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	<title>Comments on: Beware the Gando Card!</title>
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	<link>http://www.rjkoehler.com/2004/09/09/beware-the-gando-card/</link>
	<description>Korea... in Blog Format</description>
	<pubDate>Thu,  4 Dec 2008 20:22:31 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: fr slts</title>
		<link>http://www.rjkoehler.com/2004/09/09/beware-the-gando-card/#comment-6347</link>
		<dc:creator>fr slts</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 19 Apr 2005 22:40:54 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>You can also check some relevant pages dedicated to rltt 
...
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You can also check some relevant pages dedicated to rltt<br />
&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: bang gang orgy sex</title>
		<link>http://www.rjkoehler.com/2004/09/09/beware-the-gando-card/#comment-6346</link>
		<dc:creator>bang gang orgy sex</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 10 Mar 2005 13:19:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://rjkoehler.com/?p=1076#comment-6346</guid>
		<description>Are you really sure about that?  I don't think so...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Are you really sure about that?  I don&#8217;t think so&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: yen jun</title>
		<link>http://www.rjkoehler.com/2004/09/09/beware-the-gando-card/#comment-6345</link>
		<dc:creator>yen jun</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 15 Sep 2004 22:59:33 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Kimbob:

Sorry, but I think it's South Korea that has the most to fear, and lose, from reunification, in the near future anyway.

Just look at Germany - still counting the cost of re-unification with the East. Unemployment remains high, domestic demand slack - though, luckily, exports are strong.

ROK may be an Asian Tiger, but is not the same league as Germany. Can ROK pay the bills of Korean re-construction, without compromising its sovereign pride? (ie, without American, or worse, Japanese aid?)

Politicians may score brownie points with Sunshine policy, or re-uniting sobbing siblings, or talk about dual citizenship. But it's just playing to the gallery. When it comes to the crunch about re-unification, can ROK really put its money where its mouth is?

Does China fear      strong, resurgent Korea? No, it never has. What China fears - or perhaps dislikes - are American troops up close and personal (again!) across the Yalu. 

 On the other hand, this may work to Beijing's advantage, as it might rally the country/party against the enemy on the doorstep.   

Does America want Korean re-unification? Maybe. American hardliners would love a listening post right on China's rump, to be a thorn in their side.

But America's current Public enemy No 1 is global terrorism, not China.    Both are allied (sort of) in this war.                                                                                                          US thinking (for the moment, anyway)is to engage,not confront, China. 

    Do USA and PRC want to go to war again over Korea? No.

    Conclusion: they don't care, or lose, that much. SK stands to lose most.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Kimbob:</p>
<p>Sorry, but I think it&#8217;s South Korea that has the most to fear, and lose, from reunification, in the near future anyway.</p>
<p>Just look at Germany - still counting the cost of re-unification with the East. Unemployment remains high, domestic demand slack - though, luckily, exports are strong.</p>
<p>ROK may be an Asian Tiger, but is not the same league as Germany. Can ROK pay the bills of Korean re-construction, without compromising its sovereign pride? (ie, without American, or worse, Japanese aid?)</p>
<p>Politicians may score brownie points with Sunshine policy, or re-uniting sobbing siblings, or talk about dual citizenship. But it&#8217;s just playing to the gallery. When it comes to the crunch about re-unification, can ROK really put its money where its mouth is?</p>
<p>Does China fear      strong, resurgent Korea? No, it never has. What China fears - or perhaps dislikes - are American troops up close and personal (again!) across the Yalu. </p>
<p> On the other hand, this may work to Beijing&#8217;s advantage, as it might rally the country/party against the enemy on the doorstep.   </p>
<p>Does America want Korean re-unification? Maybe. American hardliners would love a listening post right on China&#8217;s rump, to be a thorn in their side.</p>
<p>But America&#8217;s current Public enemy No 1 is global terrorism, not China.    Both are allied (sort of) in this war.                                                                                                          US thinking (for the moment, anyway)is to engage,not confront, China. </p>
<p>    Do USA and PRC want to go to war again over Korea? No.</p>
<p>    Conclusion: they don&#8217;t care, or lose, that much. SK stands to lose most.</p>
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		<title>By: Eric</title>
		<link>http://www.rjkoehler.com/2004/09/09/beware-the-gando-card/#comment-6344</link>
		<dc:creator>Eric</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 15 Sep 2004 03:23:44 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Can you point out the ghost towns in the Northeast to me I would very much like to visit them?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Can you point out the ghost towns in the Northeast to me I would very much like to visit them?</p>
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		<title>By: Jing</title>
		<link>http://www.rjkoehler.com/2004/09/09/beware-the-gando-card/#comment-6343</link>
		<dc:creator>Jing</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 14 Sep 2004 13:45:34 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>I think you are being a little unrealistic Kimbob. The popularity of Korean pop culture at present has little political impact whatsoever in decision making by Beijing nor social trends in China at large. Granting ethnic Koreans in China dual citizenship is as pointless as shrilly demanding Gando back. The PRC simply does not recognize dual citizenship and for all intents and purposes, ethnic Koreans in China will not be treated any different than any other Chinese nationals. As for ethnic Koreans leaving China for South Korea en mass, I'm afraid this is simply not true unless the RoK has dramatically changed its visa policies on par with Israel. It is tortuously dificult for PRC citizens to get entry visas to the RoK as Eric mentioned and I would wager that things wouldn't change all that much even if their grandfather happened to be Korean. Roh may talk big about granting ethnic Koreans living in China citizenship, but when push comes to shove, I doubt he would allow a million of them to resettle in the South. Even if this mass exodus you describe were true (which I believe it is not and merely wishful thinking) Northeast China is very much overcrowded with well over 200 million residents residing in what was Manchuria. If a couple thousand Koreans emigrate out of Gando, there are plenty willing to take their land.

If you really believe that the so-called "Korean wave" is somehow or can somehow be used to "Koreanize" manchuria in order to support Korean claims on territory, I believe you are well off the mark.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think you are being a little unrealistic Kimbob. The popularity of Korean pop culture at present has little political impact whatsoever in decision making by Beijing nor social trends in China at large. Granting ethnic Koreans in China dual citizenship is as pointless as shrilly demanding Gando back. The PRC simply does not recognize dual citizenship and for all intents and purposes, ethnic Koreans in China will not be treated any different than any other Chinese nationals. As for ethnic Koreans leaving China for South Korea en mass, I&#8217;m afraid this is simply not true unless the RoK has dramatically changed its visa policies on par with Israel. It is tortuously dificult for PRC citizens to get entry visas to the RoK as Eric mentioned and I would wager that things wouldn&#8217;t change all that much even if their grandfather happened to be Korean. Roh may talk big about granting ethnic Koreans living in China citizenship, but when push comes to shove, I doubt he would allow a million of them to resettle in the South. Even if this mass exodus you describe were true (which I believe it is not and merely wishful thinking) Northeast China is very much overcrowded with well over 200 million residents residing in what was Manchuria. If a couple thousand Koreans emigrate out of Gando, there are plenty willing to take their land.</p>
<p>If you really believe that the so-called &#8220;Korean wave&#8221; is somehow or can somehow be used to &#8220;Koreanize&#8221; manchuria in order to support Korean claims on territory, I believe you are well off the mark.</p>
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		<title>By: kimbob</title>
		<link>http://www.rjkoehler.com/2004/09/09/beware-the-gando-card/#comment-6342</link>
		<dc:creator>kimbob</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 14 Sep 2004 07:53:11 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>There's a better way for Korea to reclaim Gando as Korean territory, than simply claiming it as "Korean" and shouting "we want it back". (not that that's necessarily what South Korea is shouting). That will only antagonize China unnecessarily while accomplishing very little. And I don't think despite a very valid legal case that Korea has, international courts will not start a border war in North East asia by ruling that Gando is a Korean territory.

So what's Korea's option? I think the best option is to stay silent on this and conquer the former Manchurian territory which is now a home to a million ethnic Koreans, through culture and trade. South Korea should exert and redouble the effort to Koreanize the Korean etnic minority enclaves, even give these ethnic Korans, duel citizenships. You can see that the Koreanization of north east China is already happening when you go there and realize how popular South Korean pop culture, food, and travel destinations are. Many ethnic Koreans want to leave and are leaving China, for South Korea - turning entire villages into ghost villages.

I think this is one of the reasons why Chinese government is very nervous about Korean dispora in northern China, and ramifications of Korean reunification. China definitely does not want a Korean reunification - they would be the biggest losers.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>There&#8217;s a better way for Korea to reclaim Gando as Korean territory, than simply claiming it as &#8220;Korean&#8221; and shouting &#8220;we want it back&#8221;. (not that that&#8217;s necessarily what South Korea is shouting). That will only antagonize China unnecessarily while accomplishing very little. And I don&#8217;t think despite a very valid legal case that Korea has, international courts will not start a border war in North East asia by ruling that Gando is a Korean territory.</p>
<p>So what&#8217;s Korea&#8217;s option? I think the best option is to stay silent on this and conquer the former Manchurian territory which is now a home to a million ethnic Koreans, through culture and trade. South Korea should exert and redouble the effort to Koreanize the Korean etnic minority enclaves, even give these ethnic Korans, duel citizenships. You can see that the Koreanization of north east China is already happening when you go there and realize how popular South Korean pop culture, food, and travel destinations are. Many ethnic Koreans want to leave and are leaving China, for South Korea - turning entire villages into ghost villages.</p>
<p>I think this is one of the reasons why Chinese government is very nervous about Korean dispora in northern China, and ramifications of Korean reunification. China definitely does not want a Korean reunification - they would be the biggest losers.</p>
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		<title>By: yen jun</title>
		<link>http://www.rjkoehler.com/2004/09/09/beware-the-gando-card/#comment-6341</link>
		<dc:creator>yen jun</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 13 Sep 2004 07:45:53 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Marmot:

I looked at your map a few times. I don't know if Vladivostok in teh Russian Maritime Province is inside there.

If myhistory is correct, this part of Russia was ceded by China in an ``unequal treaty'' - tho it was peacefully negotiated.

Do those ROK politicians want to lay claim to that patch as theirs was well? After all, this was Tungusic/Khitan/Manchurian grassland.  Up to the late 19th century, the Manchurian court believed that the Koreans were speaking a Manchurian ``dialect''.

If the ROK politicians want it, I don't suggest they speak to Putin at this point, however. A bear with a sore tooth is a nasty one.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Marmot:</p>
<p>I looked at your map a few times. I don&#8217;t know if Vladivostok in teh Russian Maritime Province is inside there.</p>
<p>If myhistory is correct, this part of Russia was ceded by China in an &#8220;unequal treaty&#8221; - tho it was peacefully negotiated.</p>
<p>Do those ROK politicians want to lay claim to that patch as theirs was well? After all, this was Tungusic/Khitan/Manchurian grassland.  Up to the late 19th century, the Manchurian court believed that the Koreans were speaking a Manchurian &#8220;dialect&#8221;.</p>
<p>If the ROK politicians want it, I don&#8217;t suggest they speak to Putin at this point, however. A bear with a sore tooth is a nasty one.</p>
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		<title>By: Eric</title>
		<link>http://www.rjkoehler.com/2004/09/09/beware-the-gando-card/#comment-6340</link>
		<dc:creator>Eric</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 13 Sep 2004 03:54:25 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Kit it is not that the Chinese Government won't let scholars out of China to go study in Korea. For a Chinese citizen to get a visa to enter South Korea is the problem. This past summer I tried to get a visa for my wife to accompany me to Seoul while I worked. Initially I was told that we would need to come up with approximately US$10,000 or a deed to a house to deposit to ensure that she would not remain in Korea. Some relatives offered to sign their home over to us to help us. Unfortunately when my wife returned to the embassy she was then told that she needed to have US$5,000 to take with her to prove she wouldn't be destitute. It didn't matter to them that her husband was already living in Korea and had a job there. In the end my wife never got to visit Korea.

This summer you may have seen the Asian Art show that was at COEX. A good friend of mine organized it. She was very disheartened that none of the Chinese artists that were going to have their work shown would be in attendance. They also could not get visas. 

This is not just a problem for Chinese people in South Korea. I know first hand that it is getting incredibly hard for Chinese citizens to get into America also. The reason is that 10 years and more ago most Chinese citizens that left China did not return. That is not true any longer. The governments of the world are just a little slow adapting to change.

By the way don't apologize about your English ability. I thought your post was great.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Kit it is not that the Chinese Government won&#8217;t let scholars out of China to go study in Korea. For a Chinese citizen to get a visa to enter South Korea is the problem. This past summer I tried to get a visa for my wife to accompany me to Seoul while I worked. Initially I was told that we would need to come up with approximately US$10,000 or a deed to a house to deposit to ensure that she would not remain in Korea. Some relatives offered to sign their home over to us to help us. Unfortunately when my wife returned to the embassy she was then told that she needed to have US$5,000 to take with her to prove she wouldn&#8217;t be destitute. It didn&#8217;t matter to them that her husband was already living in Korea and had a job there. In the end my wife never got to visit Korea.</p>
<p>This summer you may have seen the Asian Art show that was at COEX. A good friend of mine organized it. She was very disheartened that none of the Chinese artists that were going to have their work shown would be in attendance. They also could not get visas. </p>
<p>This is not just a problem for Chinese people in South Korea. I know first hand that it is getting incredibly hard for Chinese citizens to get into America also. The reason is that 10 years and more ago most Chinese citizens that left China did not return. That is not true any longer. The governments of the world are just a little slow adapting to change.</p>
<p>By the way don&#8217;t apologize about your English ability. I thought your post was great.</p>
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		<title>By: WJK</title>
		<link>http://www.rjkoehler.com/2004/09/09/beware-the-gando-card/#comment-6339</link>
		<dc:creator>WJK</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 10 Sep 2004 18:24:11 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>I'm a Roh critic, but I think Roh was right to suggest that Gando Koreans became dual citizens of China and South Korea.  Because I think letting them have South Korean citizenship will ease the pain and hardship of working in South Korea as Chosun Joks.  Of course there is a possibility of most of them settling in South Korea for good.  Which isn't really good for South Korea.  But, then again, I don't think Roh thinks too hard.  Action first, think later.

I met a fellow who says he was UK and US dual citizen.  He was born in UK, but his parents are US citizens.  Granted, the living standards are similar in these 2, but it would be in the good interest of the Gando Koreans to become dual citizens.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m a Roh critic, but I think Roh was right to suggest that Gando Koreans became dual citizens of China and South Korea.  Because I think letting them have South Korean citizenship will ease the pain and hardship of working in South Korea as Chosun Joks.  Of course there is a possibility of most of them settling in South Korea for good.  Which isn&#8217;t really good for South Korea.  But, then again, I don&#8217;t think Roh thinks too hard.  Action first, think later.</p>
<p>I met a fellow who says he was UK and US dual citizen.  He was born in UK, but his parents are US citizens.  Granted, the living standards are similar in these 2, but it would be in the good interest of the Gando Koreans to become dual citizens.</p>
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		<title>By: WJK</title>
		<link>http://www.rjkoehler.com/2004/09/09/beware-the-gando-card/#comment-6338</link>
		<dc:creator>WJK</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 10 Sep 2004 18:17:53 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Kit, good post.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Kit, good post.</p>
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