate japan whereas pro-communist teachers’ union in japan too teach to hate japan through condemning all in the past of japan is evil.
MM,
Well, this definitely got me (and many others) thinking…and that’s always a good thing.
There could be more to this- perhaps we’ll start seeing more concrete examples of it.
I do not mean to give the impression of ‘don?€™t call attention to this, it?€™s no big deal’. It is a big deal but perhaps not as big as some posters think.
Well, Troll, every country “has a cow” (you a Simpsons fan?) with somebody. Japan and the U.S. seem to top Korea’s list, although why the latter is probably out of frustration, as you said, but misplaced frustration, because it’s the very stubborn N.K. dictatorship that blocks reunification, not the U.S. Others on the cow list would include China (for good reason in some ways I admit) and Southeast Asian countries with Korea’s ambivalence about “3D” workers, and Russia occasionally.
Also…this is getting weary, but one thing that’s always puzzled me in Korea is why you never hear China criticized for its role in the Korean War, sending a half-million troops to push the allies south and ensuring that the peninsula was divided. Prejudice against Chinese would be a lot more understandable (but still not OK) in that context, but you never see teachers getting schoolkids to bust out the crayons and write “F–k China!” What’s up with that?
one thing that?€™s always puzzled me in Korea is why you never hear China criticized
Korea relies on exports, and 1 billion potential consumers can’t be wrong.
Anyone near Hongdae in Seoul, make your way to the bank across the street from the McDonalds, where I had the pleasure of walking past the ?·¸??°??? art school has on display a few student Dokdo-themed art pieces.
The pi?¨ce de r??sistance is a 5-foot painting of Dokdo as a Kart Rider speedway. Wicked.
vp1, the pictures are definitely not isolated. I think a lot of Koreans support it, and even when they dont like the pictures, they still blame Japan for their existence (and not the Korean teachers and media which cause kids to draw these kinds of pictures).
A Korean girl who found my hotmail address online (on a penpal site) and chatted with me online occasionally went ballistic when I sent her the site address for those pics.