Rhetoric like this is extraordinarily frightening (and rhetoric like this is simply embarrassing and probably not worth linking). Granted, people have been warning of the great Christian coup since Reagan, and while I’ve been back to the States only once in the last eight years, last time I checked, A Handmaid’s Tale it wasn’t. For that matter, we survived eight years of Clinton without the nation becoming a people’s republic or Roman orgies in the streets. I’m going to assume for now this is nothing more than post-election gloating from some quarters of the GOP (who probably had a lot less influence on the election results than they’re given credit for) and scare-mongering from some quarters of the Democratic Party. Still, stuff like this has to send a chill down ones spine:
Having restored decency to the White House, President Bush now has a mandate to affect policy that will promote a more decent society, through both politics and law. His supporters want that, and have given him a mandate in their popular and electoral votes to see to it. Now is the time to begin our long, national cultural renewal (”The Great Relearning,” as novelist Tom Wolfe calls it) — no less in legislation than in federal court appointments. It is, after all, the main reason George W. Bush was reelected.
Would someone care to explain to me what “a more decent society” entails? I mean, given how you can’t legally smoke pot or marry your same-sex partner in most of the country, how much more “decent” would you like the society to become? Through legislation and federal court appointments, no less! The pro-life people I can understand, but as for the other “values” people, well, I’m just not certain what they really expect in terms of “protecting/improving the nation’s decency,” and why. Or, to use Tom Wolfe’s term as used by Mr. Bennet, what exactly I’m supposed to “relearn.”
Look, it’s not that I hate Jesus or anything. If the Doobie Brothers liked him, I guess he couldn’t have been all that bad of a guy, even if he did look disturbingly similar to Red Sux centerfielder Johnny Damon (which might explain some things, now that I think about it). It’s just that I don’t want the state any more involved in cultural and moral issues than I want it involved in my wallet, and for a party that supposedly stands for economic liberty and limited government, I can only hope the GOP stays that road and doesn’t pander to those who see the state as an implement to fight a “cultural war” I want no part of.
Anyway, both the Big Hominid and Duophony are discussing (and linking) this much more than I am, so go check them out.
22 Comments
I get a chuckle out of that. “national cultural renewal”, “the great relearning”? Great prolitarien cultural revolution anyone? Now before people jump on me for being alarmist and indulging in hyperbole, I don’t think we will be seeing any mass struggle sessions in American anytime soon. However my point was that millenarianism is inescapable in human nature and the more “rational” West is not immune from it. It’s probably a good thing that constant self-criticism exists and is representative of a functioning democracy where constant vigilance can keep the gears of democracy turning. Sure it may seem like hectoring, but is not hectoring preferrable over being denounced as a heretic and being shipped off to re-education camps in cattle cars. That American has a poltical balance to one degree or another prevents excessive indulgences on either side.
As a rather ambivalent fellow towards democracy and an advocate of statism and centralized authority, I can still see the merits of the American balance. Given half the chance, I know those on the religious right would turn America into Jesusland if they could. Why? Because given the same opportunity, I would use the power to enact changes of my own.
“a party that supposedly stands for economic liberty and limited government”
I see a bloated federal budget and the last time I checked, continuing farm subsidies don’t exactly go along with economic liberty.
Anyway, face the facts that the increased turnout for Bush in this election had little to do with economic issues or limiting government. I think even the effects of the tax cut are overstated.
The base came up in force because it is pissed off about terrorists and Hollywood. This group was invigorated by 4 years of John Ashcroft’s cultural war and want to make sure his replacement stays the course. They are also sharks that smell blood in the water with the prospects of new openings on the Supreme Court. I was once Republican and voted for Dole in ‘96, but I’ve increasingly seen that the GOP doesn’t respect those with moderate and/or libertarian tendencies. The Christian Conservatives want to be left alone, but don’t want to leave ME alone, which is what I have a problem with.
whatever happens we get what we deserve.
Marmot, you sound remarkably anti-American in this post. Perhaps the Office of Homeland Security should pay you a vist and incarcerate you without trial. That is what terrorist tratiors like you deserve.
‘more decent society’
1. get rid of abortion. 2. put gays back in the closet. 3. clean up
all dick and pussy on televison. 4. initiate war on behalf of israel.
5. curtail freedoms guranteed by constitution. 7. treat foreign friends
based on how much they kiss booty(hello, japan’s my bitch!). 8. seek
ways to keep minorities in place. 9. pass law so german speaker with ties
to nazis can become president. 10. make more nukes while you prevent others
from doing the same. 11. institute draft for wars fought on behalf of
the jewish state. 12. said draft will exclude all the wealthy.
that’s a more decent america in the eyes of the right. i just can’t wait
It sounds like Marmot’s a Libertarian, not a Republican. Too bad he and MANY, MANY other Libertarian Americans do not have their own viable political party (that actually has a chance to win an election) through which to channel their views and express their politics (at the national level, anyway). If you’re an American, you either compromise and vote Ass or Elephant, or you don’t compromise your politics and don’t vote at all.
That America “is in the gutter” has been a trope that’s been around for a long time. Just recently, I was looking at 50 year-old issues of the Washington Post, San Fran Chronicle, etc. on Microfilm, and in one article, a Democratic congressman was reported to have made a speech blasting America’s lack of old-fashioned hometown morals. That was 1948. More recently (1996), Newt Gingrich thought that 1955 was the apex of the American Dream (in terms of morality). That’s quite interesting. I always wondered if Newt would have liked to go back in a time-machine to 1955? I would make a time machine for him and send him on his way myself, on ONE condition: That he goes back as a black woman!
…Our politicians also like to focus on “hot button” social issues like “FAGS/GLBT ISSUES!” and “ABORTION/A WOMAN’S RIGHT TO CHOOSE!” because they really can’t guarantee anything else of political substance to the poor and “middle class” people of the nation, other than an increasing accumulation of wealth in fewer and fewer hands.
I’d just like to watch prime time TV with my 10 year old daughter without having to worry about seeing guys checking out each other’s asses, or hearing “damn, bitch, ass, or shit” during what was once considered family TV time.
I’m not a prude, but there’s a time and place.
But… it’s the republicans who’ve been all for ‘de-regulating’ the broadcasting industry, which has only fed this increasingly sex-obsessed and foul-mouthed tv culture that many people who vote republican are opposed to. Add that to the fact the current government has created a huge debt, and is after tax cuts that favor the rich, and it seems that lower middle class and working class voters who voted republican for ‘moral reasons’ have in fact voted against their own economic interests.
“Yeah, I was evicted yesterday, but at least gays can’t marry.”
Since the culture wars are what influenced a fair amount of the vote, its possible the administration will see it as a mandate to go further right on these issues. If not, he may alienate what he always says is his ‘base’.
I’ve been reading H.L. Mencken’s coverage of the Scopes “Monkey” trial from 1925, and the divide he writes of between the city and country, ‘fundamentalists’ and ‘educated city folk’, is still as pronounced today as it was then.
http://www.io.com/gibbonsb/mencken/ (scroll down)
Caliboy, “4 years of John Ashcroft?€™s cultural war”
kimchipig, “Perhaps the Office of Homeland Security should pay you a vist and incarcerate you without trial.”
nulji, “institute draft for wars fought on behalf of the jewish state.”
Ahh, the victory of George W. Bush - the gift that keeps on giving. Watching the Left become completely unhinged in the next four years is going to be a joy.
paul webb, “Watching the Left become completely unhinged in the next four years is going to be a joy.” and watching the people who voted for bush take the fall for what the monkey does will be an even greater joy.
I think we knew that the GOP has some freaks in it before the big vote, and that some of their policies were truly very worrying. Don’t pretend that you are surprised now. You voted for him. You deal with it.
The unfortunate truth of the matter is that every American will be paying for the incompetence of Howdy Doody… not just his supporters.
You Rethugs can laugh and giggle now, but payback is a bitch. Don’t forget.
Brian
OK, let’s not go too far. Yes, the GOP has a fair number of nutballs, but so do the Dems. The difference is, the Dems lost, so their nutballs really don’t concern me at this juncture (I don’t mean that as a slam, BTW). Anyway, we’ll see how this all plays out eventually — as I said in my post, this whole “values” thing seems more like post-election gloating/scare-mongering/revisionism on both sides of the aisle, when the real issue was the war. If the U.S. is ruled by the Christian Taleban in four years, feel perfectly free to come to GOP blogs like mine and others and heckle us all you want.
I for one welcome our new christian overlords and look forward to stoning my neighbors wife for coveting anything in particular.
Anyways, hats off to you Marmot for having the integrity to publicly spank some of the more extreme members of the party you currently support.
You know, I downloaded and watched the latest Chris Rock comedy video, and there is a great bit where he roasts knee-jerk supporters of either party.
“All these people, they just want to be part of “the gang”. “The gang”. “Hey man, I’m with the GOP”. “Back off, I’m down with the Dems” (done with silly Crip/Blood postures). How stupid is that? Anyone who just blindly supports ‘their’ party no matter what is a fucking moron. A moron! There is NOBODY who is all one way on the party platform. There’s more to us than that. Me, I’m liberal on some things, and conservative on others. I’m liberal on POT…woohoo….and conservative on crime. Just get this ‘down with my gang’ bullshit out of this fucking country”
In the spirit of the above, I would like to say that J. Kerry, the candidate I would have voted for had I been American, continues in the glorious tradition of BORINGASFUCK Dem candidates, right there beside Mondale, Dukakis, and Gore. Guys! There’s gotta be a candidate NOT from the NorthEast.
It has already started
Wisconson to teach creationism
http://www.cnn.com/2004/EDUCAT.....index.html
If the Christian right rises up and starts to severly change things I fear more than just stupid heckling on a blog.
Creationism…the load of categorical bull…
well, it seems the us under bush has initiated it’s assault on
falluja in an effort to rid iraq of those who oppose bush’s
occupation of their country. more civilians will be added to the
pile of a hundred thousand dead. but hey, they’re just brown people.
like the europeans before them, american patriots will fail in their bid to
force their ways onto others. i’ll just sit back and watch the show. of course,
many american patriots will also be watching the show in which other
people’s children die. paul, you’re able-bodied, aren’t you? stop talking
tough by the cookie jar, get to iraq where you belong.
nulji, “it seems the us under bush has initiated it?€™s assault on falluja…more civilians will be added to the pile of a hundred thousand dead. but hey, they?€™re just brown people…i?€™ll just sit back and watch the show. of course”
Iraqi soldiers just took over Fallujah’s main hospital without firing a shot. That must have been very disappointing for you. Nulji, instead of spewing virulent hatred against Arabs, Jews, and Americans, why don’t you do something good for the world? You can sponsor a soldier for
Christmas this year. It will make a troop and yourself feel better. It’s a win-win situation.
http://www.soldiersangels.com/.....spirit.asp
Zdunk, “There?€™s gotta be a candidate NOT from the NorthEast.”
Good point. All U.S. presidents from 1964 to 2008 (44 years!) will have been from the southern half of the United States - Texas, Southern California, Georgia, and Arkansas. The geographic center of America’s population has moved from Pennslyvania to Missouri in the past 100 years - and is heading southwest - into the red states! Also, Kerry would have won the electoral college based on censuses of blue states in 1960 and 1970. But since 1980, the red states have gained a larger proportion of the population, and the margin is getting wider.
Nulji,
When did Arabs become “brown”. All the Karims, Farhans, Galibs, Elies, Thomases, and Shaloubs in one American neighborhood I lived in were at least as “white” as any Italian, Portuguese, Greek, or Armenian. And back in the 50’s, an Arab American comedian could get national ratings on a TV show that featured his old-country uncle “Tonoose”.
As to the Republicans “keeping the minorities in their place”, where exactly is that? The Secretary of State’s office? The Supreme Court?
Your view of America is outdated, my friend. More to the point, it is stereotypical.
‘your view of america is outdated.’
you’re confusing the issue here. i wrote about the republican
party and NOT america as a whole.
‘arabs are white.’
well, good that you had the chance to see that arabs come in colors
from black to white. however, the vast majority of arabs are of darker
skin tones and that’s how most americans think of arabs- as brown. the
most visable arabs in america are not arab american actors, they’re arabs from
arab countries like saudi arabia and egypt. examples would be like
prince bandar, osama done rotten, anwar sadat, and hosni mubarak. arafat too.
your arguments were weak, lirelou.